Through Brush?

[Bullkllr]

An encounter with a big blacktail yesterday got me wondering about the effect of brush on a bullet. My rule has always been any brush in my sight line = no shot. So I've never tried. Anyone have any success through brush?(realizing it obviously depends on how much is in the way)

Here's the story.
I had been out since daylight. No deer seen. Got back to the trail to the rig, no more than 50 yds. I had stashed my keys under a log. As I bent down to retrieve the keys, a buck springs out of the brush in front of me. Threw my gun (muzzle loader) up, but no hope for a shot. Buck disappeared with another deer in the brush to my right. This was a big'un. Tall wide 3x3 with way more antler than any blackie I've taken.
I circled downwind of where he went and put on a sneak. Sure enough about 50yds infront of me I see antlers. I had to get closer to get any shooting lane at all. Got to within 30yards; took awhile as it was still frozen but dry and very crunchy.

Anyway I watched this buck and the spike he was with for about 15 min. at close range. I finally crept to what was almost a shooting lane. There was one small bush near me, and another(bigger) nearer the buck. I was crouched, and put my gun on him in case he moved a couple feet to the left where I had a good lane. He stayed put. I figured if I at least got past the small bush my odds would be better. So I eased up another 10 feet or so. My gun was on him. He was facing straight away. More minutes pass, and he turns right at me.
He got nervous and moved finally. For a split second he was broadside, but with the screen of brush in front of him I didn't pull the trigger as he turned and disappeared.

Even though the range was around 20 yards and I was loaded with a 420 grain Maxiball, I just didn't feel confident. And in case you're wondering, yes, this buck is now haunting my dreams!

[ICEMAN]

I was under the impression that brush that is very close to the target, cannot deflect the shot but by a few degrees. Brush closer to you can deflect the shot alot.  If you clearly have a defined target with a few twigs between you and your kill zone, and the twigs are really close to the game, I would take the shot. (I am sure I may get some crud for stating that...)

Anyway, that is what I would do.

We actually shot at targets thru brush once. Put paper targets behind bushes, not too thick, shots barely deflected an inch off point of aim, not much more...

[Mike450r]

Brush can do very little to bullet flight and it can do a lot.  The main thing it can do besides alter the path is slow momentum and change bullet shape enough to cause a non fatal wound.  I will not shoot through small alder branches without a good lane of about a square foot give or take but I have shot through fern and salal effectively.

[tlbradford]

I think you handled it perfectly.  At 20 yards I would try a kill shot at vitals that are not blocked (ie head, neck) rather than shooting through brush.  As far as the effect on the bullet at that range and that close to the deer, I am unsure.

[arrowflinger]

If you are going to do that make sure that it isn't your buddy, a horse or your kid. To many people are killed by shooting through the brush..........................Verify what you are shooting at. Other then that I would pass as you did.

[coonhound]

You did the right thing, it would be haunting you worse if you hit him and lost him.

Good Choice, we need more like you,
Coon

[Houndhunter]

glad i found this

this is the shots i were talking about when i said "take the shot you have" and alota guys freaked. if ya got a 20yrd shot broadside, a lil brush aint guna hurt a thing, IMO

[Mike450r]

I guess I should also clarify what I had said in my earlier post regarding ferns and salal.  In these cases I had visual identification of a buck where the heart/lung area was obsucured by some fern or salal which was no more than a foot in front of the deer. 

[Chesapeake]

I used to think a bullet would "buck the brush" if it was close to the animal.

A few years back I took a shot at a raghorn that was maybe 30 yards away and standing right behind a 10 foot tall fir tree. I aimed to just pass the bullet through the soft ends of the limbs on one side and into his shoulder. My 375 grain muzzle loader bullet hit that elk in the rear hip. I finaly got him after several miles in deep snow.

I've had a few other instances where an unseen limb or twig has caused clean misses with muzzleloader size (300 grain plus) bullets and less than 50 yard ranges.

Now my policy is "Clear shot, or NO shot!"

[boneaddict]

Chesepeake's advice of clear shot or no shot is way better advice than hound is giving you.  Sorry hound, but you're going to take flack over this one too. 

[jackelope]

Sorry hound, but you're going to take flack over this one too.   

yep..i gave you flack on that one, and i'm giving it on this one too...it just ain't worth the risk.

[Antlershed]

I was watching hunting shows on VS the other day and I couldn't believe I saw a guy shoot through brush at a Muley. His shot was fatal, but its one I would never take.

[Chesapeake]

Here is a link with a little smidget of info on tests of a bullets abillity to "Buck Brush".

http://www.chuckhawks.com/woods_rifles.htm

[Alchase]

I believe the "brush gun" pertaining to caliber is a myth. There have been tons of ballistic tests that prove there is no way to determine how a deflection is going to effect a bullet in a given situation. It does not matter if you are shooting a .45-70 or a .223 there is no way you can determine the actual deflection. I sure as heck would not not to bet my own or someone Else's life on what some people "believe" to be a better brush caliber.
A deflection is changing the path of the bullet from it's original course, shooting through brush there is no way to calculate that.
When I was about 12 years old I had a conversation about this subject with my uncle who use to be a PH in Africa for years. He started laughing at me when I told him I wanted to by a lever action 30-30 for a brush gun. He said his customer had his .416 double rifle have two deflections while trying to put down a wounded Buff in tall grass. Neither of the bullets hit the target at 20 yards. He said they were really lucky his backup hit vital during the charge or he would be dead. He looked me straight in the eye and asked
 "is it really worth your life or possibly someone Else's life to shoot through brush?"
Now every time I read an article in hunting magazines about the best brush guns I remember his words.

[LongTatLaw]

I gotta go the other way boys. I fully agree that you dont shoot unless you are 110% sure of the target and the backstop area behind it.

After that, I have taken dozens of shots where the animal is right beside the bush..meaning shrub not 10 ft fir tree.

If the bush is more than 5 feet from the animal I wont take the shot.

Ive pushed dozens of bullets through brush into deer and boar. Id say its impossible to tell how much deflection will occur but caliber is not irrelevant as some have suggested.

Given whatever obstruction... a big heavy bullet wont deflect to the same degree as a light bullet. As in, a muzzle loader, 12 gauge slug, or 45-70 hitting a branch will deflect less than a 223 would shot from the same angle into the same branch.

However, its hard to gauge how much deflection you will get... In my experience the shift is marginal when the brush is small and very near the animal.

My concern wouldnt be whether or not the bullet is gonna kill the animal but rather how well you can identify the target and the area behind it.

From what ur describing...it sounds like there my have been a field pic of me with that buck but your never ever wrong for leaning in the direction of caution!