Free: Contests & Raffles.
Quote from: CedarPants on November 04, 2011, 07:20:48 AMI was literally just typing this: "Glad to see we are all getting along on page 25 .... but this is the point where someone will derail the conversation yet again"Couldn't even finish typing it before it actually happened. So predictableI wasn't trying to start a fight. He asked me questions about what I thought, so I answered them. Do you want me to lie? It's also predictable to have someone that disagree's with someone else to try and make that person feel bad for what he believes in. How unfortunate.
I was literally just typing this: "Glad to see we are all getting along on page 25 .... but this is the point where someone will derail the conversation yet again"Couldn't even finish typing it before it actually happened. So predictable
Quote from: hunter360 on November 04, 2011, 07:28:34 AMQuote from: CedarPants on November 04, 2011, 07:20:48 AMI was literally just typing this: "Glad to see we are all getting along on page 25 .... but this is the point where someone will derail the conversation yet again"Couldn't even finish typing it before it actually happened. So predictableI wasn't trying to start a fight. He asked me questions about what I thought, so I answered them. Do you want me to lie? It's also predictable to have someone that disagree's with someone else to try and make that person feel bad for what he believes in. How unfortunate.I was referring to your delivery, not your points. Intent was not to make you feel bad
Posted by: hunter360« on: Today at 06:57:39 AM » Insert Quote Quote from: igotbigbulls on Yesterday at 03:01:44 PMcolock i agree with you on the point of just cuz it legal doesnt make it right. i am not yakama so i can not speak for them on what they do or dont do. i am not one who would advocate taking more than 1 BAB a year either. no point in it. IMOhunter 360are you saying that for hunting in our ceded area only or for on reservation rights too? you want WDFW to regulate the game on the reservation? or would you want us to give the reservation land back for all to hunt on also?Yes I'm saying make everyone equal. To make everyone equal either give everyone reservations, or get rid of them all. This isn't the united states of america with little indian countries inside of our country. We are all referred to as citizens of america, not citizens of the united states of indian reservations. You said you have rights to hunting and I have privileges.....that's bullsh!t in itself. My great grandparents that went through the great depression used hunting as a huge (and sometimes only) source of food for our family. We have been hunting from the beginning of time too, there is no difference between your indian family and my white family. Everyone screams equal rights until it comes down to taking special privileges away from themselves. Do you really think you should have more rights than I do just because of your skin color? That would be discrimination against me now wouldn't it? Isn't this country against that? my comment is this.i disagree with whats hilighted in red.U.S. vs. Washington states, "Indian tribes cannot rescind a treaty agreement or limit non-Indian fishing pursuant to the agreement, but off-reservation fishing by other citizens and residents of the state is not a right but a privilege which may be granted, limited or withdrawn by the state as the interests of the state or exercise of the treaty fishing rights may require."and as far as discrimination goes in this country. isnt that how this country came to be about, fighting wars with other countries and indiginous people for there own want and gain? thats how the treaties came about and reservations and so on. so that the people here first would still have a place to call home and contiue their practices for future generations.
The way I see it is the problem with Washington is that it's government is corrupt. The purpose of WDFW enforcement is to fine it's citizenry for whatever it's Officers can make up. It's the same with cops and State Patrol. If they can't tax it or make us pay for a license an application, or registration then it is a tax in the form of petty laws. No ethics, no honor, just pay the Queen. (It is her deer.) There is no money in going after the tribes so WDFW does not care. If they could get money by policing them I think they would. But tribes will fight everything in court, we just pay fines and move on. So we are suckers and well, they are not. The way to tackle this is head on. The Tribes are also all about money. Between fish and wildlife and casinos they are swimming in revenue that every other citizen could never dream of. Mostly because they are free of the socialism that we face. No taxes, no regulations, I envy them. I also admire them. They don't take it. We do. If you don't like the system, if you don't like the game vote. Most of us should have gotten a ballot. This year, next year are very important ones. VOTE. Change the game. Want to get their attention, tax their casinos, there is some revenue for WDFW. What I would like the Tribes (Yakima) to do? Make some fair rules and hunting seasons, punish true Tribal crimes, enforce their own or loose the tax free gravy train, end of that sweet gambling money. Then tax them in all other industries as any other American Company OR as a Foreign Business working inside of the United States, whatever they classify themselves as.
No hard feelings Hunter360, and I apologize as well.
telling people who have hunted and fished since time immemorial that have faced opposition and reserved a right to continue to hunt and fish in there usual and accustomed places to now change there way drastically and suddenly is not going to fly.
I would be opposed to anything that takes away the tribes ability to self regulate/govern themselves. I would not be opposed to a process that allows for tribes to conduct gov to gov co managment efforts in ceded areas. Both parties would chip in on population monitioring/management concerns and walk away with a baseline from which they can both develope regulations to meet the needs of their constituants and to ensure conservation. Some of the the things I would like to see changed in my region are better enforcement, stiffer penalties for violations, a more strict process for determining eligible designated hunters, and a renewed effort to educate young tribal members on the cultural importance of fish and wildlife and determining what consitutes a need."
Quote from: igotbigbulls on November 04, 2011, 07:58:35 AMCoastal, your post Quote I would be opposed to anything that takes away the tribes ability to self regulate/govern themselves. I would not be opposed to a process that allows for tribes to conduct gov to gov co managment efforts in ceded areas. Both parties would chip in on population monitioring/management concerns and walk away with a baseline from which they can both develope regulations to meet the needs of their constituants and to ensure conservation. Some of the the things I would like to see changed in my region are better enforcement, stiffer penalties for violations, a more strict process for determining eligible designated hunters, and a renewed effort to educate young tribal members on the cultural importance of fish and wildlife and determining what consitutes a need." are all great points. the one thing i have issue with though, is your first sentence "I would be opposed to anything that takes away the tribes ability to self regulate/govern themselves." It's been stated here that in certain circumstances (murder, for one), the tribe does not govern themselves and relies on the US government to do it for them. why does the tribe not handle their matters solely on their own if truly soverign? seems like on the reservation (your nation) you can make whatever laws you want and enforce them how you see fit, as is your right and I have no beef with that. but once you leave the reservation, shouldn't you have to abide the laws of the locality? It should be no different than a canadian coming to the US... they have to follow our laws. if wolves are shoot-on-sight vermin in canada, canadians can't come to the US and blast away, as much as we might like them to!It's not that we rely on the US Govt. for the enforcement of Felonies it's the way the US Govt. set it up. Our court systems are allowed up to Felonies anything Felony and above is turned over to the Feds (FBI). On the rez Tribal Police have jurisdiction over Tribal Members unless they committed on offense on land/property that is owned by a different jurisdiction (that's a long discussion on its own so I'll skip the breakdown).Off the Rez we are subject to the local jurisdiction except in the cases of hunting, fishing and gathering of traditional foods in Ceded Areas. The Tribe "RESERVED" those rights (not granted or given) and have exclusive jurisdiction over Tribal Members.Coastal's post was about the best way to approach these types of issues right now.
Coastal, your post Quote I would be opposed to anything that takes away the tribes ability to self regulate/govern themselves. I would not be opposed to a process that allows for tribes to conduct gov to gov co managment efforts in ceded areas. Both parties would chip in on population monitioring/management concerns and walk away with a baseline from which they can both develope regulations to meet the needs of their constituants and to ensure conservation. Some of the the things I would like to see changed in my region are better enforcement, stiffer penalties for violations, a more strict process for determining eligible designated hunters, and a renewed effort to educate young tribal members on the cultural importance of fish and wildlife and determining what consitutes a need." are all great points. the one thing i have issue with though, is your first sentence "I would be opposed to anything that takes away the tribes ability to self regulate/govern themselves." It's been stated here that in certain circumstances (murder, for one), the tribe does not govern themselves and relies on the US government to do it for them. why does the tribe not handle their matters solely on their own if truly soverign? seems like on the reservation (your nation) you can make whatever laws you want and enforce them how you see fit, as is your right and I have no beef with that. but once you leave the reservation, shouldn't you have to abide the laws of the locality? It should be no different than a canadian coming to the US... they have to follow our laws. if wolves are shoot-on-sight vermin in canada, canadians can't come to the US and blast away, as much as we might like them to!
Quote from: Wenatcheejay on November 04, 2011, 08:24:17 AMThe way I see it is the problem with Washington is that it's government is corrupt. The purpose of WDFW enforcement is to fine it's citizenry for whatever it's Officers can make up. It's the same with cops and State Patrol. If they can't tax it or make us pay for a license an application, or registration then it is a tax in the form of petty laws. No ethics, no honor, just pay the Queen. (It is her deer.) There is no money in going after the tribes so WDFW does not care. If they could get money by policing them I think they would. But tribes will fight everything in court, we just pay fines and move on. So we are suckers and well, they are not. The way to tackle this is head on. The Tribes are also all about money. Between fish and wildlife and casinos they are swimming in revenue that every other citizen could never dream of. Mostly because they are free of the socialism that we face. No taxes, no regulations, I envy them. I also admire them. They don't take it. We do. If you don't like the system, if you don't like the game vote. Most of us should have gotten a ballot. This year, next year are very important ones. VOTE. Change the game. Want to get their attention, tax their casinos, there is some revenue for WDFW. What I would like the Tribes (Yakima) to do? Make some fair rules and hunting seasons, punish true Tribal crimes, enforce their own or loose the tax free gravy train, end of that sweet gambling money. Then tax them in all other industries as any other American Company OR as a Foreign Business working inside of the United States, whatever they classify themselves as.I think we covered the tax thing...
Quote from: Ddog73 on November 04, 2011, 09:29:56 AMQuote from: Wenatcheejay on November 04, 2011, 08:24:17 AMThe way I see it is the problem with Washington is that it's government is corrupt. The purpose of WDFW enforcement is to fine it's citizenry for whatever it's Officers can make up. It's the same with cops and State Patrol. If they can't tax it or make us pay for a license an application, or registration then it is a tax in the form of petty laws. No ethics, no honor, just pay the Queen. (It is her deer.) There is no money in going after the tribes so WDFW does not care. If they could get money by policing them I think they would. But tribes will fight everything in court, we just pay fines and move on. So we are suckers and well, they are not. The way to tackle this is head on. The Tribes are also all about money. Between fish and wildlife and casinos they are swimming in revenue that every other citizen could never dream of. Mostly because they are free of the socialism that we face. No taxes, no regulations, I envy them. I also admire them. They don't take it. We do. If you don't like the system, if you don't like the game vote. Most of us should have gotten a ballot. This year, next year are very important ones. VOTE. Change the game. Want to get their attention, tax their casinos, there is some revenue for WDFW. What I would like the Tribes (Yakima) to do? Make some fair rules and hunting seasons, punish true Tribal crimes, enforce their own or loose the tax free gravy train, end of that sweet gambling money. Then tax them in all other industries as any other American Company OR as a Foreign Business working inside of the United States, whatever they classify themselves as.I think we covered the tax thing...About as well as WDFW has. 26 pages of blame, ZERO fixing the problem. Priceless. But I am not worried, there is always hope for page 27......