Little vent/rant bowhunting public land for Elk

[MADMAX]

Hi all
I have been hunting both bow and rifle and blackpowder for almost 35 years (since I was 14), I most recently had a situation that I'd like to do a quick rant on,
To set the stage
I have been bowhunting elk all season, as in the last bunch of years you always run in to your share of boneheads as well as some really excellent guys, you know, the guys you may run into every year up in the woods, guys that will help if your by yourself and get one down
So its the end of season for westside yesterday.

It will be a memory that lasts for years.

I have had two younger guys I have been teaching to bowhunt elk,
I am not trying to be holier than thou but I am trying to instill some ethics/techniques on marginal shot attempts (targets vs critters, they are great shots on the range), working with other hunters to make a plan, when jumping a band of elk, practicing good land-owner relations, etc.
So here I am with my 21 yr old ,,almost son in law,, up in the winston unit, so far had a great weekend going, we  jumped 2 groups on friday up in the 200 line Port Blakely area, decide we will hunt the last day down in MT ST Helens tree farm 1100 line area, spotted a herd a mile  or so away glassing, went looking for the road to the clearcut they were feeding in to put a stalk on ,,,,,,,,take a turn down on a road in the truck  and there are 4 bulls busting off through the timber and cutting right along the road down hill from us in the reprod about 25-30 yds away and below, the kid did great, we bailed out of the truck , got on them and moved along side them stopping drawing and waiting as they were acting like wanted to move upslope , never got a clear shot,,, head, neck only, he stays at it and they move off across the clearcut, I go get the truck to go down and try to cut them off on a different skid road towards where they are heading, the kid is still on them and they are now about a 1/2 mile from where we started when we jumped them, now here is the vent/rant.
A dark green late model toyota with canopy on it and 2 guys are on the shoulder in a wide spot they see me coming in my truck, the guy sitting on the tailgate almost gets thrown/bounced off as the driver hauls butt and cuts me off to rush at the bulls down the skid road I am heading to and the kid with me is on behind these bulls, now I understand public land hunting and do not really blame them for cutting off another truck, but,,,,,,the kid that is with me is about 75 yds behind and to the right of the bulls on a skid road in the open, the toyota with these 2 genuis's in it almost runs him over to get ahead of him and rush at those bulls and yes there was no missing that he was there , it was a pretty wide open cut at that point just grass and some slash, needless to say I am totally PO'd and let the one guy that was standing there when I walked up know about it.
The bulls off course were blown across the river into the Margaret unit.
To those guys in that dark green toyota if your reading this try and take a course in hunter ethics and try and get along with others in the field a little more, you showed the worse behavior for archery hunters I've seen in years., we would have gladly teamed with you to stalk those animals !

There now
It does feel good to write it down and its much cheaper (bail) than kicking somebody's @ss for being stupid.

I'm sure I'll get opinions both ways but now my rant is over.
Thanks

[funkster]

I had something similar to that happen this year also. My dad and I were parked well ahead of this clear cut and glassing for about 30 min to find a herd of 18. As we were making are plan of attack this white pickup truck pulls up behind us and he looks at us on the ground glassing this herd of elk. He turns his truck around and leaves,I was thinking,man that was nice of him.  We worked up and around the herd to get the wind in are favour. Just as we get on top of the herd (about 40 yards) after about 2.5 hours into the stalk the same white pickup truck comes haul in ass into the middle of the clear cut on a lower road and jumps out and starts to go straight up into the clear cut after the elk. The elk busted on a full run into some thick timbers never to be seen again. I was mad for about an hour then I calmed down and said to myself that is public land hunting now a days. I attribute this to dad's or someone in a father figure role not passing down good hunting ethics like you are trying to do.

[MADMAX]

I've seen it happen before more than once and agree it's public land hunting and that its anybody's ballgame, the thing that fired me up was the pickup accelerating to beat the kid running up the road and then passing him to get on the elk, total BS.
I'm over it now, someday those two young guys in the Toyota may learn a little respect I'm sure, what goes around comes around

[DOUBLELUNG]

Having formerly lived in the Winston unit, I can only conclude that if you want to avoid A-holes, you'd better get out of sight of any driveable road, and hunt elk that are out of sight too.  Not claiming the moral high ground about using your rig to hunt, just from what I saw regarding the road density of POS's driving, odds are you'll rarely be far from one or more of those ethic-less, aggressive, ultracompetitive, selfish SOBs.  My 12-mile daily commute on paved secondary roads in the unit, during late season, provided enough observations of unsavory, classless would-be game killers (they sure aren't worthy of the name hunters!), to turn any nonhunter into an anti.

Thanks for the rant opportunity, MADMAX.

[Opportunist]

I spend more of my hunting time trying to avoid this kind of *censored*, but I still run into it with every weapon and state I hunt in. The only time I have any luck at avoiding it, is when I draw a tag with few tag numbers or hunt back in the wilderness/road closure. But not always even then. I live in the Coweeman unit and I've got elk literally in my front and back yard. But I've got so burned out on the *censored* hunters in my area that I don't hunt around home very often. I feel your pain and I hope you feel better after your rant.

[MADMAX]

Thanks for the replies, I agree I'm getting the mountains bikes for next year, then all I have to worry about is my truck getting broken into at the gates.

[robodad]

I too hunted the Winston this year and have to say that I am quite disappointed in the way things went. I admit I was hunting with BP during the late archery season (draw tag) and we happened upon a small herd of elk while driving and stopped to shoot (50-60yds) and another truck with bow hunters pulled up and they got out and ran between us right in front of my buddy who was taking aim at the elk and pushed them into the doghair and beyond.

I think that putting two user groups in an area at the same time is dangerous and should never happen.

The area was open to general archery and there were 60 BP cow permits as well at the same time. I know that if I were a bow hunter in there I would be pissed to see a fellow with a smokepole tromping through the area I am hunting.

I knew that there was no use in confronting these bow hunters for what they did but had I been someone else things could have been out of control in a hurry.

I was not able to fill my tag as I just didn't have the time to hunt like I wanted and the pressure in there is extreme.

Thank You MADMAX for passing on some of your knowledge to these younger folks, if more of us would do that there would be far less boneheads !!!


Allen...

[MADMAX]

We felt the same about the user groups mixing thats why we do not hunt mossyrock,
Weyerhauser and the state want cows reduced in Winston, then they lock most of it all week, making it crowded where you can get in and causing folks to hunt differently than they have in years prior,. I myself love to hunt right from camp on foot or bike, but no camping in the tree farm, tried Lewis river liked it can camp in the woods, but no late hunt, hunted eastside for years, love it, but no branched bulls and tough hunting in late season, chains on chains off
Maybe will go to Idaho next year

[robb92]

Had something similar happen this year here in Virginia, opening day of modern firearm I was out in the woods with my daughter on a WMA by my house and as we were getting ready to walk into the woods the hunt club that borders the WMA ran their dogs throught the WMA and scared all the deer off, the guys who own the hunt club had a line of shooters ready on the border and it sounded like a war zone and my daughter was ticked because she doesn't think running dogs on deer is very ethical and considered fair chase, and she is only 7, I agree with her running dogs on bear and cougar is different that dogs. 

[BlackTail]

MADMAX,

I feel your pain.  Things like that are a daily occurrence during the modern firearm season.  In fact, when I am deciding on where to go hunt for the day it has almost nothing to do with where I think I might see elk and instead, is almost entirely based on where I think I won't see people.

I think elk season can change a person too.  I've seen careful, thoughtful, sane people do some of the most careless, thoughtless, insane things when you put an elk in front of them.

[MADMAX]

I remember rifle hunting down there (Winston) in the mid 90's for only one year, I wonder how bad it is now.
Any comments ?

[ICEMAN]

The portions of Winston that we hunted in the mid 90's, have subsequently been logged. Large massive deciduous areas which held elk, gone. Also, road changes, and gates have altered the area. Still lots of elk around there, we filled a cow tag there in 30minutes....

[coonhound]

I compare the Winston unit to what we call Combat Fishing at the Barrier dam on the Cowlitz.

That's why I now hunt the backcountry wilderness areas exclusively, the problem is, I am not getting any younger and will someday have to make the tough decision.

Coon

[elkaholic]

i woulda kicked there ass.....
You set a good example bye not to your new hunters. Very good lettimg them know about it. Pretty pothetic, isnt it.  Early this year I came up on a hunter outside his rig an dgun up. I shut down my truck and waited. he waived at me a few more minutes. I snuck up to him and he whispered he was watching this nice mulie but not the monster he had seen.  I asked him if I could take the mulie since I never have had the oppurtunity yet. He was all for it. Except I had to sneak back up the road 30 yarsd and back. Just missed an oppurtunity as he fed into the timber but what a guy. There are still some good guys out there willing to help and share.

[MADMAX]

Yes coon I agree it is somehwat like blue creek isn't it ?
I'll try and work animals also with the other guys out there everytime and I also will wait if a guy is on a stalk, I agree with the backcountry hunting, I really liked Lewis river unit but the guys in my group really like the Winston.
Next year will be a decision on where to hunt for a new spot, we do plan on getting bikes so we can get away from the crowded areas a little more, any info on good westside areas with road closures I can scout for next archery season ?