diaphram frustration

[Little Fish]

After you master the sounds at a softer/quieter level then you can work on increasing the volume.

FYI....Elknut provided me a lot of guideance when I first started calling. Its worth a visit to his site to see what calls and DVDs/CDs he has that will help you. Personally I am a fan of the the Rocky Jacobson calls which in my opinion are more forgiving/easier to call with that Primos and other brands.

[mtbiker]

Last year, I was new to elk calling.  I have all of Paul's (Elknut1) educational DVD's and they really helped.  I'm no expert by any means, buy they really helped to shorten the learning curve and he provides a lot of insight behind each topic.  I highly recommend them.

Also, one of the big hurdles I got over is when I trimmed the diaphram to get that nice fit in the top of my mouth.  Until I did that, I was floundering and at best sounded like a sick duck.

[mtbiker]

Personally I am a fan of the the Rocky Jacobson calls which in my opinion are more forgiving/easier to call with that Primos and other brands.

  I also use the Carlton double reed.  It fits differently in my mouth than the Rocky Jacobson calls, but I like the sound I can get out of it.  Also, I had to trim all of them to get them to fit right in my mouth.

[Elkhound]

Getting a good seal between the back of the call and the roof of the mouth is KEY!  When I tried the Primos calls with the Sonic Dome or even the ones with the "Sound Plate," the call became much easier to use.  It still didn't solve all of my issues due to the fact that I have a VERY high palate.  I am a dentist so I was lucky enough to have some material in my lab that I could use (dental impression putty) that I was able to place on the call, seat it in my mouth and form it so that it would seal against the root of my mouth.  WHAT A WORLD OF A DIFFERENCE!  When you have a good seal, it takes very little air pressure and very little tongue pressure to make a consistant sound.  I am able to call while keeping my mouth/lips open which gives you a good natural sounding tone.  I suppose there are other things you could try using, but that's what I did!  Maybe I can market these calls?   

[Ridgeratt]

For all of the new  Diaphram user's a trick to keep the call from tasting like a bad nite out!!!
Is to find an old 35 MM film canister and then keep them in it in a solution of half water and half of your favorite mouth wash.
If you can find the old advatanix cans they are oval. the snap lid gives you a leak proof seal as well.

[DoubleJ]

It feels sealed in the back, I just don't know.  Seems like I get better sound when air goes over the top and bottom.  I know this is wrong and I'm trying not to do it that way.

[Elkhound]

It feels sealed in the back, I just don't know.  Seems like I get better sound when air goes over the top and bottom.  I know this is wrong and I'm trying not to do it that way.

Just watch yourself in the mirror when you call with it in.  You don't want your lips to be pierced for a cow mew sound.  Tip of tongue should be on the back of the lower front teeth and the middle of the tongue placing pressure against the latex reed of the diaphragm.  A lot of people pierce their lips when making a cow mew and you should have an open mouth as much as possible.  I hope this helps!

[DoubleJ]

How can my tongue put pressure on the latex when that plate thingy is in the way?

[Elkhound]

How can my tongue put pressure on the latex when that plate thingy is in the way?

It must be upside down....the plate must go toward the roof of the mouth.

[DoubleJ]

How can my tongue put pressure on the latex when that plate thingy is in the way?

It must be upside down....the plate must go toward the roof of the mouth.

Holy crap!!  That explains a lot.  It's a lot better now.  Almost sounds good.  Now I'll practice instead of throwing them out.

[carpsniperg2]

  that a kid

[blk_tmbr_archery]

Another call you may want to think about are the Jones calls.  These calls produce a quality sound though they don't seem to last as long as the others.  One advantage of these calls for a beginner is they are designed to be be molded to your mouth by slightly bending the metal frame to the shape of the roof of your mouth without changing the tension of the latex.  These calls are also easy to shape by cutting them down to size.  If you try one of these out I recommend buying two of them (one for practice and one for hunting) due to the fact they will stretch out within a few weeks of constant use.  I think you would be quite pleased with the sound.

[Instinct]

also remember that when ur using em, dont have ur lips close or at a O shape like when u whistle when u call. open ur mouth when doin cow calling. learned that from a elk seminar last year.

[roadhuntking]

How do you control from not salivating so damn much.  I can't even practice more than 30 seconds and I have to take it out and start over. Very frustrated. But after reading this thread I have learned a lot and gonna try first thing when I get home.

[Whippersnapper]

I get a lot of use out of my primos sonic dome. I've found that by standing the dome down about a millimeter to take down the edges and smooth out the arch, the dome doesn't hurt the roof of my mouth. It is a great all around diaphragm call as you can get great cow calls and two tone satellite bull calls out of one call.

I recently got a big surprise last season when I encountered a herd bull. We had him in a timber stand in a small drainage surrounded by high desert. We split him off from 5 of his 12 cows and needless to say he was pissed. We engaged in a bugleing war at 50 yards for 45 minutes. However, early on I found that because the adrenaline flowing through my veins, my mouth went very dry and my diaphragm call wouldn't make  any sounds that sounded even close to an elk. After licking my arm for salt I was able to get enough saliva to squeak out some chuckles. Try ado might, I wasn't able to get a big challenge bugle out. This was total call failure. I wished to the stars that I would have had a non diaphragm call as backup. If you tend to dry out when you get amped up, then definitely have a backup system.