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[bobcat]

It was written: "This may have been talked about at a meeting but how many people actually have time to go to those meetings? They're usually on a Friday and could be anywhere in the state."
The meeting I went to was on a week night around 6 PM in Tacoma, and that was one of about seven cities (Spokane, Vancouver, Aberdeen, Yakima, Wenatchee, etc) they held the meetings in over the course of a couple of weeks. I have also seen notices of such meetings in the city newspaper in the sports section. I am not a stauch defender of everything the WDFW does, but dang it people, you cannot have your heads in the sand and then complain that you didn't know what was going on. If you want to know what is going on, you can find out.

 

It would have been simple for the WDFW to put a notice on their website with all the changes they were considering and to send out a news release by email. They did not do so until 2 months ago. If people would have known the magnitude of the changes, perhaps more people would have taken the time to go to the meetings. I know I would have. Instead, the WDFW kept everything from the public. And apparently, so did the GMAC.

[bobcat]

Also, last summer, if you knew about all the changes, why didn't YOU post about it on this board, and encourage people to write letters and go to meetings?

[billythekidrock]

Also, last summer, if you knew about all the changes, why didn't YOU post about it on this board, and encourage people to write letters and go to meetings?

[SkookumHntr]

 

[Snapshot]

Why didn't I? Notwithstanding the fact that it is way above my pay grade  , I frankly had no idea there was is much apathy among hunters that are so well connected to the information stream (internet). How can we gripe about lack of accountability in politicians and then have the gall to expect to be spoon fed information that is there if only we would go look for it. Maybe we as individuals should take some responsibility for letting the WDFW operate the way it does. Do they not serve the public?

About a dozen years ago I decided to join a couple of state organizations, roll my sleeves up and help out any way I could. The 'old timers' I met then, the one's who had been fighting to improve hunting opportunity for twenty years, talked of hunter apathy and I would think to myself, "That can't be so; how could hunters not want to get into the trenches and try to have a positive effect on the processes that affect our way of life." Well, I am beginning to understand what they meant. Plenty talk the talk but few walk the walk.

I'm not trying to single out individuals here on the H-W.com. The same level of (with all due respect) ignorance is being demonstrated at other websites, at archery shoots and wherever folks are talking about hunting; the workplace, the tavern, etc.

A lot of people are fed up with the crap we put up with in this state. The tribal situation for example. My neighbors are going to Idaho this year because they've had enough; that small group alone, three people, will take two thousand bucks to another state. And they aren't the only ones... If I could afford to go elsewhere I would...

[bobcat]

More BS....

We don't expect to be "spoonfed." As I said, it would have been simple enough for the WDFW to put something more prominent up on their website about the changes. Why do they even bother to post it 2 months ago and say that they are giving the public an opportunity to comment on it, when the proposal is surely already a done deal

So exactly which state organizations did you join?

[Snapshot]

Small clubs that don't have big coffers and so don't have the influence of lots of money like some clubs do (Eg., RMEF, SCI). I joined Traditional Bowhunters of Washington, Washington State Bowhunters, Professional Bowhunters Society (national) and the Pope & Young Club (national). I got up to pee at a WSB meeting and they stuck me with a board position that lasted a few years before I shed that. Same thing happened at TBW but I've been serving it as a director/officer almost for over ten years and will until they hang me because its' mission is close to my heart.

I could be wrong about when I first heard people started complaining to the department about the permit system; I remember them complaining that they didn't like loosing their bull points, for example, if they drew a cow tag. Maybe it was during the three-year package decision meeting in April 2009. But as you know by the time that meeting rolled around the commission had heard from the public and the WDFW at the March public input meeting and it was too late to do anything but rule on the proposals that were in front of them. If that was the case, the commission/department would have told the folks that they could look to do something next year.

The first time I saw the RESULT of their work on changing the permits was at the Western Washington Sportsmen's show at the end of January, where they were handing out full color tri-folds espousing the virtues of their new system. I was surprised by where it landed (I don't think its fair either), but not being one who looks forward to one day having to have to hunt the "king's deer", I don't pay too much attention to permits and have always seen it as merely a way to give a few more dollars to wildlife conservation.

-BS ...uh no, DS

[bobcat]

OK, so are you saying that even with as involved as you are with sportsman's clubs and all, that you didn't know the details of the changes to the permit system any sooner than all the rest of us? And if that's true, don't you think that's a problem? Especially when the WDFW is saying this change was done with "broad public input" and support?

People will complain no matter how the permit system works. But for the WDFW to change it in a way that makes it much more complicated and to distribute the points to all the new categories in a manner that is not even close to being fair, doesn't make sense. They were getting some complaints before, which were mostly unfounded. Now they will be getting 10 times more complaints I am sure. And many of these will now be legitimate (in my opinion.) They would have been much better off to just leave it the way it was and double or triple the price of an application.

People that complained about the system because they could not draw a permit were unjustified in doing so. It was just fine the way it was. If they wanted to draw a permit they should have applied for less popular hunts. With the changes that are being made, the popular buck and bull permits will be no easier to draw, and there's a very good chance many of them will be more difficult.

It's nice that you don't mind donating your money to the WDFW for "wildife conservation." That's the same way I have always thought of it as well. But look at how much money they have surely wasted in getting this new system up and running. And how much more are they having to pay Outdoor Central every time there is a drawing?

[Curly]

The first time I saw the RESULT of their work on changing the permits was at the Western Washington Sportsmen's show at the end of January, where they were handing out full color tri-folds espousing the virtues of their new system.

That right there is the point.  I believe that is the first time anyone other than WDFW knew about the new system.  And I suspect it was so far along that they will have a hard time changing anything.  It would have been nice for them to unveil their plan 6 months earlier and then there would be time to cry foul and try to get them to tweek it.  

The main thing that needs done is to program the software with a box to be checked as to what category your points that were accumulated before 2010 should be applied.  I get the feeling that WDFW was just told by OC that it would be "too complicated" and they didn't press the issue......and settled on placing points in all categories.  With enough outcry, maybe they could have pressued the issue and gotten the programmers to figure it out.

A lot of us are on the email list and we didn't hear about the changes until the end of January.

[Snapshot]

Yes, C & BC, good point.