nile paper says muck's shot 140+/- deer last weekend?

[724wd]

the rez is your land and you should be able to do whatever you like on it (including booting non-indians selling alcohol off, since that's come up before). 

[colockumelk]

 

And in my last post bigbulls i was listing what most people frustrations are. And since you asked a few ideas that would help out. I don't think I have ever seen on this website someone advocating takomg tje reservations or the right to govern your reservations away.

[igotbigbulls]

I understand that colock but there are some who say down with the treaties maybe not understanding what they are actually trying to say I guess. I was trying to get out of hunter360 exactly how far he would like us go in giving things up. But ya I appreciate your input and understand where the frustration comes from when some seem to flaunt there rights in front you.

[longknife]

We understand your reservations are yours, but when it comes to PUBLIC hunting land, we think it should be fair, thats all..
We are tired of seeing our money that goes to conservation of meat in our freezer deminish, as we keep pouring money, it should pay off, but it hasent/wont til things change.

Coach,,,this is a place to start, to let them see what it is we have agenst what they do to our rights. Like bigbulls stated, its something he never thought was such a problem.

[724wd]

I say the treaties should be amended to say tribal members must abide by the WDFW regulations.  Exceptions being:  ceremonial harvest (marriage/birth/death - contact WDFW liasion to procure ceremonial tag) and the opportunity to kill additional animals for elderly family members unable to hunt themselves (with purchase of tag - perhaps at a reduced rate?). 

so what do the indians on this site think of this?

[longknife]

I think the thing that gets me is the party hunting (public hunting land).
We cant hunt for our elders, unless they are present, and they have to have a disability(any limb problem). Yes, that means no disabilities rights to deaf people, people with one eye, ect.. it has to be limb related.
They have to be PRESENT while we hunt for them, or they are the only ones able to hunt from a vehicle. This is a long process, and is confirmed by doctors/game dept.

[igotbigbulls]

i think there is a lot more to this subject than you think there is.  what you want is not such a simple solution in the grand scheme of things. telling people who have hunted and fished since time immemorial that have faced opposition and reserved a right to continue to hunt and fish in there usual and accustomed places to now change there way drastically and suddenly is not going to fly. but as we have discussed there are more subtle ways to start out. such as the accurate harvest reporting as this is a conservation issue for sure. stiffer penalties for illegal poaching. do we not agree that with accurate numbers we can much better see where the issues of what and where harvesting can be adjusted? but by asking for a ceremonial harvest tag to be purchased will for sure come off as an insult along with feeding our elders for a purchase of a tag. now i know you will probably not agree with me. for most its much more than hunting, but as you have shown, for others its about abusing there rights for self gratification without thinking of the consequences associated. there are many issues to hash over and bring to the attention of ones who can make a change.

but you must realize too longknife that the findings are that there is a difference between rights and privileges. what we have are rights reserved for hunting and so forth but state hunting is a privilege that can be revoked by the state as they see fit. so its not just a one way street in getting change.there are things that you must do also to make a change for yourselves. and yeah i think its a stupid law that if an elder or disabled person must be present to be hunted for, makes no sense.

[Coastal_native]

I say the treaties should be amended to say tribal members must abide by the WDFW regulations.  Exceptions being:  ceremonial harvest (marriage/birth/death - contact WDFW liasion to procure ceremonial tag) and the opportunity to kill additional animals for elderly family members unable to hunt themselves (with purchase of tag - perhaps at a reduced rate?). 

so what do the indians on this site think of this?

I would be opposed to anything that takes away the tribes ability to self regulate/govern themselves.  I would not be opposed to a process that allows for tribes to conduct gov to gov co managment efforts in ceded areas.  Both parties would chip in on population monitioring/management concerns and walk away with a baseline from which they can both develope regulations to meet the needs of their constituants and to ensure conservation.

Some of the the things I would like to see changed in my region are better enforcement, stiffer penalties for violations, a more strict process for determining eligible designated hunters, and a renewed effort to educate young tribal members on the cultural importance of fish and wildlife and determining what consitutes a need.

[igotbigbulls]

i also agree on the education of younger tribal members on the cultural importance of fish and wildlife and determining what consitutes a need. that point was well said coastal.

[remington300mag]

I know in the past I have posted some things on here that have been heated.....

I would like to take this chance to say.....The last few comments by BigBulls and Coastal, not to mention Plats comments, Give me hope that one day things can be fixed! That maybe someday the Cowboys and the Indians can share the same camp fire and all play nice together! That is what I would hope happens......someday!

Hearing the dialog here lately has given me hope.......Thank you!

[colockumelk]

Igotbigbulls there isn't anything in that post I disagree with. Spot on brother. Except what is immemmorial    just kidding loved your post. 

Coastal you basically said tje same thing but I made an oath to disagree with everything you say. So I think you are wrong. 

[hunter360]

colock i agree with you on the point of just cuz it legal doesnt make it right. i am not yakama so i can not speak for them on what they do or dont do. i am not one who would advocate taking more than 1 BAB a year either. no point in it. IMO


hunter 360
are you saying that for hunting in our ceded area only or for on reservation rights too? you want WDFW to regulate the game on the reservation? or would you want us to give the reservation land back for all to hunt on also?

Yes I'm saying make everyone equal. To make everyone equal either give everyone reservations, or get rid of them all. This isn't the united states of america with little indian countries inside of our country. We are all referred to as citizens of america, not citizens of the united states of indian reservations.
You said you have rights to hunting and I have privileges.....that's bullsh!t in itself. My great grandparents that went through the great depression used hunting as a huge (and sometimes only) source of food for our family. We have been hunting from the beginning of time too, there is no difference between your indian family and my white family.
Everyone screams equal rights until it comes down to taking special privileges away from themselves.
Do you really think you should have more rights than I do just because of your skin color? That would be discrimination against me now wouldn't it? Isn't this country against that?

[CedarPants]

I was literally just typing this:  "Glad to see we are all getting along on page 25 .... but this is the point where someone will derail the conversation yet again"

Couldn't even finish typing it before it actually happened.  So predictable

[hunter360]

I was literally just typing this:  "Glad to see we are all getting along on page 25 .... but this is the point where someone will derail the conversation yet again"

Couldn't even finish typing it before it actually happened.  So predictable

I wasn't trying to start a fight. He asked me questions about what I thought, so I answered them. Do you want me to lie? It's also predictable to have someone that disagree's with someone else to try and make that person feel bad for what he believes in. How unfortunate.

[coachcw]

just the fact the indians are willing to come on here and debate is great . I do believe that the tribes have to impose there limits and regulations with respect to the wdfw and us fellow hunters . It's really all about management and the 50% base line seeems out dated to me . I understand that the yaks have no tag system and limit on deer and elk , so there nothing keeping a few members from open slaughtering . So if the few of you that work hard for management can help take care of those,  the problems and conflict between us ( licenced wdfw hunters ) and your selves would be greatly diminished . So i believe a tag system(even if its two or three elk , one bull and two cows) and the ability for wdfw to inforese them of the rez would be a good thing and the tribe could do as they please on the rez.