high fenced "preserve" hunt

[JimmyHoffa]

I beg to differ. There are NO high fence hunts that are are by any means, "very much fair chase hunts".

You can beg to differ all you like. If you want to say a 20,000 acre preserve is not a very much fair chase hunt you have no idea

Good luck convincing anybody with any common sense on that statement. There's no such thing as high fences in fair chase hunting. With your wealth of information, I'd have figured you knew that.

I agree with carp.  It varies by operation.  Animals have home ranges that in many cases are smaller than the operation.  So the animal isn't really confined at all.  Some places, whitetails will spend their entire life within an area about 1/2 square mile.  An animal like that will likely not be affected by the fence if the land is large enough.  One place an old neighbor would go to was only like 120 acres, but had about 100 deer on it (most bucks were extremely large).  They would have all kinds of guys go there with their bows talking about how many deer they've killed elsewhere, but those guys rarely even saw any of the deer.  What are thoughts regarding hunting on an island?  The animals are basically fenced there too.

[lokidog]

Jimmy, don't go there with the island thing... everyone thinks they just walk right up to us already!     

[carpsniperg2]

  Some very points jimmy.

Lokidog its o.k your swamp rats are still great animals

[bobcat]

I simply do not agree with the private ownership of big game animals, and that's basically what you're doing if you're fencing them in. It doesn't happen in this state because it's illegal (at least there's one good thing about living here). It's the commercialization of hunting that I don't like. It's bad for the image of hunters and hunting all the way around, no matter how you want to look at it. Like I said, I couldn't care less if people want to pay to hunt non-native animals like hogs, goats, or whatever. But I just don't like seeing our native deer and elk turned into nothing but livestock.

[MtnMuley]

Agree with whoever. No worries here, because if an animal wants to drink from a nearby creek or seek refuge in a wooded area and is prevented from being able to do so because of an enclosed high fence preventing it, it is not fair chase. Fact.

[lokidog]

Hey, my "swamp rat" from this year had as much meat on it as the WT I pulled out of Saskatchewan, though the SK buck was just a 4X4 youngun.   

 

You can own the land, but you CANNOT own the wildlife that uses it.

How does that work with fencing an area preventing state "owned" wildlife from leaving?  Bobcat, how is it prevented from happening here?  Zoning doesn't allow for a deer/elk proof fence unless the animals are cleared out first?  Or is it just hunting inside one?  And how could that be legal preventing you from hunting your own land if that's the case?   

[bearpaw]

Just to clarify, I am pretty sure a private landowner can high fence any property in WA unless you are in town and there are restrictions agaist it. A landowner does not own any wild animals and anyone hunting wild animals inside the fence must purchase a hunting license and tags and follow seasons just the same as if he was hunting outside the fence.

Another thing that I would point out, South Africa has gone to more wildlife ranching and less livestock and it has been good for the wildlife and the country. Texas will most likely have hunting on private ranches long after hunting has been banned on public lands in other states. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying high fenced hunting is the only way to go, I am saying it doesn't hurt for it to happen for the folks who want to hunt that way. We used to call this a free country. 

[carpsniperg2]

I simply do not agree with the private ownership of big game animals, and that's basically what you're doing if you're fencing them in. It doesn't happen in this state because it's illegal (at least there's one good thing about living here). It's the commercialization of hunting that I don't like. It's bad for the image of hunters and hunting all the way around, no matter how you want to look at it. Like I said, I couldn't care less if people want to pay to hunt non-native animals like hogs, goats, or whatever. But I just don't like seeing our native deer and elk turned into nothing but livestock.

I understand that point 100%. There is many ways people look at that as well. There is good and bad and I understand both sides of it. Like the buffalo I am no expert on the subject, but I know if it was not for breeding programs and a lot of work to get them back. There would not be any left. There is bad that comes from farming wildlife as well. To me I really don't mind either way. It is not legal to enclose wild animals and own them, but if the animals are stock and raised from stock then its legal. So as long as it is legal it does not bother me if people raise them or own them. Wild animals are wild and not owned by any person. That's the way that it should be and I agree with that.

Words well wrote Dale

[PolarBear]

I don't care so much if it's non-native big game species that are being "hunted" inside a fence, but I'm 100% against any kind of high fence hunting for native species of deer and elk in this country. Which I guess would mainly be Rocky Mountain elk and whitetail deer. Wildlife is supposed to belong to the public, not fenced in and used for the profit of landowners.

I was watching RFDTV and they had an elk auction at some ranch in Oregon.  The were selling live bulls and sheds for huge prices.  My hunting buddy ran into one of the guys from this ranch at a livestock sale in Hermiston and he said that you wouldn't believe how many guys pay tens of thousands of dollars for huge bulls just to have them trucked to their ranch, released and immediately "hunted" down in in a round pen or fenced in pasture.  I can see buying top notched bulls to enhance a herd but to shoot it right out of a trailer with an ear tag still in it is about as sick as it gets in the "hunting" world.  Kinda like Troy Gentry shooting a bear in a pen.   

[bobcat]

I wasn't saying building a fence is illegal here. What's illegal is game farms. However I do know certain counties do regulate the types of fences people put up, so that in migratory areas the animals cannot be kept from getting to their winter range. I know this is the case in Okanogan County (Methow Valley in particular) but not sure about anywhere else.

[carpsniperg2]

Thats right polar bear nothing fair chase about it. Its a harvest not a hunt. This is a free country and people can do as they like. As long as it is legal. Its up to them and its there money. I would rather see someone go dump a elk instead of donating that chunk of change to peta or something like that it all come down to letting people do what they want as long as its legal. Some people may be against it but there are much worse things out there then people paying to shoot a elk. To each there own my friends

[bearpaw]

I wasn't saying building a fence is illegal here. What's illegal is game farms. However I do know certain counties do regulate the types of fences people put up, so that in migratory areas the animals cannot be kept from getting to their winter range. I know this is the case in Okanogan County (Methow Valley in particular) but not sure about anywhere else.

I didn't know that about migration routes, makes sense for that reason.

There are game farms, you have to get a game farm license. There are game farms with and without high fence. Depends on the animals you have if you need high fence. There are hunting areas in Washington which hunt native species in season and hunt feral species at other times of the year. WDFW has a list of what you can and cannot own and release or introduce within a fence. I know because I have looked into it, you can find the list on their website if you dig.

[carpsniperg2]

That is 100% correct they do not allow some animals, even exotic to be in preserves. They don't want the chance of any disease and also some animals can be very harmful if they were to become free. There is more then a few places in washington that have elk and deer still on there farm. Heck one of them is just down the river from me. It's still legal to own them and have them. It just has to be done the right way. Plus you have to pay taxes then it all works out

[deerhunter_98520]

let me ask you guys this...with these elk that they raise to ''trophy'' size and charge $20k+ to kill one...how wild are this things...if their raised in pens and let go around june or july when there 8 yrs old and mature animals...are dinner bells part of their hunting gear?...ding ding ding....get ready here he comes! hurry shoot  him before he gets to close i dont have any feed!

[bearpaw]

We do privately owned buffalo hunts in Montana and those buffalo are sometimes more wild than the wild ones that never get hunted in YNP. Carp is right about the buffalo, if it wasn't for private herds and Indian reservations there would not be many buffalo.

_________________________

Carp, they can't actually own wild animals, they may control access, but they don't own them. They can own the animals that are not wild animals.