Cougar hunting by Mulehunter

[Special T]

I have a question reguarding Hound hunting...Since anyone can draw a tag for the NE corner without owning dogs... does that mean any "Friend" of mine with hounds can take me out? or do i have to hire a licenced outfitter?

[bearpaw]

It's unfortunate that hound hunting is being phased out in this state. First with the loss of hunting cougar, bobcat and bear with the initiative.  Then aprox. a yr. ago WDFW decided to eliminate coyote hunting with hounds.  This move was strictly a WDFW move and not an initiative which is clear they dislike hound hunting.   The permit system that was in place in the 5 counties was friendly to hound hunters in that you had to own hounds which made it highly likely you could get drawn at least every other year.  It was changed to allow anybody to apply even without hounds, another WDFW move.   Now a hound owner may go 4 or 5 years without getting drawn.  Since many places don't have racoons to chase and keep ones dogs trained a multitude of hound owners are disolving their life long passion of hound hunting.  Unless you are willing to go to other states and pursue animals or have a favorable spot in your area that is not riddled with private property that has racoons to chase, your future in hound hunting is grim.    Most of Mulehunters stories were about the pursuit which is "the thrill of the hunt" when it comes to hound hunting.  By not allowing pursuit of anything but racoons WDFW is slowly cutting of the heads off the hound hunters.  Hound hunting pursuit is one of the most exhilirating sports one can indulge in and does absolutely no harm or takes no animals but yet it offends some people.  Unfortunately, the people it offends have never been with a pack of hounds to feel the excitement, live in the city and have votes, votes, votes.   Hound hunting for cougars is the absolute most ethical way to take specific sexes, sizes and numbers of cougars from an area.  If a pursuit season for hound hunters can be put in place then we will continue to have this useful group of dedicated hunters to help balance the prey numbers.  If not then in the near future you will rarely see a hound owner in the state and likely if any cougar hunting is still allowed it will have to be done by out of state hunters that still are allowed to train their dogs in a neighboring state. WDFW is presently looking at disallowing the new GPS locating systems that have came out in the past couple years.  If they take this course then Mulehunter will be stripped of his only way to locate his dogs since he is totally deaf and can't hear the old beep type locating systems.  It's clear WDFW has been infiltrated by some adimate hon-hunters.  Our governor appoints the game commission and since it's been democrat for so many years the commission has turned into a non-hunting commission and into a bird watching commission.  Any commissioner ever appointed should have been required to have bought a hunting or fishing license for the last 10 yrs. or disqualify them.  Hopefully we will all get to read more of these stories like Mulehunter has been keeping us up on but try and remember all these great hunts because it may be all we have in the future is the memories of past hunts.

What villeageidiot says is very true. To elaborate more, the most important thing to a hound hunter is the ability to hunt his dogs. Most true houndhunters leave more animals in the tree than they have killed.

This state needs an open hound pursuit season for cougar and even bear, it would serve many purposes.

1.  Help hound hunters to keep trained dogs.
2.  Experienced dogs would be available to the WDFW for depredation work.
3.  Additional revenue from pursuit permits.
4.  Condition cougar/bear to fear man and dogs.  (more and more cougar are preying on dogs in sub-divisions)
5.  Encourage cougar and bear to avoid human inhabited areas thus reducing complaints that WDFW must respond to.

I am sure there would be other benefits as well.

Sorry for jacking your thread mulehunter. Please keep the photos and stories coming through the rest of your pursuit season for all to see.

[bearpaw]

I have a question reguarding Hound hunting...Since anyone can draw a tag for the NE corner without owning dogs... does that mean any "Friend" of mine with hounds can take me out? or do i have to hire a licenced outfitter?

You can designate up to 4 hound handlers of your choice.

[Hornseeker]

You had a Great season Scott!! Congrats. When I drew my tag in 89, we had a HORRIBLE snow year and hunting every weekend from Thanksgiving till early March, we only treed ONE cat...and I killed HER and that was in March!!

Congrats!!!

[Gringo31]

Adding to Dale's comments...

It's seems that in "usual" problem areas, they would open up to chase only to keep those critters kind of pushed back......or would they just quickly tree and back to the same ol' tomorrow? 

[MtnMuley]

There has been a lot of "pursuing" in problem areas since the initial ban on hounding back in the 90's.  It worked great keeping the cats scattered.  This was done through WDFW until the several counties banded together to gain control back of their cat populations.  The problem with large cougar populations (problems) seemed to develop shortly after the hound ban in '96  (I believe).  The more dominant toms would basically push young lions out of their areas and thus the younger lions would turn into "problem" lions trying to develop their own turf.  This happened in lower human-populated elevations, so it really became known as a problem.  90% of the cats we treed in that time frame were young lions.  Without hounds, there was no real means to manage the lion population, thus it thrived.  Things seem to be right back on track now as I see it.   Oh ya, "pursuit" season is still open until the end of the season for those successful in drawing a permit.

[villageidiot]

Mt Muley  is pretty much right on track except for one thing           "  Things seem to be right back on track now as I see it."      Things might look to be on track except for the fact that most hound owners do not have any legal way to train their dogs and keep them ready to go hunting when they get drawn.   One can go as many as 6 or more years between getting drawn.  If you own a race horse and only are allowed to run a race every 6 years you will sell your horse.  This is a very short sighted vision by WDFW.  Eventually all the hound owners will disolve unless they open up a pursuit season.   At present time it is mostly West coast hound owners that can still pursue racoons and a few east side boys have a special honey hole they can chase coons and keep their hounds tuned up.   Most hound owners are out of luck when it comes to keeping their dogs tuned up and are getting out of hounding.  Many of these guys have owned hounds their whole life 40 plus years and see no other alternative and have disolved.  The writing is on the wall from WDFW, they want hounding completely outlawed and do everything they can to accomplish this. 
  If one if from the southeastern states he was raised and cut his teeth on going out hunting with the hounds every weekend.  This was and still is a family tradition and many hound owners here in Wash. are from that part of the country.  It's real disheartening to see their life long passion and family heritage destroyed.  Continuing hound hunting would work perfectly fine on the east side of this state but the west side makes the laws so hounding is on it's way out.    Unfortunately

[Special T]

So is there a way that permit holders can make "friends" with hound hunters or do they just resort to guides to hunt with? I'm kinda curious about the stats about how all these non hound owners hunt the cougars.... I would imagine if i had hounds i would probably throw it out to every one i knew to put in for permits....

[mulehunter]

So is there a way that permit holders can make "friends" with hound hunters or do they just resort to guides to hunt with? I'm kinda curious about the stats about how all these non hound owners hunt the cougars.... I would imagine if i had hounds i would probably throw it out to every one i knew to put in for permits....

Non hound owners can put in for permit and have other people with hounds "guide" them.  It is a little unfair to dog owners who legitametly apply because they are the ones putting in all the time with the dogs, training, care, expenses, etc.. Maybe that permit holder doesnt have:truck, snowmobile, money for gas, but they want to take advantage of a houndsman because this may be their only oppertunity to hunt that year. 

When those people draw they are most likely to go once, kill the first one they tree.  Then the houndsman is again out more oppertunities to train their dogs in persuit. That is the only time they can legally train their dogs on live game.  Maybe the permit holder doesnt want to spend anymore time or money to persue game?


Mulehunter

[mulehunter]

Sorry for jacking your thread mulehunter. Please keep the photos and stories coming through the rest of your pursuit season for all to see.

Bearpaw, No worry. I love this Thread. Its good for everybody to understand how Houndmen feel about those Permit, Bio, Pursuit, Etc. Its good infomation right here and learn about how each person feel about it.

I need to come up spend time with ya for fun and go pursuit Cougar up your area since you have Permit.  It better not end up crash my truck like last year on Cindy Permit.   


Mulehunter   

[Kain]

Man I have enjoyed this thread sooooo much and I am sad to see your season end. 


Now get after those coons!!!!   

[mulehunter]

Man I have enjoyed this thread sooooo much and I am sad to see your season end. 


Now get after those coons!!!!   

Thanks, Its okay and thankful for what I have done.  I will still going for pursuit in my permit unit till March end.  By the way, Last sunday Two Chicken got killed again by Coon at my frined family property so I went over Few hours old and chase all night long thur Big Creek area. Not successed 

Gotta try again later.

Mulehunter   

[granola/hippyslayer]

one of the best threads ever in my book

[LRP]

Mulehunter, it's been a great topic and a way for all to follow a true hound hunter.  It is really frustrating that our wildlife can be managed by iniative, by the uninformed voting with their heart and not by facts.  People do not realize that hound hunting, trapping and bear baiting are all forms of wildlife management, and those participating in those activities pay to participate and help manage wildlife of this state.  The one thing I do want to comment on is the new GPS dog tracking collars.  The State cannot violate the ADA act.  Mule cannot hear his dogs and must depend on the GPS tracker.  For the State to prohibit him from using it, I believe would be a violation of that act.  The law prohibiting the use of a treeing switch on collars is stupid.  It does almost nothing to help the houndsman, they listen to the dogs.  The GPS, so called treeing switch, does nothing but tell the hunter the dogs have stopped.  I will send in my comments on the GPS collars.  Thanks for the trip Mulehunter.
LRP

[MtnMuley]

  The law prohibiting the use of a treeing switch on collars is stupid.  It does almost nothing to help the houndsman, they listen to the dogs.  The GPS, so called treeing switch, does nothing but tell the hunter the dogs have stopped.
LRP

Very good post LRP, with solid info that many people/hunters aren't aware of.  Thanks.