Frontal Shots

[JPhelps]

What is your opinion on this shot?

In Episode 2 of Primetime Outdoors Archery Roosevelt Elk hunt I took this shot at 31 yds.  There was a little discussion over the shot.
http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php?topic=95483.0

Here is some info on elk vitals: http://www.idahostatebowhunters.org/elkshotplacement%201.pdf
They do not recommend the frontal shot.

If you will take it do you have any set distance limitations?

I personally have never taken the shot before.  I have done a ton of reading on the shot and where to aim and what your confidence should be before taking the shot.  You have a very small window to take out the vitals.  I had been practicing every other day and knew at 31 yds I would hit within an inch of where I was aiming (I used my inch to the left).

PROS:
Extremely effective

CONS:
Small Window
Lack of blood due to thick hair

Let's hear what you think.  Lets make this an educational post and avoid arguing.

[carpsniperg2]

I first elk was almost a perfect strait on shot only the smallest of turn to the right. I hit the money shot and the elk went about 10 yards before dropping in a dead run. It is a small % shot that can go bad. I have no problem shooting those shots. They are not for everyone. I practice a ton and feel very solid with all my equipment. So 9/10 times I would take that shot under 40 yards. My gear has the killing power to make it work and I should always be able to hit that money spot for a quick clean kill. That first elk of mine was 36yards on the shot.

[STIKNSTRINGBOW]

I passed on a very similar shot last season, and still wonder...
But, then I would pass again, but that is just me, and why you harvested an animal, and the only one I shot was at a grouse.
In my defence, I use a recurve, and my group at that distance is more like 5 inches, (or 2 and 1/2 by your guide) a little off, and 
Not worth the chance to me.
funny though, while we (my wife and I ) were watching it, we thought you took the shot because a few seconds earlier you had a great broadside, but he did not stop, we figure you were amped up, and "just did it" when you saw your next op. 
Does not really matter, an animal down, GREAT SHOT !!

[TikkaT3-270Shortmag]

Not my preferred shot but if I was 40 yds or closer I wouldn't hesitate. You made a great shot that not just anyone can do.

[WAcoyotehunter]

I would not take it.  It's a higher risk shot and more likely to lead to a lost elk.  I always want broadside or quartered away.  Killing an elk is awesome, but losing one is heartbreaking and not worth a risk.  I want to shoot the highest percentage shots at close distances- i limit my range to 30 yards.

[bucklucky]

So here is my take, my first elk (cow) I had a quartering to me frontal and took it . placed the arrow right in front of the front leg and made a perfect heart shot. Called in a bull back in 2006, came in to 15 yards quartered too me heavily, though hell yeah 15 yards no brainer....... that little bit of mistake made my arrow hit the ribs in front and glance alont the ribs in between the shoulder and ribs. Think of it like this , look at a picket ffence from the side and you have slots that are open and 1 rib to penetrate to get to the vital, now start walking around it and the slats come together..  He went 20 yards and stood for a half hour, I couldnt move to get a shot in the celial and there was a vine maple in my way, mind changed he cought my wind and started wallking away. He left 2 monster blood spots , looked like a 5 gallon bucket was dumped. Strted pooring down rain so I had to persue , blood stopped and the bull was long gone. He was going almost verticle as I was following him up and down the mountain. Thats the last time I will take a frontal. I have passed on some bulls on the west side that most people would love to have a chance at just because of a frontal shot. Had a 360 bull in the alpine I called in in 2007 I passed on because it was a frontal shot. Just wasy too iffy of a shot In my opinion, I dont care how good of a shot a person thinks they are. I have had a ton of stoories of bulls lost because of frontal shots taken when people come in the taxidermy shop. I could have burried and arrow into the chest of a 350 bull on my hunt this year but passed ...... Not a good shot to take . With a rifle no problem. I have killed more deer with a frontal and a rifle than I can count.

[deerslyr]

  Not gunna get into a pissing match with some one who disagrees but its just a low percentage shot any way you look at it, dont matter how good of an archer you are its still a low percentage shot. I shoot everyday and still wouldnt take it. Not because I doubt my ability, but because its a low percentage shot.

[nwhunter]

I agree its a low percentage shot, alot can go wrong with not much movement of the animal before the arrow hits. For  me its a 20 yard and under shot. I passed a 370 bull that gave me a frontal 40 yard shot in 07. Last year my brother killed his bull in New Mexico with a frontal shot at 14 yards and it was a devistating kill shot, just a gusher. It s defenitely not a preferred shot but A perfect situation at 20 yards or under I probly will take it. nwhunter

[simondude]

I shot one from 7 yards in the chest and it went less then 10 yards before it died. I probably wouldn't take that shot again cause the risk is to big and I would rather not shoot an elk then shoot one and not find it.

[zackmioli]

Thanks for that link to the Idaho bowhunters guide. Had some good info and good looks at the anatomy. 

[kentrek]

ive also had the experience of shooting one in the chest and having it run 10 yards and fall over,for me it depends on the situation and how the animal is behaving,i will pass at a frontal shot if i know the animal is spooky and or is circling me to give more shot opportunities. this shot needs to be perfectly straight on(have the arrow parallel with its spine and be with a calm animal. in the video i think i woulda shot the bull sooner when he appears to be broadsideish but that is from the cameras angle and its hard to see what you were seeing.i trust ya tho 

 i really don't believe hunters have the right to call one another ethical or unethical for taking such shots, also if a person is about to kill and is worried about what other hunters think, i kinda feel they're in the woods for the wrong reasons...

[washelkhunter]

A frontal shot on an animal you want to harvest is OK in my book. the only downside is you gotta know is your not going to be able to get the heart, liver and tenderloins because of bowel contamination. But you are still capable of butchering hundreds of pounds of great meat. At 31 yds! Oh yeah it is down.

[BowBender87]

A heart shot is possible on a frontal shot..i have done it. I dont think this shot is for everyone...I just really trust the arrow penetration on my set up and practice alot for these kinds of shots. My arrow is chrono'd at 303 fps and weighs 445 grains with broadhead.  I cant remember the kinetic energy formula but i just remember it being real high.  Any way..I guess what i am getting at is if that bull is inside 30...I will take the shot head on.  Although ive only taken that shot once..i would take it again.   

[LittleJohn]

Not a shot I will take at any yardage, Too small of a window for me. Flinch, pull the shot, an unseen branch, jump the string, allot can happen that can lead to an nightmare of a day and a lost animal.
My mindset is, pass on the shot, I will have another opportunity

[JPhelps]

Great conversation.

Looking back on it I probably wouldn't take the shot again.  The part that bothers me the most is the branch I hit at about 20 yards.  I did check my 20 pin against the branch and I didn't see the branch as a potential risk.

While it appeared to be a broadside shot for the camera I had too many limbs blocking the vitals.  If you use the yellow flower as a reference it appears that when the bull turns back around he is about two feet further to the right.

In the end the bull died quickly, but I feel that too many things COULD have went wrong.  I won't say that I will never take the shot again but things will need to be PERFECT.

[coachcw]

Tough call in the moment. if presented with a frontal shot id rather aim for the base of the skull and hit the spine or a main artery , that way if i miss it would be a clean miss. my other thaught is to draw and settle in and wait for the bull to turn if your at full draw and ready to shoot I think its a better shot .

[MIKEXRAY]

I also would not take it and as discussed not my place to tell others what they should do. I will say that this shot taken @ 40 yards is very risky, such a small window & just think how small of a movement the elk needs to make to have this shot go way bad.  Also @ 40 yards your penetration would come into play.  I hear everyone talking about all the practice they do but it is a hell of a lot different when you have a bull facing you , blowing snot & bugling.  Makes it a lot harder to hit the softball size frontal kill shot . Mike

[Encore 280]

Ok, I'm not a bow hunter so I have to ask a *censored* question here, sorry. Would it be possible to take a shot for the throat say about halfway up and could/would a broadhead break the neck? I realize that it's a very small target but I would think that a little to the left or right and you're up the creek. Let's say 30 yds and under. Just wondering.

[buglelk]

Just to add to the discussion....

I will take a frontal shot IF the conditions are right and the shot is right. It is the most devastating shot imaginable when taken correctly. If there is too much angle, you risk hitting the offside shoulder before getting into the vitals. If there is a very slight angle, you run the risk of "glancing" along the ribs and your arrow not getting inside the body cavity (sliding along between the rib cage and the shoulder blade). The angle has to be just right or head on....if it is and you hit your spot, you won't need to track the elk. Another mistake many hunters make with this shot is aiming too low and glancing off the sternum. You want to be above the sternum....if you are, the target is actually a bit bigger than you might imagine.

The long hair on the neck of an elk definitely doesn't prevent a good blood trail if the arrow is placed correctly. Nearly every major artery runs through this area from the brain to the front of the heart. If you put an arrow into the pocket, you have a mass of arteries, heart, lungs....complete devastation.

As far as the choice to make the shot, it is no different than how far you choose to shoot at a broadside elk. If you know your target and are confident in your abilities, a frontal shot is not necessarily a lower percentage shot. I would say that a frontal shot at 40 yards is a lower percentage shot than a broadside shot at 40 yards, but I would also personally be more comfortable taking a 20 yard frontal shot than a 40 yard broadside shot...

Many thanks,
Corey Jacobsen
Elk101.com - Extreme Elk Magazine

[ELKBURGER]

All the sucess stories tend to give a less experieced archer the belief that with practice this shot is OK. Everyone that has tried this shot at some point told themselves to shoot at this angle. Some got lucky, some didnt. Confidence is huge in bowhunting and it should be gained by your successes in the field, not someone elses successes.

[BULLBLASTER]

I killed my first archery bull with a frontal shot at 8 yards. Arrow went through the opening that the exsofigus and gains go through. I was at full draw when the bull was broadside at 35 but he turned and walked straight in and wasn't going to stop or turn unless he bolted. He went 15 yards and not a drop of blood on the ground. Arrow hit both lungs and the heart then went through the liver and the head stopped in the guts. Can't get that much damage from any other shot. I would have no problem making that shot again on a bull inside 20 yards. That is a point and shoot range for a well practiced archer/bowhinter.

[mrmoskillz]

anyone one have a story of a frontal stot that went wrong they can share?

[blacktail luv]

I have never taken the shot personally but have seen it taken and heard horror stories.  I bugeled in a bull for a buddy and this thing came on a dead run down off the hill.  At twenty yards I hit the cow call and the bull hit the brakes and turned facing my buddy who was at full draw at about 10 yards.  He whispered " should I shoot".  I replied "no" but he shot anyway, hitting the bull a little too high and slightly to the right.  Never did find it.  He was sick about it and spent weeks looking for it.  He will never take that shot again.  The shot can definitely kill an elk but when you have a bull starring you down your nerves can get the best of you...I've never been in the situation so I can't say what I would do, but if a bull was inside 20 yards and I felt like that shot was all I was going to get I'd probably take it

[Button Nubbs]

That's a no no for me personally. I am very confident in my gear and my shooting abilities but I know that elk can turn me into a puddle of goo. I jumped my bull twice this year after destroying a lung and the liver, he still lived for 8-10 hours. They are tough critters and I never want the feeling I had when that bull jumped up on me again. Luckily persistence payed off and I found him.

[rebal69972]

anyone one have a story of a frontal stot that went wrong they can share?

personally i will never take a frontal shot again. i have not tried it with elk but i did with a deer many years ago 30 yards walking dead at me and go figure i pulled. The shot went through the rib cage and out just behind the front leg and never touched anything. we tracked it with maybe pencil size drops of blood for over 8 hours luckily we found him in a small black berry patch and was able to put another in him.  i will never try it again  but that's just me and i really think my hunting partners would kill me if i did try. 10 menx8 hours =1 deer

[Basket Rack]

I do not take the frontal shot.  I have been tempted on occassion with some nice bulls but passed as too many things can go wrong.  I know other bowhunters that have taken this shot and some killed the bull but several others ended up with a wounded elk that was not recovered.  All were bowhunters that pound the practice range in the off season and are very good shots but alot can go wrong to even the best archers when a bull is in close screaming at you.

[MAVsled]

years ago, I took a frontal shot on a bull in GMU 356.
the beast was at 25 yards, passed behind a small tree before I could settle pin & release then turned around the tree and headed straight head on and now downwind of my position. at draw noticed that its eyes got big, ears tipped back>I'd been made and just felt the bull was going to spin and bolt. I hit that pocket and it was over in less than 40 yards with bull down.
And I felt my shot was good but I was lucky, because an instant more and the bull would have turned. The end result might not have been what it was.
but with any kind of angle, I'd pass on a frontal shot choice. And I've passed on all front shots later on, too risky.
And never a frontal shot on deer, way too small a pocket.

IMHO: your end result was good, and that is all that's good about your shot decision.
I was shocked to watch your vid and hear the release, with those branches within the target zone and an angled animal facing forward. Then the branch getting hit and falling, not surprised at this from the arch of the arrow's path at 31 yards. Watching the elk move off; and noticing the arrow shaft at an angle from but bulls left-front side toward front chest. not an ideal front shot placement. You got lucky too.

We all live and learn....

[JPhelps]

It looks like a lot of people have taken the shot at least once.  Some had good results and some not so good.

I was aiming to the left of center.  In my mind visualizing the vitals this would give me the front of one lung and the back of the other.  The bull was quartered slightly at 10* or so.  During the autopsy I confirmed that I got both lungs (only about the back 2.5" of the off side lung) and the liver.  Ultimate result the bull expired within about 5 minutes of being shot.

With that being said looking back I did have some luck on my side (I have no problem admitting that I had a few things go my way).  The branch could have deflected my arrow.  On this shot there was no room for that.  Also the bull didn't move until the arrow struck. 

If I could do it all over I would pass on that shot and see if the bull ever presented a broadside shot.  If not, I still have a tag in my pocket and I am doing what I love, calling in bulls.  If I am ever to take a true frontal shot again the bull will have to be close (<20 yards) and ............... nah maybe I'll just wait for him to turn broadside.

[flinter]

Many years ago I took that shot at one of the biggest blacktail bucks I think I have ever seen, 5 or 6 pts on top with a sticker coming off one side. The shot was 6-8 feet and I was sitting down and twisting trying to shoot almost behind me just before dark. My 3 blade Savora went between the ribs and the front leg. 5 of us looked for that buck all the next day with no luck. I wont be taking that shot again.

[Elknut1]

Bottom line, if not comfortable with this shot avoid it! If comfortable with it limit yourself to 25yds or less, after that it really becomes a crap shoot that the elk doesn't move! My son & I have take 6 elk with this shot, it's doable but not for everyone! He did lose a bull at 15 yds this year with his compound, it turned at the shot, it went through the brisket & exited out his shoulder missing  all vitals! This bull survived thank God as we saw him a couple days later. Thing is I lost a bull before to a broadside shot by hitting too high, will I take another? You bet, & I'll take another frontal shot too! (grin) Crap happens, fortunately will kill most those bulls!

  Here's a frontal shot kill at 14 yds with a longbow I took!

  ElkNut1

[TikkaT3-270Shortmag]

Elk nut is the man. I've lost a bull broadside and hit a little high too. All depends on the shooter!

[Doublelunger]

That shot without the branch in the way was tough...combined with the branch it was damn lucky in my opinion.  Unless of course you consider that you're shooting a bowtech, then that shot is run of the mill.

[JPhelps]

That branch wasn't supposed to get in the way.  I think the wind gusted to 40 and it just blew in my window.     All joking aside I checked the 20 pin against the limbs and It looked like a clean window.  So I will agree that there was some luck that when I hit it that it didn't deflect.

[bucklucky]

Well hell, if elknut says its a good shot guess I wont be passing anymore frontals anymore .... look out bulls  Just foolin Paul!!

[Elknut1]

Charlie, no sweat man! (grin) You know as well as I do that it's not one for everyone, it's not a decision to be made in the trenches, it has to be one where you know for a fact you can do it because of research on elk anatomy & the confidence you can put the arrow where he lives, this is no last second decision that ones ponder over & experiment with & hope for the best! If not sure on that shot or any shot then guys don't take it, those iffy shots rarely turn out for the good!

  ElkNut1

[throttlejocky20]

Had that shot at a cow a few years ago and took it. The outcome was bad choice I will never do it again. It is doable but not worth the risk for me.

[nwhunter]

Lots of good opinions here on frontal shots. Like has been said any shot if the animal moves can turn into a nightmare so the closer the better. I had a great broadside shot turn into a nightmare once too. On Rockies next Bugling Bull video my brothers hunt will be on it and you can see just how devistating a frontal shot can be. A bloodtrail a blind guy could follow and the only reason he made it a 100 yards was he got going downhill and his momentum carried him even while he was dead on his feet. If a guy isnt comfortable with the shot its awesome to have the self discipline to pass it up regardless especially in the heat of the moment. Good topic  nwhunter

[Bearhunter]

15yards or less and even that is not a gimmie.... To many variables during the heat of the moment to be a gimme... Last bull with my bow was at about 7 yards full frontal went 40yards and expired.  But to add to that I have also lost one bull over the years and that was from a 5 yard frontal with some small limbs in the way and that was back when I competed in lots of 3d shoots and was a very profecent shot, its a low precentage shot period....

[blackveltbowhunter]

15yards or less and even that is not a gimmie.... To many variables during the heat of the moment to be a gimme... Last bull with my bow was at about 7 yards full frontal went 40yards and expired.  But to add to that I have also lost one bull over the years and that was from a 5 yard frontal with some small limbs in the way and that was back when I competed in lots of 3d shoots and was a very profecent shot, its a low precentage shot period....

  I think you summed it up pretty well... till the end. If you felt its a low percentage shot, why did you take it on your last bow bull?  Maybe im reading into your post if so I apologize.

  I dont feel the shot in and of itself is a low percentage shot. The circumstance surrounding it can be. Also a low percentage shot for one archer may be a high percentage shot for another. Nothing in the real world of hunting will ever be 100 percent. That is the only given. I have taken the shot 4 times.... 3 resulted in dramatic kill. The 4th I wounded the bull....Not becaused I took a frontal shot but because I broke my own personal rule and shot when an elk was moving. I hit way outside glancing off the shoulder.. with minimal penetration. We called the bull in again several days later.... yes I was very ashamed, fortunate and lucky.
    Will I take a frontal again? Yes. Will the elk be moving? No
   
   

[AKBowman]

Thats a great question Jason...if you asked me last year this time I would say yes, within 35 yards I would take that shot based off of 1: my past experiences of my gear performing on pentrating game and 2: my level of practice and confidence at the time 3: my skills and ability at tracking wounded game.

As of today I would not take that shot, I would limit the shot to 20 yards for my self. That being said I would take the shot but reduce my yardage to 20 so...yes I would take the frontal shot just not the shot in the vid b/c of the yardage and my lack of confidence right now. Its hard to argue the effectiveness of a well placed frontal shot.

I missed a 30 yard shot last year but had to shoot through a hole the size of two grapefruits about 5 yards in front of the bull. I really thought I could make the shot and its a shot i practice, for some reason in the heat of the moment I didnt even come close and hit a log about 10 yards in front of me and my arrow's flight terminated right there. Later in the year with my confidence wavering I tried to make a perfect 12 yard heart shot on a broaddside decent 3X3 w/ eyeguards BT and missed my spot by 3 inches taking hair off of his chest. I retreived my arrow, placed a small 1" leaf where the buck had been standing, climbed back into my stand and stuck a broadhead through the leaf.

I was as low as low can get and until I make a good shot in the pressure of the moment I wont take anything but a classic broadside under 35yds. Just my feelings right now.

[throttlejocky20]

Thats a great question Jason...if you asked me last year this time I would say yes, within 35 yards I would take that shot based off of 1: my past experiences of my gear performing on pentrating game and 2: my level of practice and confidence at the time 3: my skills and ability at tracking wounded game.

As of today I would not take that shot, I would limit the shot to 20 yards for my self. That being said I would take the shot but reduce my yardage to 20 so...yes I would take the frontal shot just not the shot in the vid b/c of the yardage and my lack of confidence right now. Its hard to argue the effectiveness of a well placed frontal shot.

I missed a 30 yard shot last year but had to shoot through a hole the size of two grapefruits about 5 yards in front of the bull. I really thought I could make the shot and its a shot i practice, for some reason in the heat of the moment I didnt even come close and hit a log about 10 yards in front of me and my arrow's flight terminated right there. Later in the year with my confidence wavering I tried to make a perfect 12 yard heart shot on a broaddside decent 3X3 w/ eyeguards BT and missed my spot by 3 inches taking hair off of his chest. I retreived my arrow, placed a small 1" leaf where the buck had been standing, climbed back into my stand and stuck a broadhead through the leaf.

I was as low as low can get and until I make a good shot in the pressure of the moment I wont take anything but a classic broadside under 35yds. Just my feelings right now.

I believe alot of people think that because they can make a shot on the range they can repeat it in the field. I practice alot and take alot of shots on the range I wouldn't in the field even knowing I have made a similiar shot 1000 times. To many other variables in the field to get cocky 

[AKBowman]

The part that bothers me the most is the branch I hit at about 20 yards.  I did check my 20 pin against the branch and I didn't see the branch as a potential risk.


Thats basically what happened to me with the dead stump. It was about 6" in diameter and busted off clean about 2' off the ground. I never saw it, the shot felt good then SMACK as soon as I released I look up and see my arrow sticking in a log about 10 yards in front of my. I remember thinking "how did that happen, Ive practiced this shot". In the pressure cooker of having a bugling bull in my face I get tunnell vision and need to learn to relax and realize my surrounding a bit better. This makes me realize I need a to settle for nothing but a higher percentage shot until I get a couple Elk under my belt.

[Johnb317]

Have to also practice with all your gear on.    I wear a face mask when hunting so at times I practice with it on.  Anchor point feels just a hair different,  also practice shooting sitting down etc.   
Even with all that I'd be hard presses to take a frontal shot, doesn't mean I won't study it and have it my quiver so to speak.   I always said I wouldn't shoot at a moving animal, but last September he was walking slowly and the shot was slightly under 5 yards.    Still enjoying the meat in the freezer. 

[AKBowman]

Thats a great question Jason...if you asked me last year this time I would say yes, within 35 yards I would take that shot based off of 1: my past experiences of my gear performing on pentrating game and 2: my level of practice and confidence at the time 3: my skills and ability at tracking wounded game.

As of today I would not take that shot, I would limit the shot to 20 yards for my self. That being said I would take the shot but reduce my yardage to 20 so...yes I would take the frontal shot just not the shot in the vid b/c of the yardage and my lack of confidence right now. Its hard to argue the effectiveness of a well placed frontal shot.

I missed a 30 yard shot last year but had to shoot through a hole the size of two grapefruits about 5 yards in front of the bull. I really thought I could make the shot and its a shot i practice, for some reason in the heat of the moment I didnt even come close and hit a log about 10 yards in front of me and my arrow's flight terminated right there. Later in the year with my confidence wavering I tried to make a perfect 12 yard heart shot on a broaddside decent 3X3 w/ eyeguards BT and missed my spot by 3 inches taking hair off of his chest. I retreived my arrow, placed a small 1" leaf where the buck had been standing, climbed back into my stand and stuck a broadhead through the leaf.

I was as low as low can get and until I make a good shot in the pressure of the moment I wont take anything but a classic broadside under 35yds. Just my feelings right now.

I believe alot of people think that because they can make a shot on the range they can repeat it in the field. I practice alot and take alot of shots on the range I wouldn't in the field even knowing I have made a similiar shot 1000 times. To many other variables in the field to get cocky 

Yeah I agree, experience is invaluable. But without getting out there and putting yourself in pressure situations there no other way to gain the experience. I guess theres no way to say your decision was a good one regardless of the percentages, its just a feeling ("green light" if you will) that happens in the heat of the situation.

[DIYARCHERYJUNKIE]

Elk nut is the man. I've lost a bull broadside and hit a little high too. All depends on the shooter!

  

[slim9300]

I will only contemplate the shot when the animal is inside 20 yards, despite being very confident with my bow out to some VERY long ranges. I shoot the same size groups you do and shoot my bow daily. Elk are very tough animals and I want 100% confidence I can make the shot. With all of that said, if excuted properly, the frontal shot is the most deadly there is.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[268bull]

First off, I'm not a bow hunter, so I can't attest to all the variables that come into play with you fellas. But I enjoy reading about your hunts and the different situations, such as this one as presented. You all seem to be very well versed in your bowhunting and your abilities. I'm a fanatical Roosevelt rifle hunter here in west central Oregon Cascades. 75 yds. is the longest shot I've had to take. But I have those variables to deal with also. BRUSH!! At times I'm studying through that brush at a window that appears to be 8x8 inches at best. Just how far in front of that window presnted is that shoulder. Allowing for rise or drop depending whether he's upslope of me or down. I firmly believe it comes down to your faith ( my case, my rifle ), you fellas your bows, in your weapon and your abilities to use it. I don't think I could shoot a more flat shooting rifle than what my .270 Remington has been over the years, and I'm very comfortable with it. I know a lot of bow hunters around here and observing their abilities with shot placement, amazes me. All have told me that they know their bows well, the bows abilities, and limitations. I realize I'm talking apples and oranges here. If however, I bow hunted, I would take the shot. Thanks for allowing me to speak. I hope that I've not offended anyone by inserting my rifle into a bow hunting situation, and I've really enjoyed reading the subject matter. :tup:Dale

[smartazz171]

I would not take it.  It's a higher risk shot and more likely to lead to a lost elk.  I always want broadside or quartered away.  Killing an elk is awesome, but losing one is heartbreaking and not worth a risk.  I want to shoot the highest percentage shots at close distances- i limit my range to 30 yards.

I agree! I know this is more of an individual ethics question then a right or wrong answer. My first elk I shot 2 years ago was a frontal shot at 5  yards; 65 lb bow Magnus 4 blade; hit the gugular (sp) and exited out the right lung. Didnt  go 50 yards. But I can tell you I was deathly afraid of the "what ifs" until I heard the crash! You talk to a archery expert that's more worried about ethical effective kill shots on elk and not their ego, and even broadside 40 yards should be max. I know guys will say I'm wrong but ya you also can lob a half court shot and it can go in if aimed right, that doesn't mean it's a responsible shot to take. 

[colockumelk]

20yds and under you bet.