New Hunting Regulations

[Dirtsquirt]

   :yike:I dont know how many of you have seen this but I received word last Friday and looked around and couldnt find it until this morning.  http://wdfw.wa.gov/about/regulations/2010/wsr_10-04-125.pdf  I would suggest everyone read it and let WFDW know how you feel because were about to get f#$%@d .  I havent seen anything about this until know and it appears the WDFW is only going to have one meeting on March 13 in Olympia.  Better get that letter writing campaign going again.

[colockumelk]

Dipsnort the link doesn't work.  What's it talk about.  I noticed that ALL HUNTERS can use a pistol for protection in the woods.  I knew that was gonna happen.  Our second ammendment rights guarantee that you can carry a pistol.  The WDFW no matter how powerfull they THINK they are cannot take away from our rights.  Our US Constitution guarantees that.   

[jaredpost]

Dipsnort the link doesn't work.  What's it talk about.

just delete the period at the end of the link and it will work.

[bearpaw]

What part didn't you specifically like?

I see some positive things in the proposal.

[bobcat]

We've been discussing this proposal on here for about a month now. The most significant change is in the special permit system. It can be good or bad, depending on how many points you have accumulated.

[colockumelk]

The document is huge.  Specifically which part is bad?

[bearpaw]

bobcat, that is the only big controversy I was aware of with this.

[Dirtsquirt]

the main thing i am most upset with is the changes to the muzzleloader seasons in the west klickitat, wind river, and washougal units.  They are going from either sex to 3 point or better, and also includes modern in those areas.  and i am also not pleased with the fact that they are only having one meeting for comment and if you are on their email list you are only notified a week ahead of time, oh and their one meeting is in olympia, you know the place where everyones side gets tobe heard.

[Dirtsquirt]

I frequent the board pretty regular dont post alot, hadnt seen anything about these upcoming changes.  even looked in the WDFW part of the site.  I guess I missed it.  Still not happy.

[colockumelk]

Do what I did and write a letter on here, add the email links to who it needs to go to and then ask people on here to write copy and paste your letter and send it to those email links.  That's the best way I know of.

[sako223]

Having a meeting is just a way for the WDFW to claim public input before they implement the plan.

[Dirtsquirt]

ya know i dont really say much and i try to be proactive and part of the solution, so much so that i took part in the last round of changes that they made. for the most part i thought they did a pretty good job and that it seemed as tho there were positive changes about and that WDFW was finally listening to the hunters and trying to make us feel like we are part of the process.  but this stinks of politics as usual.  i work for a government agency and i can tell u this is not how we do things.  we are here to serve the people.  all the people.

[colockumelk]

I agree I went last year and it seems like they did take into consideration our input and did take that into consideration when they finalized their plans.  GMU 101 was an example.  Giving the ML guys more GMU"s to hunt was another. 

[Curly]

One of the worst parts of the proposal is to give people their points across the board in all categories.......thus totally screwing over anyone that has few or no points.

[Atroxus]

One of the worst parts of the proposal is to give people their points across the board in all categories.......thus totally screwing over anyone that has few or no points.

Yup, this year will be my first season hunting ever. I didn't even bother applying for any special permits since it seems it would just be a waste of money for someone with no points.

[Dirtsquirt]

i have tried to get back on the WDFW site again and for some reason am unable anyone else having this problem?  I agree that giving the points accross the board is a way for someone to cream off all the good hunt choices and that doesnt helpyou should have to say one catagory or another.

[bobcat]

One of the worst parts of the proposal is to give people their points across the board in all categories.......thus totally screwing over anyone that has few or no points.

Yup, this year will be my first season hunting ever. I didn't even bother applying for any special permits since it seems it would just be a waste of money for someone with no points.

Applying for permits isn't an option yet and won't be for a couple months. With our point system you need to start applying ASAP. If you don't apply this year, your chances won't be getting any better. You should start applying just to build up your points. If you don't want to apply for any actual hunts, you can apply for just a point.

[colockumelk]

The new proposals is all about money.  This is a horrible idea.  It's now going to take just as long to draw a cow permit as it does a bull permit.   So for kids who could draw a cow tag every couple of years and get a good hunt.  Now they'll have to wait for 6.  This is why we lose more and more hunters every year.

[Atroxus]

One of the worst parts of the proposal is to give people their points across the board in all categories.......thus totally screwing over anyone that has few or no points.

Yup, this year will be my first season hunting ever. I didn't even bother applying for any special permits since it seems it would just be a waste of money for someone with no points.

Applying for permits isn't an option yet and won't be for a couple months. With our point system you need to start applying ASAP. If you don't apply this year, your chances won't be getting any better. You should start applying just to build up your points. If you don't want to apply for any actual hunts, you can apply for just a point.

Hmm, when I go to the site to purchase a hunting license there are a bunch of raffles available.(no licenses yet fo course) I just assumed those raffles were the special permits drawings. Maybe I still don't understand the drawings. I guess what I should have said though is that I don't *plan* on applying for any. It basically sounds to me like I would be spending a bunch of money every year so that 4-5 years from now I *might* have a reasonable chance of drawing a permit. I'll just buy the basic licenses and hunt the general season and hope that I can get in good enough shape to hunt deep enough in to avoid the "crowds". On the upside though, I am one less person that will be competing with you guys for draws. 

[Skyvalhunter]

I want to thank you for not applying then!!

[Bob33]

Raffles permit are different than draw permits.  Draw permits are issued in limited numbers in order to improve the hunting experience.  The best hunting opportunities are typically available to permit holders. The application period is usually mid April to mid May.  If you do not draw, you accumulate a bonus point.  Bonus points are squared: if you have five bonus points, your name goes in the drawing 25 times.  Therefore your odds of drawing a quality tag increase over time.  They do not start at 0 (in other words, you can draw with no bonus points), and they never reach 100 percent. 

If you simply want to acquire a bonus point and not apply for a specific hunt, you can do so by applying for a "ghost hunt".

Points are available by species: deer, elk, moose, goat, sheep, spring bear, and perhaps some others.  There are also "multi-season permits" for which you can accumulate bonus points.

It is generally considered a good idea to apply and accumulate bonus points, because your odds of drawing a quality tag do increase.

You can definitely have a quality hunt experience with a general tag, but it takes more effort because you need to get away from the throngs of other hunters.

[Atroxus]

Raffles permit are different than draw permits.  Draw permits are issued in limited numbers in order to improve the hunting experience.  The best hunting opportunities are typically available to permit holders. The application period is usually mid April to mid May.  If you do not draw, you accumulate a bonus point.  Bonus points are squared: if you have five bonus points, your name goes in the drawing 25 times.  Therefore your odds of drawing a quality tag increase over time.  They do not start at 0 (in other words, you can draw with no bonus points), and they never reach 100 percent. 

If you simply want to acquire a bonus point and not apply for a specific hunt, you can do so by applying for a "ghost hunt".

Points are available by species: deer, elk, moose, goat, sheep, spring bear, and perhaps some others.  There are also "multi-season permits" for which you can accumulate bonus points.

It is generally considered a good idea to apply and accumulate bonus points, because your odds of drawing a quality tag do increase.

You can definitely have a quality hunt experience with a general tag, but it takes more effort because you need to get away from the throngs of other hunters.

Ahh, thanks for explaining that. It makes a bit more sense now. I am not sure what you mean by applying for a ghost hunt though. Does that mean I could start building points without having to spend the money on applying for a drawing the regular way?

[sako223]

ghost hunt is just paying for points so you can apply them later to a dream unit.
Just as well put in for that unit as many people get drawn with 0 or 1 point.

[link]

Dosen't it cost like 4 bucks to apply for a permit hunt?

[zackmioli]

7 years in and ive still never drawn a cow tag...i have terrible luck. haha.

i like the draw system we have now. it seems to work fine, gives everyone a chance, and gives those that have been putting in longer a better chance.

[huntnphool]

7 years in and ive still never drawn a cow tag...i like the draw system we have now. it seems to work fine, gives everyone a chance

Everyone except you it seems

[WDFW Hates ME!!!]

I do not like the way this has changed. But what i am seeing is the guys making the most noise about the changes are the ones that have drawn in the last few years. The reason you have few points is because you drew a tag. Some of us have never drawn a tag.
I do not like the changes, my son will start hunting this year, he will start the point game this year and that is why i don't like it, he has little chance of drawing. But he still has a chance. Everybody has a chance, that is one of the things i like about our system, it does give those with the most points the better chance but it is still a chance, so those with few points have a chance also.
I like that they changed the late season ML in wind river, west klickitat. That herd needs help. They need to do some logging over there.

Some changes i like some i do not, but i will not listen to someones complaints that they have 1 or 2 points because they drew last year or the year before because there are people out there that have never drawn;.

[bobcat]

I do not like the way this has changed. But what i am seeing is the guys making the most noise about the changes are the ones that have drawn in the last few years. The reason you have few points is because you drew a tag. Some of us have never drawn a tag.

But it seems like a valid reason to me. The reason some people haven't drawn is because they have been putting in for the more popular bull permits. Other people apply for less popular hunts and are drawn more often.

What would be more fair is to place everyone's points in just one of the categories, and it should be the choice of each person where they want the points to go.

If they would just make that one change, I would be fine with the new proposal.

[WDFW Hates ME!!!]

I agree bobcat. I could shoot a cow every year without trying, but i have 12 points and i will be damned if i am going to use 12 points on a cow hunt...
When they are gone i will put in for co hunts ith my son. Maybe he will draw before me.

[bobcat]

So you aren't going to apply in all the possible categories?

I'm not sure what I'm going to do, but for me it's not as much of an issue as I only have 2 points. I will probably apply in the Quality, Bull, and Antlerless categories, and won't expect to draw in any of them. That is if they make the proposed changes.

[WDFW Hates ME!!!]

Oh i will probably apply in all just so i can put in partners for cow with my son. I may just put in for points in a fe catagories, still waiting to see what they finalize. I don't get to worked up about maybees... I really think this thing is a done deal and the meeting is to keep people happy, like they will feel like they had some input. I work in gov't and they do it all the time... Changes have been made and they we will have a meeting to make you feel better...

[lokidog]

I do not like the way this has changed. But what i am seeing is the guys making the most noise about the changes are the ones that have drawn in the last few years. The reason you have few points is because you drew a tag. Some of us have never drawn a tag.
I do not like the changes, my son will start hunting this year, he will start the point game this year and that is why i don't like it, he has little chance of drawing. But he still has a chance. Everybody has a chance, that is one of the things i like about our system, it does give those with the most points the better chance but it is still a chance, so those with few points have a chance also.
I like that they changed the late season ML in wind river, west klickitat. That herd needs help. They need to do some logging over there.

Some changes i like some i do not, but i will not listen to someones complaints that they have 1 or 2 points because they drew last year or the year before because there are people out there that have never drawn;.

I am bitchin about it!  And yes, I drew for deer last year, but you know why?  Because I chose to go the route of a bonus deer tag in my neighborhood (for our little island deer), not because I drew a coveted "trophy" tag.  When the bonus tags first came out, they did not take your trophy app points away, they have now for the last two years. 

If a person has a bunch of points because they have chosen to apply for difficult hunts, that is fine, but they should have to pick ONE category to transfer those points to.  Why should it now be 10X harder for me to draw my bonus tag?

I do have a bunch of elk points.  I would be more than happy to have to pick ONE category to transfer those points to.      

[mkcj]

I would like to see more youth antlerless elk tags instead of giving them all to "Master hunters" 

[Dirtsquirt]

Its funny how u feel as tho WDFW hates u, yet u think its great that they change my season that has been changed and changed over the past ten years.  First we lost half our season in the wind river and west klickitat, then they took our deer season out of the west klick, then we got an early hunt that we didnt want, now they are proposing changing from either sex to 3 point or better and cutting the season in the washougal in half.  This is BS, and the points system is going to be screwed up for a few years until everyone uses up all their points in every category and everyone is down to zero, but then u can tip the scales in your favor by applying for everything to build up points.  I personally dont have a bunch of disposable income to throw at hunts i dont even want to build up my points quicker.  Like I said before I thought the WDFW had really took a turn for the better by including our group in the decision making process the last time but this stinks of old time politics and shows how poorly the state has been run the last six years.

[WDFW Hates ME!!!]

Dirt i am not attacking you. I think they should do hat is best for herd health, and hat is best for the herd in the wind river, washougal, west klickitat is to match the rest of SW washington. I also hunt over there and have seen what a zoo it has become over there. e ere over there in the snow last year and saw a total of 6 elk tracks. We used to spend weeks over there not any more. I found other more productive places to hunt.
My moniker on this website is a joke, 3 years ago when the department had the snafu with the draws and had to redraw a few times i was drawn and then after all the redraws i was undrawn, i have never been drawn before so i just figure they must hate me, ya see, just a joke.
I don't have a bunch of disposable income either, but i make do with what i have.
I am a Muzzle loader and feel like we muzzle loaders have been screwed by the wdfw

[Dirtsquirt]

Im not concerened about you attacking my position on the issue.  I believe good debate creates positive change.  What my problem is, is that you seem to think that changing those areas to something different is a good idea.  You said that you only saw 6 sets of tracks, I hunted that area also and have haunted that area for the past fifteen years when I switched over to a smoke pole.  There were plenty of tracks, even missed my chance at a cow standing in the road.  As far as the zoo, I agree, and after the chages to the length of the season it seemed to help.  But changing to 3 point of better is a bad idea, the elk herds here before were migratory and would come down once the snow drove them out of the higher elevations.  With no logging of the GP, now these herds have moved in permanently and have run out the deer because of lack of food to sustain both species.  I have lived in Carson most of my life, grew up here and raised my family here.  My opinion of the WDFW is they are a bunch of people from King County, Peirce County, and the other coutnties around Seattle/Tacoma area that really dont have a vested interest in the hunter other than the money the group provides to a state that is spend happy and needs that money to bail them out of their poorly manged dilema.  And as foar as your tag situation I have drawn one tag in my life and ended up eating it.

[colockumelk]

I would like to see more youth antlerless elk tags instead of giving them all to "Master hunters" 

Yeah I'd rather see some youths or disabled shoot some problem cows around the hay fields here in Ellensburg than some "Master Hunters"  if they are so masterfull then why do they need to hunt in a hay fields.  Plus they can shoot two cows.  How about giving our kids a chance to get something.  THey don't even give out cow permits in the Colockum anymore.  But the "Master Hunters" can shoot two cows.  Tell me that isn't political BS.

[Dirtsquirt]

Its not political BS , its all about money.  After reading the updated document from March 5, i realized that the WDFW is after as much money as it can get out of all of us.  They changed the units I hunt in for all hunters not just muzzle stuffers, they got archery, and modern also.  But for a few dollars more u can put in for cow permits in those areas, they are going to give out a total of 300 cow permits in those areas during the respective seasons.  Accept for archery and I dont think they hunted those units anyway.  So if they were trying to enhance the herds why would they give out five times the number of permits for cows than are being killed in a typical year?  "MONEY" thats why.  You can use the go hunt portion of the WDFW website to review the harvest reports for for each GMU and see exactly what Im talking about.  The WDFW is not concerned one bit about wildlife management, just where their going to their next dime.  I guess I should have figured we would see something drastic like this when the people working for the WDFW thought the governor was going to start cutting back and they could eventually be without a job.  HMMMMMM lets see how we can increase revenue? HMMMMMM.

[rosscrazyelk]

So For some reason I cannot pull up the link. can you please explain on how they changed the point system again?

[bobcat]

Try this:

http://wdfw.wa.gov/about/regulations/2010/wsr_10-04-125_revisions.pdf

[luvtohnt]

Yeah I'd rather see some youths or disabled shoot some problem cows around the hay fields here in Ellensburg than some "Master Hunters"  if they are so masterfull then why do they need to hunt in a hay fields.  Plus they can shoot two cows.  How about giving our kids a chance to get something.  THey don't even give out cow permits in the Colockum anymore.  But the "Master Hunters" can shoot two cows.  Tell me that isn't political BS.

Youth hunters would not be successful enough with muzzelloaders or archery in 3911. After all it is mostly a firearm restriction zone, hence the need for master hunters. Not all of them shoot two elk also. I have had opportunities to kill a cow in 3911, but I didn't because they weren't bothering the property owner.

Brandon

[rosscrazyelk]

O.K so I think I read far enough. You mean to tell me that for elk and deer I only get two choices now? Seriously? Please tell me I read this wrong. What is the purpose of this? I have 14 points and I cant get drawn with four choices what are the chances I get drawn with just two

[rackattack]

O.K so I think I read far enough. You mean to tell me that for elk and deer I only get two choices now? Seriously? Please tell me I read this wrong. What is the purpose of this? I have 14 points and I cant get drawn with four choices what are the chances I get drawn with just two

Actually, it might surprise you on getting drawn.  I have a feeling there is going to be some pretty good hunts that are a lot easier to draw now.  I'm sure a few like the desert and entiat hunts will still be tough, but if the majority put those down as one or two then other hunts will be better odds.   I actually like the two choice system myself.

As for the elk hunts in wind river, west klick, and washougal, I think these changes were needed years ago.  Yeah, it might suck for a few years, but those herds will recover and grow quite well now that they are being managed for elk and your opportunities will increase in the future.