Custom Bike Cart - Elk Hauling Machine

[JPhelps]

PrimeTime and I have been working on these carts for the past month or so (made three).  They should be heavy load hauling machines.  The frame is designed to haul way more weight than the bike will be able to handle/stop.  They weigh in right at 20 lbs and pull awesome.  The last thing I need to do is add some "slime" tubes to the cart to make sure I don't get a flat.

Can't wait to try these things out with a bull this year.  We have been testing them with 100 lb loads of dog food and they have performed flawlessly.  We will be cranking the weight up to 200 lbs in the next week and see how they hold up.  The way Tyson's cart hooks up is a one off design that may be the best idea for a cart hookup to a bike that I have seen.  We are going to test it out this year and report back.  Mine just connects to the seat post.

[hunterofelk]

Going up hill is going to be tough.

[Special T]

I notice your bike has disk breaks... that  is good.. I would also guess disk brakes for the trailer but that's just me..

[bucklucky]

I want one !! Very cool!!

[JPhelps]

Yeah, I really wanted to add disc brakes to the trailer but It starts to become expensive.  The brake lines, hubs and everything else associated with trailer brakes are expensive.

We have hauled out 10+ elk (whole elk with bone in quarters) on a lot heavier cart and we dont have problems going down most hills with the disk brakes.  There are a few hills where I will just get off and walk down though.  Nice thing about the trailer is it helps hold you up (like training wheels) and you can go up hills slower than you normally could.

[TheHunt]

Your design is very simular to the cart that is sold by Kent Hawkins. 

http://www.hawkeyebilt.com/carts.html

[JPhelps]

Well, when it came to the design of the cart there are some things that just have to be the way they are.  In order to use old bike wheels the dual beam sysem is required.

We opted for the rectangular aluminum section rather than square.  The same weight but 3 times stronger in bending and 2 times stronger in shear.  We also added gussets to strengthen the connections and add some redundancy. 

Never really looked at the Hawkeye built carts to closely, but they do look well built.

[Kain]

Man that looks great.  I have been kicking around the idea of building one but just have not committed to a design yet.   BTW just looking at that seat hurts my a$$.   

[fair-chase]

JPhelps, why not just run solid tube tires so you don't have to worry about flats? Is the ride that much worse or is it just availability and pricing?

[pope]

20 lbs? I think you did well. Smart use of gussets, especially just behind the top beam. How much $ in materials (excluding wheels)? What dimension rectangular aluminum? What material is used for the "netting"?

[724wd]

only thing i see is the open tire tops.  a shifting quarter could rub/jam a wheel. 

[Kola16]

  I will mow your lawn for a year

[JPhelps]

We have solid tube tires on the other cart we have been using for years and I don't care that much for them.  They always have a "flat" feel to them.  I think they are 25 psi equivalent.  Maybe they make a harder solid tube?

Materials:
$50 in aluminum (1.5" x .75" tubing 1/8" wall)
$80 in aluminum welding
$15 studded spherical ball end
$10 in 2" polypro strapping (www.strapworks.com)

We cut all the pieces, chamfered all the edges, fit everything up, etc...  We just had to have someone weld it.

As far as the open tires, we looked into welding cages around them but we wanted to keep the weight down and elected to try and use strapping to secure the load from shifting (We will see how that works).

[ELKBURGER]

sounds like you have some orders coming in. Looks great!

[brianmtsinc]

Jphelps,
Are you selling these?  If so, I might have two orders for you 

[Elkpiss]

Is you Brother Chris Phelps? Your from PeEl, so i am assuming so.. Tell Him Corey Archibald From Tenino Said hello, havent seen him since college..  Nifty looking carts you got there as well.. I use one of those carts that you through a kid into, they seem to work fine.. 

[slim9300]

Well, when it came to the design of the cart there are some things that just have to be the way they are.  In order to use old bike wheels the dual beam sysem is required.

We opted for the rectangular aluminum section rather than square.  The same weight but 3 times stronger in bending and 2 times stronger in shear.  We also added gussets to strengthen the connections and add some redundancy. 

Never really looked at the Hawkeye built carts to closely, but they do look well built.

You don't need brakes on the trailer since you have disk brakes on your bike. Trust me. =) They would be nice, but they are an expensive hassle that we ended up sh$& canning in the end. When in doubt, throw 50 lbs. of meat on your back for the wet and steep downhill rides.

Nice cart. Hawkeye makes one just like that. I have an "older" Hawkeye that's a little bigger... It's hauled a lot of elk out for my buddy and I. We have used the Slime triple thick tires for years, and never a single flat.

Here's a pic of mine with an entire 5x5 and the pack frames. 14 miles back in your neck of the woods. =)

[TheHunt]

Slim9300 nice cart...  If Hawkeye has a patent on the cart design you will be looking for trouble if you start selling them.  There is just tooo many simularities between his and yours.  The webbing is another he uses gill net for it and you use straps.  Something to think about is if you picked up say 13 people from Seattle and they looked at these two carts in court would they say they look the same?  I am just trying to help you out before you pull the trigger and start selling them. 

[slim9300]

Slim9300 nice cart...  If Hawkeye has a patent on the cart design you will be looking for trouble if you start selling them.  There is just tooo many simularities between his and yours.  The webbing is another he uses gill net for it and you use straps.  Something to think about is if you picked up say 13 people from Seattle and they looked at these two carts in court would they say they look the same?  I am just trying to help you out before you pull the trigger and start selling them.

I doubt there is a patent, but who knows. Should be very easy to look up. Wayne (the owner and retired logger) is a good guy that just did it out of his garage. I don't even think he builds them anymore.

[TheHunt]

I thought their names were Kent Hawkins and his son was Mike.  But it was a long time ago when I met them at the Blacktail Country meeting some years ago so I might be wrong.  I remember it because they gave one of their carts away in a raffle.  And I did not win it. 

As for a patent...  So here is what I know from working in the High Tech industry.  If you put an idea with an inferred design on the internet you can challenge someone who then patents it.  The patent challenger has the right to prove they had the intellectual property prior to the patent requester or holder for that matter.  If they have made any money associated within when it is challenged that money can be challenged as well in court. 

[brianb231]

Its a friggin box frame with two wheels attached to it!!! I mean really..... I would not be very concerned about a patent infringement. Plus it just has to be altered bye certain percentage. I think the fact you are using rect tubing versus square and the nylon strapping versus rope or whatever they are using would be enough if you were really worried about it. Just an off the cuff comment. Take it for what it is worth.

Good lookin cart though!

[slim9300]

I thought their names were Kent Hawkins and his son was Mike.  But it was a long time ago when I met them at the Blacktail Country meeting some years ago so I might be wrong.  I remember it because they gave one of their carts away in a raffle.  And I did not win it. 

As for a patent...  So here is what I know from working in the High Tech industry.  If you put an idea with an inferred design on the internet you can challenge someone who then patents it.  The patent challenger has the right to prove they had the intellectual property prior to the patent requester or holder for that matter.  If they have made any money associated within when it is challenged that money can be challenged as well in court.

Lol. Maybe his name was Kent.

It was long time ago when I drove down to northern OR to his house and bought the cart.

[JPhelps]

At this time we are just using the carts for personal use.  We are going to try and push these things to their max and see if they hold up.

As far as patent infringement, I didn't think you could have a patent on welding aluminum together in squares and triangles.  Now I could see patents on the connection type or other things special about the cart.  A patent is put on something "new", "non obvious", and "useful".

I called the guys up at Hawkeye Carts today.  I believe I talked to Mike.  We BS'd about the cart designs and the differences.  We talked about the strength of the frames, different wheel sizes, connection types, etc...  He said that they did have a patent on their connection type and a poor man's patent on something to do with the frame.  I just use a studded spherical ball joint for 360* of rotation.  It was a good conversation and I enjoy talking hunting with anyone and everyone.  Afterall that's why we are all here, right?  I hope he gets on here and comments on the carts, I am all ears.

My intention is not to steal anyones ideas.  I am a stand-up guy and if the Hawkins guys' have the right to any part of the design I will do the right thing and talk to them before I ever pursue manufacturing these things.

Now time to go see how this thing does with 200 lbs.

[HOYT6.0]

Thats a sweet looking cart.  I always use my kids cart all wrapped up with game bags.  Wife gets a little ticked about it,  but it cleans up fine.     I would buy one of those dudes if you had it for sale.  Thats for sure. 

[ICEMAN]

Nice build.
 
Did you consider building with the same rims and tubes as your bikes? Easier to repair with less parts to carry...

[colockumelk]

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