Undergunned??????

[Intruder]

Another great thing about the .357 is that if you want to reload you can jack it up quite abit and also load it way down in the .38 for just pennies a shot.  In the .38 it becomes flat nice to shoot.... great for practice.  It could easily be argued that the .357 is the most versatile wheel gun cal out there. 

[littletoes]

CoasthunterJay=I'd just have to say, Mace don't work.

Wife takes walks with our husky, and twice she's been attacked by dogs. She's used the mace, and it didn't stop the dogs AT ALL.

I've got to say, if it won't stop a dog, I won't even try it on a bear or cougar. Not going to trust my nor hers, nor any of our kids lives on it. Give me the gun, I'll or She'll do it right the first time.

She carried the LARGEST can money can buy, got it from a LEO friend of ours, and it DID NOT WORK (said it twice to get the point across...). The biggest dog that came at her got 3/4 of the can right in its eyes, from about 2 feet max (wife argues that the dog was right up against her knees, and says it was a bunch closer than two feet). 

Now, when theres "dog trouble" in the neighborhood, I go along and carry my auto. Let them dogs come on over, got a surprise for 'em, and I won't even drag them off the street when I'm done. Let the owner do it.
I don't have much patience for mean dogs that can't stay on thier own property. I don't read "dog" so I don't know if they are comming in friendly or "angry" if they come running up. Pit's and Rott's already have a mark against them in my book, sorry, but in this area they have a bad rap.

BoneAddict-FBI tests show the 45 outperforming the 357, as did the 10mm. As a fact, the 10 was the only handgun that outperformed the .45 ACP in those tests.

[MountainWalk]

mace may not work.... but REAL BEAR SPARY will.. human mace is ineffective..tellyour wife to try BEAR SPRAY.....

[boneaddict]

outperformed as in firepower ( multiple shots on kill, speed etc.) or ballistically blow the hell out of a stump outperform.  I'm honestly not a handgun expert or even amateur.

[MountainWalk]

bone is right with the caliber. id take a 45 1911 anyday given the choice for self defence against two legged foes. in my mind, i see the 45 acp as a handgun version of a 4570. modest speed and mass and weight. i just dont like hammer drop safeties and double actions.
i prefer revolvers . i had a 41 hawk. loved it but it went down the river.

[Idabooner]

Just for intrest levels....everyone talks about their Glocks and so forth and the .45

Take two blacks of ice out and shoot it one with the .45 and the other with the .357 and see what happens.  Do the same with a bucnh of magazines tied together.

I think you are referring to the home tests I done, I was using hand loads and a strong framed .357 wheel gun against a .45 auto.  The .357 was loaded way hotter than factory ammo. Factory stuff has to be loaded down to be safe in any old or inferior gun the public might have. In the auto you can't load up much or it will not work the action right.  Remember the 9mm auto I loaded a little to hot and blew the grips off in my hand?  And yes the .357 penetrated a couple inches farther into a stack of catalogs, wet or dry, sideways or edge ways, into rotten stumps and solid stumps, the same results with blocks of ice plain and frozen gallon jugs. I thought the 9mm is way over rated, it didn't hold a candle to my do it yourself testing.  Just my experience over a few years I played with it.  If I had those 3 guns to choose from for protection in the woods I would take the .357 with my loads, no question.  My .357 got stolen so now I would take my .41 mag. with my loads which out preformed the other three.

[jdb]

back in the early 90,s i thought i wanted to be a pistolero and did a ton of research into this very subject and at that time a fellow named evan marshall compiled a huge amount of data gathered from actual shootings and the overall consensus was that a .357 magnum with 125 grain hollow point was the best defensive round by conciderable margin.

[jdb]

all that being said I usually carry a ruger singlesix .22 magnum!

[boneaddict]

Exactly what I was referring to Idabooner.  I saw alot of hard evidence with my own eyes.   I was really impressed.  I do love the .41 as well.

[littletoes]

Dangnabbit, you guys are gonna make me go dig up that file!    

Remember when that shootout happened in LA (I think), and those FBI guys got gunned down by the bank robbers? That made 'em re-eval-u-ate what they were to carry. After all the tests were done the Feds switched to the 10mm, but soon learned that not "all" could handle the recoil, hence the invention of the 40 Smith.....

I think it all started around '85-'86, the 10 is very comparable to the .41, but in an auto.
The same tests used +P loads in the 357 too, but any handloader can load up lots hotter loads in a hand cannon 'dere's LOTS of room in dem cases! (don't think its wise always though).

[Intruder]

Back to the original question.... is the .357 enough?  The short answer is YES.

[mossback91]

357 is enough unless your in the same woods as me but in that case you will always be undergunned!

[Dakota Dogman]

'bout 6 years ago 3 kids came onto a sow griz. while fishing outside of anchoridge... the kid with the mosberg got scared & went swimming.  Two with 9mm's put her down.

Several years back GFP put down a transport bear with a S&W 19 .357.

Yep, .357 can do it, however the .41 can do it a little better & .44 / .45 are also just a little bit more.  Answer near as I can tell is to buy several, then enjoy different ones on differnt days...

God Bless,

[257 Wby Mag]

jdb, you are exactly right, at least from my research. A gentlemen named Massad Ayoob did a study throughout the 90's, a large percentage of his reseached involved siiting in on autopsies, studying wound chaneles, etc. He research findings were, a 357 magnum firing a 125 jacketed hollow point 1400-1450 fps, is "the best one shot man stopper period". Second was a 135 grain hollowpoint out of a 40 S&W, wound channel and penetration closly resmbled that of a 357 magnum. His studies include 41,44, 45, 9mm, etc. The 357 Sig closly resembles the 357 magnum, within 50fps, with 13 rounds instead of 6. If I can't kill a longtail or bear with 13 shots outta my sig, then, I shoulda practiced a little more. Grizz or Brown bear country, I'd opt for a Ruger Alaskan in 480 or the Casull....

[boneaddict]

I think the biggest deal littletoes, and again, I know very little about handguns is that take a look at the case in the .45 auto versus the .357.   Yes its a bigger bullet, but the case seems its a bout half the size, then you have th elimitations of the auto eject and as Idabooner pointed out, can the gun handle it.  Plus...anytime you go to auto, you lose energy.   Honestly, I wouldn't want to be shot with any of them.....including JDB's 22 mag.  Which is what I carry alot too.  The other gun I carry, which I kind of had the idea stuck in my head after watching the deathwish movies with Charles Bronson, is my 30-30 contender.  I always figured if you can put a rifle round into a pistol, then you're talking.  Its a little big to put in your pocket though.   I've killed a couple bear, elk, deer, cougar, and probably a few other things with it.  Most importantly, it saved my life when I got attacked by that bear.  I need to get that story on here I can tell.