Revised Permit Totals for March 4-5th meeting

[dreamingbig]

Looks like they are piling on the yakima herd with increased permit levels...  A TON of anterless opportunities for modern firearm; an additional 450 modern firearm cow permits to be exact.

Bull Permit Increases

Peaches Ridge 
EF  98 to 120; +22
EM 17 to 20; +3
EA  74 to 81; +7

Goose Prairie
EF 55 to 77; +22
EM 8 to 13; +5
EA 60 to 70; +10

Observatory
EF 52 to 63; +11
EA

Anterless Increases

Little Naches
EF 75 to 150; +75

Rimrock
EF 50 to 200; +150

Manatash
EF 100 to 250; +150

Taneum
EF 75 to 150; +75

[Maverick]

why do they think have to kill everything? Let the herd grow so the hunting gets even better! Howd do they expect to grow good herds, and big bulls when they give out so many damn permits???

[Ridgerunner]

where did you get these?

[dreamingbig]

They don't make it easy and I think that is by design.

http://wdfw.wa.gov/commission/meetings/2011/03/mar0511_17a_deer_elk.pdf

[Elkaholic daWg]

   Now  would this be the answer to folks that double draw an elk   (Bull/Quality/Antlerless) permit and must eat one of them? As that article said..only 257 out of 397 S/P hunters actually hunted their permits!

http://sportsyakima.com/2011/02/elk-count-shows-strength-in-numbers/

[bobcat]

That's nothing- did you look at the increase in cow elk permits for the St. Helens herd?   

[dreamingbig]

Yes, I did see that.  They obviously don't want to commit to the current size of the St. Helen's herd.

[Bigshooter]

Yes, I did see that.  They obviously don't want to commit to the current size of the St. Helen's herd.

That's because there is NO winter range.  There have been several hard winters with winter kill.  A few years ago they said they were going to reduce the size of the St. Helen's herd.  They have up'd tag numbers and and some extra seasons.  But this year it is by far there biggest increase in tags for the St. Helens herd.

[gasman]

I don't remember the exact number, but the percentage of permit holders that are success full is not very high.
I'm pretty sure it is under 50%.

[KopperBuck]

I don't remember the exact number, but the percentage of permit holders that are success full is not very high.
I'm pretty sure it is under 50%.

That's a large range, and there are numbers in that range that I would consider to be a high percentage. What are you thinking specifically?

[gasman]

I don't remember the exact number, but the percentage of permit holders that are success full is not very high.
I'm pretty sure it is under 50%.

That's a large range, and there are numbers in that range that I would consider to be a high percentage. What are you thinking specifically?

My thoughts are, if teh success rate is lets say 50%. If they increase the permits by 50, then on average only 25 more animals would be harvested.
25, bug deal, the yotes and cougars take more then that a year.

I don't see these numbers as a big threat to our herds 

Many people  when the permits get reduced and some  when they get increased. To me, its not a huge deal, maybe it woul dgive me that .01% better chance of drawing, maybe not.

 

[DeerThug]

Like that is a big increase.  Sitting on the biggest herd there has been, tons of bulls.  At least 90 more paying hunters will have a chance at a bull before the winter tribal kill begins.

[Elkaholic daWg]

 Yeah but 3/4 of the tribal kill is over before winter. Did the commission approve these numbers?

[dreamingbig]

Did anyone go to the meeting?

[ramslam]

I was there.

[gasman]

I was there.

And 

[DeerThug]

AND???

Are we screwed again???

[BULLBLASTER]

there wasnt much talk of the permit increases in the st. helens heard. i voiced my opinion for it.
the majorty of the discussion was regarding the point minimums proposed for NE whitetail deer.

[elkinrutdrivemenuts]

What about the blues? Did they split the Dayton bull tags between the national forest and private lands like they had in their plan?

[dreamingbig]

there wasnt much talk of the permit increases in the st. helens heard. i voiced my opinion for it.
the majorty of the discussion was regarding the point minimums proposed for NE whitetail deer.

Did you happen to catch the recap of the new permit system by Phil Andersen?

[Elkaholic daWg]

there wasnt much talk of the permit increases in the st. helens heard. i voiced my opinion for it.
the majorty of the discussion was regarding the point minimums proposed for NE whitetail deer.

Did you happen to catch the recap of the new permit system by Phil Andersen?

I would REALLY like to hear that myself.

[bobcat]

Was it Phil Andersen or Dave Ware?

[Elkaholic daWg]

 I would accept either.

[dreamingbig]

Dave Ware I guess... how did you memorize the agenda? 

[bobcat]

Dave Ware I guess... how did you memorize the agenda?  

I just knew it was Dave Ware because that was the main topic at that meeting that I would have been interested in hearing, and I saw on the agenda that Dave Ware was going to be presenting the "results" of the newly revised permit system. Also I was at the meeting last year where Dave talked about it before it was approved by the Commission. I doubt Phil Andersen would know much about it. But of course it really doesn't matter because Dave Ware isn't honest about it and only tell the Commission what they want to hear.

[jstone]

I had a Taneum Cow Permit last year. I got my cow but didnt see bunches of cows?? Actually about the same # cows as Bulls. Dont think that there are enough cows??

[dreamingbig]

Anyone have an idea of when the minutes for this meeting will be posted online?

[Cougeyes]

I had a Taneum Cow Permit last year. I got my cow but didnt see bunches of cows?? Actually about the same # cows as Bulls. Dont think that there are enough cows??

I think that area has a lot of elk, people just need to get away from the roads.  That area gets hit hard with hunters, i've seen it first hand.  I have hunted that area most of my life and the mentality of a lot of the people hasn't changed.  Most wont get far from the roads or trails, aren't willing to actually work for an animal, break rules by cruising roads on motorcycles, quads etc...  The elk get smart and hide, go into thick reprod or deep canyons, areas most aren't willing to work.  I talked to other muzzy hunters this year up there and they said they noticed most elk were in reprod.  I am not all for adding more permits for antlerless harvest just because one year there was low success rates. 

[dreamingbig]

Audio transcripts are posted for those who want to hear what was said.  I can't wait to get home and listen!

http://wdfw.wa.gov/commission/meetings/2011/03/audio_mar0511.html

[jstone]

I do get way away from the roads and trails. I ride my mountain bike up past all the gates to the end of the roads. Stash it. Hick all day in the timber. Usually dont see anybody. Except somebody that camped on a saddle that is a great spot for elk and that could have been what changed the elk for my area last year. So yep i go steep and deep. End up riding out in the dark. Usually by my self.

[dreamingbig]

I am listening to Dave Ware's recap on the new permit system and a book title is coming to mind... "How to Lie with Statistics."

Some takeaways:

Bottom line, odds went down across the board (more hunter apps + less permits available).  Looking to increase permit fees in 2012; $6.50 to $13.00 in 2012 for quality hunt permits.  143k total permit apps in 2009 vs 233 permit apps in 2010.  Suggestion to have more special category for people with more than 10 points.  673 people were drawn for multiple permits; 311 for elk.