If the East Side Went to Permit Only!!!

[colockumelk]

Alot of you have voiced your opinion that you wish that the East Side would go to permit only.  Last year I wrote a paper on this subject for a biology class.  I then posted a shorter simpler version of it on the internet.  I did the research on how many permits they could and would give out if that happened.  Basically how it would work is instead of killing hundreds of spikes each year we would kill them when they are mature bulls.  BTW for all the nay-sayers I talked to the WDFW Bio's and they said that my numbers were plus or minus 5%.  And after a few years even more permits than I listed would be given out.  The jist of it is that there would be 3.42 (on average) more branch bull permits given out in each GMU.  This means you would get drawn to hunt branch bulls 3-4 times more often than now.  Also you could still put in for cows and not use your points for bulls.  

Scroll down to see the stats I came up with if you don't want to read my paper.  Oh also notice how the WDFW copied my idea about an A tag and a B tag.  I do recommend you read the whole article before and after the stats so you can get a complete picture and idea.  

http://www.washingtonsportsmen.com/?q=node/85

[WDFW-SUX]

i think its a great idea

[luvtohnt]

The only problem I could see is that the harvest success would be higher due to limited number of individuals in the field. Also you would have to severely limit hunting during the rut, because you want your mature bulls to breed. It could be a great possibility to try it in just the colockum gmu's to see if the plan would work. I think the WDFW would not implement this plan as it would bring way to much opposition from the majority of elk hunters. Although at some point the WDFW is going to have to stand up and manage the herds better regardless of what the hunters think.

Brandon

[fishm@n]

Great idea. The problem is money and how WDFW makes up that huge shortfall in licensing fees. Are we all ready to see the tag prices triple to cover this? Are we willing to not elk hunt with our buddies who drew but we didn't? For many people (not me necessarily) elk season is about elk camp and being away from the real world for a week or so. I agree that it is better for the herds and hunting opportunities for those that draw but it is a huge change that will piss off a lot of people who look forward to going to elk camp every year.

The unique problem this state has vs. say Colorado or Oregon (both states with fairly large human populations like us) is a relatively low elk population (approx 50,000 vs 250,000 and 150,000) and general seasons across almost all GMU's. If something doesn't change the human and elk populations will continue to diverge. WDFW needs to step up.

[WDFW-SUX]

The problem is money and how WDFW makes up that huge shortfall in licensing fees

It would be nice if they cared more about elk than they do about the $$$$...

[colockumelk]

The problem is money and how WDFW makes up that huge shortfall in licensing fees

It would be nice if they cared more about elk than they do about the $$$$...

WDFW-SUX this ones for you 

The Everly Brothers - All I have to do is dream

[colockumelk]

Brandon, in this "Dream World" they would manage permit numbers based on 1. Bull to Cow Ratio 2. The most recent 3 year avg. harvest %.  

Fish, I agree that to some it's all about camping.  But people could still do that deer hunting, they could put in as a group or help their buddy out.  My little brother drew a branch bull tag and I was just as excited to be there as he was.  Plus In a group of six that puts in for both cows and bulls (two seperate point systems) even if they put in separatly I would bet that 3 or 4 of them would draw each year.  Plus for many many years in WA state it was permit only. 

Here's another HUGE benefit.  In regards to tribal hunting.

"The courts have ruled that state regulation of tribal exercise of off-reservation hunting rights on open and unclaimed land is preempted by the Stevens Treaties, except where state regulation is necessary for conservation purposes. " 

This means that they would have to go to permit only as well.  Although right now we have to get drawn to hunt branch bulls there is still a general season, so this does not count as conservation.  Permit only across the board would count as conservation. 

[WDFW-SUX]

 

[bearpaw]

Simple:
Make half the GMU's draw for all elk tags. Leave half the GMU's as is.

That's what Utah did, works great, they have some of the best elk hunting in the world and they also have areas with over the counter tags so people can go hunting/camping every year.

[WDFW-SUX]

In my mind not doing whats best for wildlife because of a loss in revenue is reprehensible and should be illegal.

[bearpaw]

sux I agree.....

FYI - In NE WA they have either sex in most areas, over counter tags, it's just criminal.

[colockumelk]

Simple:
Make half the GMU's draw for all elk tags. Leave half the GMU's as is.

That's what Utah did, works great, they have some of the best elk hunting in the world and they also have areas with over the counter tags so people can go hunting/camping every year.

You would have to do it by PMU's not GMU's.  Also it would take even longer to draw a tag that way.  Just like in Utah where it takes a SUPER long time to draw a tag in those GMU's.  My way people would still get to hunt more often than not.  I'd say on average they'd get drawn every 3 years for a branch tag and every 2-3 years for a cow permit.  I'd be willing to bet a months salary that you'd get drawn every other year.  Plus bowhunters would have OTC tags just for cow though.  

And on that note the reason that Archery guys could hunt EVERY year with OTC tags for antlerless elk is because they have a 4.5% success rate.  So if it was "permit only" 90% or more guys would get drawn every year anyways.  

[hughjorgan]

Where did you come up with 4.5%? Is that a number for all of archery, just for the east side or what? According the the latest status and trend report put out by the WDFW our success rate is double what you claim... The general season elk hunter success rate for all
weapon types in 2008 was 7.0 %. General season
success rates by weapon type were 6.2 % for modern
firearm, 9.1 % for archery, and 6.6 % for
muzzleloader.

[huntnphool]

Interesting idea, what I find intriguing is that you of all people have not accounted for increased tribal hunting this would undoubtedly create, I bet they are behind your idea 110% though since unlike us, they would be hunting ever single year, good writeup though.

[nw_bowhunter]

I'm not knocking your idea or research.....but personally for me I want to hunt. I'm not a trophy hunter, but wouldn't mind having the opportunity to hunt them on occasion. However I'm not willing to give up general season and run the risk of not being able to hunt at all depending how successful I was for drawing. This type of discussion happens a lot on the forum and not sure why so many people want permit only hunting other than for the sake of having more trophy potential. Why would you want to give up being to hunt yearly simply for more chance at a big rack? If that is the case head out of state hunt where there is more trophy opportunity.