are alum arrows as good as carbon for hunting

[garyltbh]

i was wondering if alum arrows are as good as carbon for hunting i can get alum for half what i can get carbon and if they will work just as well i will use them

[ELKBURGER]

Aluminum arrows have probably killed more critters than carbon. As long as you hit where you're supposed to they're just as good.

[konrad]

Carbon composite can be very straight and light for the shaft diameter (higher projectile velocity) which translates into flatter shooting and less drop compensation (shorter time of flight). This can be very beneficial when shooting at extended distances as most folks have difficulty in judging drop between 40 and 60 yards.

This begs the question: If most deer are killed at 20 yards, why is flatter shooting so important when the kill zone is an 8 to 10 inch diameter circle? It is common knowledge that pass-through (complete arrow penetration) is nearly a given when using a stoutly constructed, sharp broadhead at 20 yards with any arrow material shot at modern compound speeds.

The very best carbon shafts have a high initial purchase price and it is true that they will return to their original shape well after making a glancing blow.  However, they are susceptible to filler/binder cracking and fiber separation from tip/side impact and nock end damage. Manufacturers of carbon shafts suggest flexing and rolling of the shaft under tension after every shot to reveal fiber/binding filler damage and prevent shaft explosion upon the next firing. It is doubtful many archers practice this precaution but, none the less, this reflects manufacture’s concerns about prevention of injury to archers and standers by (read that lawsuits). Carbon composite shafts may also become abraded at the point end from being shot into rough targets such as hay. Abrasion can, over time, weaken both shaft strength and spine quality. Today’s hard anodizing of alloy shafts just polishes to a high gloss.

I have used wood, carbon and alloys in archery. I would never consider carbon again without some sort of nock protection (here we are again with the $$$). I have damaged a number of shafts due both nock and point end damage.
For me, nock end damage is more tolerable (it means I’m doing something right, consistently) rather than worrying about shafts collapsing on the point end or being eroded from target friction. That’s it, laugh…hay will do it!

 I now use Easton premium alloy shafts with nock end protection i.e. Easton Super Uni Bushing. The Super Slam shafts are spine retention and straightness guaranteed for 2 years and the X-7’s straightness is unparalleled in carbon unless you are prepared to spend more than twice the money. Those who tout alloy “loosing its spine” should think carefully about metallurgy. Flexing metals get harder with time, not more soft. Logic says those alloy shafts should be gaining stiffness not loosing and Easton Technical confirms my theory. They, by the way, sell a lot of carbon shafts.

It is my contention that the technology needed for composite shaft production is much easier to obtain than for alloy shafts. Therefore more companies are now in the market. Archers are no more resistant to advertising than any other group and so the perceived need to “upgrade” to composite shafts seems imperative. I also believe carbon technology should produce less expensive arrows but advertising hype and archer’s herd mentality has pushed pricing (and profit margins) higher.

I now see advertisements for “higher grains per inch” weight carbon shafts to “maximize penetration”. Wait a minute…I thought the whole reason for carbon technology was light construction and speed.
Kind of makes you wonder, doesn’t it?

I guess if I had corporate sponsorship or was independently wealthy, I would have the most expensive of everything and not be concerned with replacement price. But I still have to work for a living.

Meanwhile, I will content myself with a little longer time of flight, a quieter shot, greater durability and lower replacement cost.

Besides, I like shooting the straightest, cheapest arrow on the firing line!

PS  I've never seen an alloy shaft do what is shown in this picture. This is from under spined or damaged shafts.

[Dansk]

Composite sound high-tech, but its really just plastic and carbon fibers laid up like fiberglass, but very susceptible to problems if not 'built' the right way.  Quality is dependent on the manufacturing process.

Some common problems with carbon fiber composites-

If it's not painted, the plastic used to 'glue' the carbon together will deteriorate from UV light and become susceptible to structural failure or de-lamination

Carbon fiber structure is very strong when pulled or bent or when a sheet of it is hit on the flat side, however it does experience structural problems when compressed, jarred, or 'crushed'.

Bonds between metal fittings and carbon need to be precise and well engineered - you cannot just slap a nock in or directly thread a fitting - joint surfaces need to be true.

Small gaps between layers or air pockets can cause failure.

When it fails- it can be catastrophic- 'exploding' is common.  aluminum will just bend.



Do they have titanium arrows?  That'd be the ticket.

[croix]

Performance wise I think that the Easton Full Metal Jackets are the best of both worlds. Carbon wrapped in aluminum. They are expensive at $135/doz but they have the rigidity of carbon and aluminum exterior makes them smoother (easier on rest, easier to pull from target, etc). I know that LTL had some issues with them while hog hunting, but so far I love them.

[garyltbh]

i dint want to spend 135 a doz i can get alum for 38 bucks a doz or carbon for 75 doz if the alum will work just as good i want to shoot them if the wont work as well then ill shoot carbon thats my queston is one as good as the other ??

[croix]

I think that aluminum will be more than adequate.

"Should I be shooting Carbon or Aluminum Arrows?" This is a very common question I hear from a lot of archers. The truth is, is that there is really no set answer it is basically a case of your personal preference. As with any products there are always pros and cons to them. In this article I am going go through some of these pros and cons with you."

From this link:   http://www.archerybuff.com/carbonvsaluminum.php

huntersfriend.com also has a lot of good data about arrows. look for the carbon u link.

[garyltbh]

that was helpfull thankyou very much

[Special T]

My cousin just got the new PSE Xforce. He had a BUNCH of alum arrows and decided to test  how much FPS he would lose by using them... He is getting 347fps from hi new bow with alum and only shot 374 with carbon.... 27 fps isn't that bad a trade for cheep and massive penetration. 

[Sneaky]

Aluminum arrows just don't hold their straightness like carbon ones do. If you buy a carbon arrow, it will shoot well for a long long time and won't get bent in practice. Aluminum arrows WILL eventually acquire and maintain flaws which effect arrow flight. This has been my experience.

[konrad]

It is true that alloy shafts will eventually become damaged/bent with their continued use; however, ANY shaft material will become damaged with continued use (refer to my first post).

When purchasing any shaft the primary consideration should be the proper spine selection. Once spine has been determined, I would opt for a “middle of the road” alloy such as Easton’s Platinum Plus or XX 75’s with the alloy Super Uni Bushings (for durability) instead of the carbon composite type.

Eder’s has the Camo Hunters for $50/dozen and the Platinum Plus for a little less (you have to buy inserts separately but they come with the metal Super Uni bushing already installed).

I have also used Easton’s X-7, XX 78 with great success. It’s a tougher alloy but also more expensive. Please refer to Easton Technical’s web-site for the Super Slam (XX 78 alloy with fancy camo) warranty covering spine and straightness.

http://www.eastonarchery.com/products/product/9/warranty

PS  374 fps sounds scary fast from an arrow that is properly spined for the bow. Many shops will sell the lightest arrow they can get away with to impress the prospective buyer with the speed. As with anything else, there are trade-offs. Light arrows tend to be more easily damaged than more stoutly constructed ones. Bows tend to want to self destruct and get very noisy as it is similar to a dry firing situation using extremely light arrows.

I would want to verify that your cousin is using the correct shaft for his X-Force.

[croix]

When purchasing any shaft the primary consideration should be the proper spine selection.

ABSOLUTELY SPOT ON!

Figure out the spine for your draw weight and arrow length and then figure out what trade-offs you are willing to make regarding weight, speed, kinetic energy, cost, etc.  It's basically a math quiz

[Wild Bill]

I want to read this thread, but cannot stop looking at that damn picture

[Ratdog68]

I want to read this thread, but cannot stop looking at that damn picture

I hear ya... I had a wooden arrow grenade on me last summer.  Thankfully, my arm guard kept me from harm's way.  If I had to choose... a wood arrow, or a carbon injury like that?  I'd opt for wood.   

[xXx Archery]

i dint want to spend 135 a doz i can get alum for 38 bucks a doz or carbon for 75 doz if the alum will work just as good i want to shoot them if the wont work as well then ill shoot carbon thats my queston is one as good as the other ??

We really need more INFO from you
what bow are you shooting?....what lbs?.....Draw?.....and arrow lenght?
then what Arrow for 35.00dz....and What carbon for 75.00dz
What do you want in the arrow?
some times guys are just buying a price tag...others are buys what works best for what they want ...
as for is alum as good as Carbon...YES for some things..not all carbon arrows the same and the same for alum...

[tlbradford]

I now see advertisements for “higher grains per inch” weight carbon shafts to “maximize penetration”. Wait a minute…I thought the whole reason for carbon technology was light construction and speed.

That is actually the reason I went with carbon over wood for my longbow.  I can get an arrow with a high EFOC number and a heavy arrow which helps maximize penetration, especially when you are shooting around 190 ft/sec and not 300.

[garyltbh]

ok cory or the man at Xxx i am shooting a mathews dxt 27in draw and 60 lbs 26 3/4 in arrow im looking for hunting arrows but i want good arrows  i dont want to spend more than i need to so thats my question are alum arrows just as good as carbon for hunting will they fly just as straight and have as much energy i can get carbon from you for 75 dollars doz but over in longview on oak street i can get alum for 38 dollars a doz i was told there i shoot what i like better i havent shot alum in years im realy just getting back into archery and i have a doz carbon arrows now but i need to buy more befor hunting season and im not sure if i should spend the money on carbon or shoot the less expensive alum arrows is one as good as the other for a good hunting arrow mid price arrows and thankyou in advance cory i would realy like your 

[xXx Archery]

ok so still not knowing what alum arrow...lets just say they are 2117 GG with a spine of .407
at 26.75" that arrow will be about 475grains at your draw shooting 220 fps with 51.06 Kinetic Energy

now if we shoot a 400 spine Victory arrow for 69.00 dz  will be about 370 grains
would shoot 255fps with 53.44 kinetic energy

so for hunting I would shoot the carbon arrow over the alum.
the alum arrows you can get for 38.00 will have a conventional nock ...not as good as the super nock that carbon arrows have or better alum arrows have....alum arrows are very straight and have real good spine ...but you will get more life with the carbon.
I still shoot alum arrows for indoor shoots cuz they shoot so good ...but it is 20 yards ...slow, but hits the same spot..but I shoot X7 alum and they cost 90+ a dz. ...so some times cheaper is not always better...
I hope this helps....alum will fly just as good as carbon...

if you need more info call me I can talk better than type...

[garyltbh]

thankyou cory

[carpsniperg2]

as far as killing they will kill just fine would i ever hunt with them no not myself but there are some pretty decent hybrids arrows like the fmj