Reloading- break even point?

[sticky]

Now that ammo supplies are returning to pre Obama levels, I am considering investing in a single stage press kit and reloading my own ammo. I've spoken with a co-worker that reloads, and he claims that I could reload 9mm for almost half the cost of retail.  The last box of 9mm ammo I bought cost just under .18 a round.  I won't be loading thousands of rounds per week, but more like a couple hundred.  Pricing the different components, I don't see how I can beat the cheaper retail ammo.  Does anybody have any data on when reloading becomes worthwhile?

I realize that 9mm is a mass ammo market and may be tough to beat, but certainly rifle ammo would be cheaper in the long run, yes?

[GoldTip]

I've reloaded 9mm ammo and it certainly seems to burn cleaner and be more reliable.  I can say this it is probably half or less the cost to reload 50 9mm rounds than it is to buy them.  But if you figure in the time it takes to reload those bullets and what your times is worth, it's not even close to being a break even situation.  And thats WITH owning all the stuff to do it.  I don't relaod any longer my plinking ammo for my 9mm, 38 special or my 45.  The ammo I carry in any of those guns simply for protection is all handloaded, but I can practice with factory loads much cheaper and use good handloads for my personal protection in those guns and spend the rest of my free time reloading for my rifles.  My Dad's 44mag, my wifes 357mag, my 454 casull only see handloads. 

[shoot-em-dead]

I would never be able to shoot as much as I do without reloading. It is well worth the money.

[JackOfAllTrades]

If you're an avid shooter, the cost of equipment will come back in less than a couple years. If you're a competitor, you'll recoup in one year.

If you're a pure recreationalist that shoots every couple weeks, once you start reloading, you'll break even with what you spent before, but you'll shoot a whole lot more and be able to create specific concoctions suited for your needs.

http://www.handloads.com/calc/loadingCosts.asp

Smaller calibers are cheaper to reload. 9mm comes down to being dirt cheap.. Like $.10ea if you get range pick up brass for free and buy bullets in bulk or pour your own lead. I pour my own lead and make 45acp at $.06ea. Even buying bullets, you can make 40s&w at $.11ea.

-Steve

[sticky]

Thanks for the great info.  I think I am the type of person that would enjoy the time spent reloading, especially when I am able to test different loads & bullets, etc.  My reloading friend says he goes with RCBS all the way, another uses Hornady hardware, and another uses Dillon exclusively.  Lee seems to have reasonably priced equipment.  Any problems with any of these brands?

[CAMPMEAT]

I want to start too. My buddy has been doing it for 40 years. He just bought the Hornady Deluxe kit ( I think that's the one ). He uses Lee dies. I think that's what I'm going to get.

[JackOfAllTrades]

Lee, Lyman and Hornady have some lower end presses. Stay away from the smaller ones.

That said, I have DILLON, RCBS, LEE, LYMAN stuff in my gun room. Dillon press and RCBS press.  Lyman dies are the worst of the bunch. I have no problem with any of the rest. If you're going to do some precision reloading for long range rifle shooting, then go with RCBS custom or Redding.

I always suggest to a new reloader that he/she should start with a single stage press until they've out grown it with skill and experience before jumping to a progressive press.

-Steve

[Alchase]

This is just my perspective, and my not be correct for others, I found that reloading was more of a hobby then a cost savings for myself. If you shoot a couple hundred rounds a week, you might brake even. But just like all my other shooting/hunting I always want the new, better, more efficient, more expencive toy. So I was always playing catch up, lol
I can buy 0.40 cal. target rounds for $25.00 - $29.00 per hundred box

[JackOfAllTrades]

I can buy 0.40 cal. target rounds for $25.00 - $29.00 per hundred box

So a 40s&w shooter would save $19/box of 100. If you shot 100rds/every two weeks, then it'll take a guy xx amount of weeks to recoup the value of equipment.

But the hobby itself is valuable. A reloader learns so much more than loading ammo. You'll spend time pouring over ballistic charts and learn more about BC and trajectory and such that the reloader ends up knowing much more about what to expect from his bullets/cartridges/rifle/handgun when hunting, or competing.

-Steve

[SquirrelHunter]

I bought a reloading kit by LEE from Cabelas, i think it was 99bucks or so, by the time i got all the dies and powder and bullets it was around $175, I just use all the brass from my store bought rounds, so Im making my rouns for about .80cents a round. I shoot a Mossberg 4x4 .338 winmag 200gr ballistic slivertip with 66.3gr. reloading saves me $1.70 a round as apposed to buying from the store at $2.50 a pop. So for me i broke even quick, at about 100 rounds or so (typical days shooting), well worth the time to reload.

[CAMPMEAT]

OK, guys. This is what I'd be reloading, 22-250, 223, and 308. Probably never handgun because I shoot more varmints than people. I'm not in it for tackdrivin' 1/16 groups. Any suggestions since I'm leaving for the big town of Spokane tomorrow ? Would I waste my money because I want it for more of a hobby than sniping ?

[JackOfAllTrades]

Would I waste my money because I want it for more of a hobby than sniping ?

No.  It's a great hobby.  And you never know how it will develope into something else unless you try.

-Steve

[Special T]

I think it makes the most $$ difference for rifles and less common calibers... I don't reload or intend to because I have an '06 and 22lr and shot guns.... I have a buddy that reloads 223 for his AR.. saves some money but increased his accuracy a bunch...  

[grundy53]

 i'm getting into it for the hobby aspect more then the money savings although thats nice too!. Got my Kit in last week and ordered what i think is the rest of the tools and the materials hope to get started next week. 

[Schwag173]

I once heard an old guy say that "reloading won't save you any money but you'll shoot a lot more."  This has been my experience and I would also add that my rifle/ammo combinations are MUCH more accurate because I can cook up the exact recipe each of them likes.

[Bigshooter]

I think it all depends on what your are reloading.  I know guys that have paid over a $100 for 20 rounds of 30-378.  A buddy has a .358 and it took us two months to find ammo for it.  We found 3 boxes of 20 at a gun show for $75 a box.  He bought all three boxes and then went out and bought some dies.  If you want to reload 9mm and .223 to save money.  You better shoot a ton. 

[JackOfAllTrades]

I have a 30-338

No one makes ammo for it.  I neck down 338 winmag brass, fireform, then load to the hilt for the accuracy and velocity I want.

Anyone that owns or is thinking about owning a wildcat chambered rifle/pistol is going to be a reloader or go broke getting ammo for it.

-Steve

[CAMPMEAT]

Thanx guys. I'm thinking just for something to do while my wife is at work so I can't get into trouble...ha ha !! I'm not a fisherman but I'm going to start doing that too, another subject of course. Used to be, but can't understand the rules so I quit.

[Bofire]

 :)There is no break even point, you'll just shoot more and buy more componets!! I have been reloading from at my Dads knee to now for about 55 years. I aint hit the "break even" point yet! It is fun, you can learn and shoot alot, you WILL shoot more. Do not show your wife this email!!LOL
Carl

[Special T]

jack There is a guy that comes to the coyote roundup at Warden that shoots his 30-338 for yotes he says its real flat shooting! 

[Wanttohuntmore]

To find the break even point, one of the variables in the equation is "what is your time worth".  Some make enough that they cannot possibly break even.  That said, I reload 

You'll get better groups if you reload.  But, there is factory fodder that shoots darn good as well.

[bobcat]

You'll get better groups if you reload.  But, there is factory fodder that shoots darn good as well.

Not necessarily. For a while I had some factory loaded 270 Winchester shells, just the cheap ones, Powerpoints which were $12 at Wal Mart at the time. My Browning A bolt was shooting three shot groups at 100 yards with all three holes touching. The handloades shells I had at the time shot good, but not that good. I ended up using the factory loads for hunting season that year.

[JimmyHoffa]

The break even point can depend on cartridge selection.  Some rifle ammo is more...eh, much more....than others.  A box of 20 rounds for some guns can be $120.00 (not super specialty stuff).  Some even more than that.  As for the comment about the value of time.....think about what the hours spent reloading have prevented you from spending--so reloading is saving you money in ways you may not even know.

[Huntbear]

Sitting at the reloading bench is like fishing for me..  It is therapy.  A place to forget problems, and enjoy what I am doing.  That said, I own a wild cat, and normal guns as well.  I break even on all of em.  But then, I have owned my reloading equipment a long long time.

Do I shoot more, heck yea.. but when I can reload for pennies on the dollar, I still am ahead of the game, financially.

[JackOfAllTrades]

jack There is a guy that comes to the coyote roundup at Warden that shoots his 30-338 for yotes he says its real flat shooting! 

66.5gns of 4350 pushing a 190gn Hornady Boattail at 3150fps out the muzzle. Actually I loose a little accuracy pushing them that hard, so my accurate load that still shoots pretty flat is right around 3080fps.  I can get Speer 180Spitzers accurate at that speed too, but the Sierra 180BT is a tack driver at 2800fps.

It is not a Coyote rifle!

-Steve

[Bean Counter]

I'm not much one for reloading. I don't shoot enough nor does it interest me. I can group my el cheapo Federal Power Shoks out of my .30-06 in sub 2" groups at 200 yards.

wife: good golly, don't you have enough hunting crap as it is? 

[GWP]

As stated, you may not save any money, but you will shoot more, and be able to build loads for what you want. I loaded for a guy that shot 30-378 and 375 H&H, and it saved him a bunch of money. I have a 38 sp load I do for practice in my 357 that poops out at 650 FPS. On nice days you can see the bullet fly! I will often shoot 500-600 rounds in one sitting with it. I am sure I have saved cash on that one. I also did wildcats, but don't have any at this time.
If you want you can probably make the rounds you load more accurate then you are, but it takes a fair amount of time to produce that kind of accuracy. I have found now that I am getting older that pretty much standard reloading procedures are plenty accurate enough for the shooting I do.
It can get crazy though. At last count I was loading 19 different calibers. When I first got into it many years ago the guy that started me out begin laughing when I said I figured I would only load one caliber.
You will always end up using a single stage press for something, so that is a good place to start. It will also help you to learn the seperate procedures. Most dies interchange. LUBE YOUR BOTTLENECK CASES. Never throw away a loading manual. Have fun!

[sticky]

Thanks for all the great suggestions. I have priced a few kits and think I am going to buy an RCBS single stage press. My gunsmith says you can't go wrong with the rock chucker kit. It's a bit more than Lee or Hornady, but I don't mind paying a little more for better gear. I've also been checking around to see if I can find a used kit or one that was bought but never used. 

I'm sure I'll have more questions once I get set up. I appreciate the willingness of everyone here to share their knowledge and experiences.

[Huntbear]

Thanks for all the great suggestions. I have priced a few kits and think I am going to buy an RCBS single stage press. My gunsmith says you can't go wrong with the rock chucker kit. It's a bit more than Lee or Hornady, but I don't mind paying a little more for better gear. I've also been checking around to see if I can find a used kit or one that was bought but never used. 

I'm sure I'll have more questions once I get set up. I appreciate the willingness of everyone here to share their knowledge and experiences.

I believe there is a whole kit in the classifieds that has never been used.

[Jamieb]

I sure don't save any money by reloading, I'd never shoot half as much as I do if I shot factory ammo, especially with the price of RUM ammo or some of the Wby. cartridges.

[sticky]

I believe there is a whole kit in the classifieds that has never been used.

Thanks.  I had seen the ad before, and would love to have all that equipment, but that whole set is a little out of my price range.  Gun Broker has a few similar sets for auction.  I'm sure I will be able to find a good deal in time.

[Hilltop123]

You can save money by reloading, but it all comes down to dollars and cents. If you are not getting your components( powder, shot, bullets, primers, wads)  at the best price, you may be a longtime in breaking even. Take target shotgun loads for example, lets say you buy your shot at the local dept. store, here in this area it is Bi-Mart, a 25 pound bag of shot is over 35 bucks, hell pushing 40, I can remember when reclaimed was $15. With shot at these prices you maybe better off buying target loads when they come on sale, at $4.99 a box. There are cost per round calculators on the web, they are handy. But if your paying $25 for a pound of powder at one store, when you can get it for $22 at another, when it comes to reloading your just shooting yourself in the foot. Find a buddy that reloads and buy in bulk, some great buys can be made in bulk. There's some old timey tricks to getting  the most bang for your buck. But in this day and age of " this gun writer says it the way to go" world we sometime end up short changing ourselves and our wallets. 

[44 Flattop]

I have priced a few kits and think I am going to buy an RCBS single stage press. My gunsmith says you can't go wrong with the rock chucker kit. It's a bit more than Lee or Hornady, but I don't mind paying a little more for better gear.   

EXCELLENT choice! 

I've used the same RCBS Rockchucker for nearly 40 years now with zero problems.  Don't go cheap, get the best. 

Reloading won't let you shoot cheaper.  It will allow you to shoot MUCH MORE for the same money.  For instance I cast my own bullets and have never bought factory .44 mag ammunition.  But I have seen it up around $30 for 50 rounds.  I can handload 50 rounds for $2.63.  I get a whole lot more shooting' than the average bear....

44

[Alchase]

And the biggest reason to reload?

You get to buy new toys and have a new fun hobby that benefits your hunting and shooting skills. And you learn a ton about ballistics.

[LongRange300RUM]

The main reason i reload is because you get a more accurate and cleaner burning round. You get to choose all your own components and just for the fact I have fun doing it. Depending on what your reloading will depend on how fast it will pay for itself. I reload 300RUM 300Win 270Win and 25.06. I cost me about 75 cents to a dollar a round for those calibers (not including brass) So i guess i save about 50 to 75 percent by hand loading. But the biggest plus is the increased accuracy.

[Jekemi]

I've attached a spreadsheet to keep track of costs and comparisons. Feel free to modify it as you need. I've only been reloading for about 10 months. I've enjoyed every minute of it; especially enjoyed getting new equipment and trying out new loads, recipies, and loading new caliber's. It's a great hobby and something you can really sink your teeth into. I started out very simply and I'm gradually upgrading my equipment.

[sticky]

I like that setup you have.  When I finally buy my press and other gear, I am going to have to find a place to work.  I don't have a basement or enclosed garage to locate my reloading area.  I am thinking about building a corner table, anchored to the wall/floor, with some shelves below.  Don't quite have plans designed as of yet.

[grundy53]

I built my own. It was pretty cheap and easy. It's good and sturdy.

[halfpipe88]

Trying to quantify the break even point of reloading is like trying to find out how much meat you would have to shoot while hunting to break even...why?  It's the experience!  I love doing anything I can with my firearms so the cost of buying everything to reload was like buying a firearm to start hunting, a necessity to fuel the passion!

[300rum]

As far as 9mm goes, I reload for about $55/thousand.  .45 is about $70/thousand.  I have loaded 9k rounds so far this winter.  I shoot competitively and and that should pretty much get me through the season.  I have componets to double that except for the brass so I will shoot my brass twice this year.

The trick is to get free brass if you can find range pick up stuff, it lasts forever if you aren't shooting at high pressures.  You can also usually trade for brass so you don't have to put money "out of pocket".  I have brass where the headstamp is literally worn down to where you barley can read it (.45). 

I can find 9mm moly coated bullets for about $35/thousand and .45 for $40.50/thousand.

I can buy Titegroup for $13/pound on sale.  When it is on sale I will buy at least 8 pounds.  I like Titegroup for moly coated bullets but don't try it for lead(smoke).  Titegroup is about a dollar less than Clays, Titegroup is about the cheapest powder pistol that I can find.

I found a smoking deal on primers on Craigslist and bought 20k large/small primers at once.  I bought other stuff too but figure that I paid about $20/thousand where if you buy them in a store you are talking $30/thousand.

So, if you can get free brass you are way ahead.  For regular priced primers you can reasonable load 9mm for $65/thousand.  Find a good buy and buy in bulk.     

 

[Jekemi]

Sticky: it's a starter setup. I'm making changes all the time. Here's a few tips based on my own experience:
1. Lee dies are OK but get the Hornady locking rings and toss the Lee rings.
2. invest in a good digital scale. I bought a cheap one and it sucks. You can get a good one for under $100.
3. spend a little more on a powder measure. Hornady, Redding, and RCBS all have great ones. Ball powders work best in powder measures. Most powder measures cut the powder as its dispensed.
4. save up and get a good chronograph to check your muzzle velocity. It really helps in defining over all ballistic characteristics.
5. I'm building a new bench out of a solid core door. It will be 80 inches long and 30 inches deep. This will give me the stability I'm looking for. I'm also adding a couple of shelves above the bench to store powder, primers, etc. I want to have as little on the bench as possible. Keep the equipment on the bench and the consumables on the shelves.
that's my 2 cents worth. Have fun.

[Schwag173]

I don't have a basement or enclosed garage to locate my reloading area.  I am thinking about building a corner table, anchored to the wall/floor, with some shelves below.  Don't quite have plans designed as of yet.

It doesn't necessarily have to be bolted down as long as it's heavy and won't jiggle.  My reloading bench is an old wooden office desk that I modified.  I cut 4 layers of 3/4" plywood to fit the desktop, glued them together, squared and sanded the edges, then bolted the plywood 'top' onto the desk.  My progressive and single-stage presses were then bolted on top.  The whole setup (including all the lead bullets, dies and misc in the drawers ) make the desk heavy enough that it doesn't jiggle enough to matter during reloading.  Yet, I can still move it around when needed.

[Rgrady35]

http://www.oncefiredbrass.net/  I just got some brass there, got it in 2 days, looks good. Cheap enough.

[Rgrady35]

Mixed bag, I ordered 200 7mm Mag mostly R P and F C.

[Jekemi]

Sticky: there is a great article in this months February Handloader Magazine. Page 270 "From the Furgal Reloader." A complete breakdown  of the costs and break even point for reloading. Good article to read. BTW, my reloading bench is bolted down to an old dresser that I was going to get rid of. The top drawers serve as storage for various reloading parts and components and gun cleaning supplies. I'll take the old bench off and attach the new, longer stronger bench. Should be really nice. One other thing. Get yourself a good stool or office chair with a sturdy back. I'm using a bar stool and its pretty uncomfortable after a couple of hours.

[luv2shoot]

http://10xshooters.com/calculators/Rifle_Reloading_Cost_Calculator.htm

This is one of the better ones I've found. I can figure out cost per round even with equipment price included.