Post by: rosscrazyelk on September 07, 2011, 03:02:26 PM
Team Mossback has a repetation, I cannot say if it is true or not since I have personally never been around them. But the repetation is that they do whatever it takes to get the bull they want. I said earlier on another thread that I was told by a private source that they were doing everything legit and things were fine, Please do not ask who my friend is because i will not tell you just know he has been involved from the beginning when he heard they were coming..
Anyway, I heard later yesterday that is not true, apparently my friend cannot be everywhere, But team Mossback can. Word is they have been tresspassing, Hopefully the landowners will start complaining about it,
I would recommend to any of my Hunt wa friends if you are in the blues and see their activities take pictures and report them. Guys like this are gonna ruin it for all of us if they do not think the rules apply to them. Also I know it is a free country and people can start businesses where they want but I would love to see them out of here and the business they are here for go to guys like mtcook or other local outfitters.. These are the problems I see happening if they stay here.
1. with the money that they make you can bet they will slowly start worming their way into the private landowners pocket, Thus pretty much eliminating any chance that guys like you and me will never get permission to hunt these lands if we ever felt the want or need to ask..
2. The Blues are getting enough attention as it is we don't need tham here to make our draw odds and such worse.
And with the attention it is getting along with the wolves I am afraid what it will be like in 10 years.
To close my can of worms what is stopping team mossback from tresspassing? The tag holder obviously has alot enough money so what would a tresspass fee be to him.? The land owner could not let him retrieve the animal but the land owner better have a tag otherwise he faces a fine as well. so what is really stopping them from tresspassing?.
So lets hear it what do you guys think?
Post by: bobcat on September 07, 2011, 03:06:37 PM
Post by: rosscrazyelk on September 07, 2011, 03:08:28 PM
Post by: rosscrazyelk on September 07, 2011, 03:11:08 PM
Team Mossback the BMM is always watching :peep:
Post by: huntnphool on September 07, 2011, 03:14:12 PM
Post by: jager on September 07, 2011, 03:17:45 PM
I agree with what you've said, I've actually been thinking about this as well.
Right now I'm worried that this may affect my chances to access some private lands down there...
Post by: rosscrazyelk on September 07, 2011, 03:17:59 PM
Post by: 6x6in6 on September 07, 2011, 03:25:30 PM
This includes, guide license (if applicable to what they are doing), trespassing, hunting regulations, and any other RCW that applies to their adventure.
They step on their dick, throw the book at them just like it should be thrown at each and every one of us who violate the RCW while partaking in our outdoor activities.
Post by: jager on September 07, 2011, 03:26:36 PM
Problem is... cash can get you alot, and out of alot!
Post by: Woodchuck on September 07, 2011, 03:33:05 PM
Post by: BIGINNER on September 07, 2011, 03:37:08 PM
Well I have made a trip or two without the misfortune of running into them. I would really like it if the word could be put out and no landowners let them in, if they cross, slam them. I don't care if they do they're thing as long as they are held to the same standard as every other swingin richard out there. I did however buy a nice new 25,000 lb tow strap for the ol truck if I happen to see any roadblocks ;)
nice!!! lol let me know if you need help with the towing. :chuckle:
Post by: ac_156 on September 07, 2011, 03:37:35 PM
Post by: SkookumHntr on September 07, 2011, 03:49:12 PM
Post by: fishm@n on September 07, 2011, 03:51:43 PM
Their 400 gallery is impressive and likely a testament to people with large bank accounts and little hunting prowess.
http://mossback.com/monster-400s/ (http://mossback.com/monster-400s/)
Post by: Scott on September 07, 2011, 03:55:09 PM
Post by: Woodchuck on September 07, 2011, 04:03:43 PM
Post by: MtnMuley on September 07, 2011, 04:05:14 PM
Post by: firefighter4607 on September 07, 2011, 04:41:48 PM
I have said it in another post there are some great outfitters in the state already that know the areas, the owners, and have the community respect. Team Mossback should stay the Hell out of Washington!!!! They have other states that they hunt in and maybe those states are started to get pissed at them for doing the stuff that they do.
As far as if I get stopped by them and they try to pull a gun on me :bash: I would ask them if they own the land and the public road then I would continue on my way passed the block. If they get aggressive then 911 will be called. If they are on my land or want access to my land it will be a very quick f**** you and good day. :chuckle:
Post by: Curly on September 07, 2011, 04:48:50 PM
I don't believe a landowner would be in violation of any law for not allowing someone to trespass in order to retrieve a dead animal.
That is correct. Bigtex has pointed that out on the board before......a landowner would not get charged with anything by not allowing someone retrieve game.
Post by: ac_156 on September 07, 2011, 04:58:50 PM
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on September 07, 2011, 04:59:16 PM
On a side note, based on my past experience with nonresident hunters from all over the country, UT has more than their share of the unfriendliest, potentially hostile hunters around. I suspect Team Mossbacks' antics are much exaggerated, as it would be seriously dangerous to cross too many Utah resident hunters - especially if they have a quality buck or bull permit.
Post by: steen on September 07, 2011, 05:06:27 PM
Post by: Caseyd on September 07, 2011, 05:16:26 PM
I would say if someone shot a bull on your property illegally and the property owner did not retrieve it then it is not the property owner's liability. Prosecute the tresspasser and don't worry about wastage. Sometimes things happen and need to be delt with.
:yeah:
Alot of landowners in the area do turn in tresspassers and could careless that you think you should be able to "retrieve" your animal.
And said landowners know the WDFW officer in the area and don't get harassed for "wastage."
ALL LIKE IS SHOULD BE
Post by: bone head on September 07, 2011, 07:07:38 PM
Post by: BENCHLEG on September 07, 2011, 07:25:25 PM
Post by: Bigshooter on September 07, 2011, 07:44:26 PM
Post by: rosscrazyelk on September 07, 2011, 07:49:34 PM
MANNNNN alot of you haters in here sound like a bunch of old ladies. what next? you gonna start in on our native friends next? tell me where does all the money go that the tag holder spends for that tag? i know here in oregon it goes right back into the managing of our game which helps alot. i hope they get the bull their looking for.
We are not complaining about the Govenors tag, The money for that does go to help with the wildlife what we are talking about is TEAM MOSSBACK. How they hunt is what I have a problem with..
Post by: runamuk on September 07, 2011, 08:03:30 PM
MANNNNN alot of you haters in here sound like a bunch of old ladies. what next? you gonna start in on our native friends next? tell me where does all the money go that the tag holder spends for that tag? i know here in oregon it goes right back into the managing of our game which helps alot. i hope they get the bull their looking for.
We are not complaining about the Govenors tag, The money for that does go to help with the wildlife what we are talking about is TEAM MOSSBACK. How they hunt is what I have a problem with..
this is WA money goes to the general fund and then is spent however the governor sees fit.....anyone acting like a *censored* on public lands deserves a hazing by locals...oh crap I just said what I thought inside my head, with my outside voice
wait
they bring money to the local economy and notoriety to the herd you all should bow down and kiss their feeties and thank them for their contributions.....is that more PC :dunno:
My first thought was this is the blue mountains and a man could easily get lost out there ;) just sayin
Post by: huntnphool on September 07, 2011, 08:57:31 PM
Thats all you got Phool, No input?
I just got back on this site after more than a year, I think the admin team would appreciate me keeping my opinions to myself for a while. ;)
Post by: bobcat on September 07, 2011, 08:59:33 PM
Thats all you got Phool, No input?
I just got back on this site after more than a year, I think the admin team would appreciate me keeping my opinions to myself for a while. ;)
That's not true. It's fine to state your opinions, as long as they don't differ from mine. :)
Post by: ribka on September 07, 2011, 09:05:28 PM
Thats all you got Phool, No input?
I just got back on this site after more than a year, I think the admin team would appreciate me keeping my opinions to myself for a while. ;)
That's not true. It's fine to state your opinions, as long as they don't differ from mine. :)
Hey that is what I tell my wife :chuckle:
Post by: huntnphool on September 07, 2011, 09:24:20 PM
Thats all you got Phool, No input?
I just got back on this site after more than a year, I think the admin team would appreciate me keeping my opinions to myself for a while. ;)
That's not true. It's fine to state your opinions, as long as they don't differ from mine. :)
Duly noted Bob ;)
Post by: BIGINNER on September 07, 2011, 09:49:18 PM
Thats all you got Phool, No input?
I just got back on this site after more than a year, I think the admin team would appreciate me keeping my opinions to myself for a while. ;)
LOL I MISSED YOU MAN :chuckle: I HAD TO VISIT THE OTHER SITE JUST TO SEE YOUR RUNNING MOOSE. LOL.
Post by: rosscrazyelk on September 08, 2011, 07:08:03 AM
I respect thatThats all you got Phool, No input?
I just got back on this site after more than a year, I think the admin team would appreciate me keeping my opinions to myself for a while. ;)
Post by: Woodchuck on September 08, 2011, 07:19:04 AM
Post by: Ridgeratt on September 08, 2011, 07:33:52 AM
Thats all you got Phool, No input?
I just got back on this site after more than a year, I think the admin team would appreciate me keeping my opinions to myself for a while. ;)
When I saw the name. :yike: It was like seeing a GHOST! Perhaps an exorcism was going to take place..
Welcome back :hello:
Post by: Mr Mykiss on September 08, 2011, 12:11:27 PM
FYI, the one time I saw them they were having a little chat with the landowners upon who's property they had tresspassed and placed a trailcam.
Post by: Knocker of rocks on September 08, 2011, 12:29:48 PM
For all who are interested. I am going back Saturday and I will be hunting the exact same spot that they are/were
Just keep your cool, and stay within your rights. Don't be the aggressor, let their actions back themselves into a corner. If you are threatened, document what happened (take notes) and call the sheriff.
I have had on actually start to pull a gun on me because i try to go around him on a quad. when i reported the incident to the game warden he told me they aren't allowed to mess with him, county cops said the same thing something needs to be done but most states , especially Utah won't touch him. he spends to much money, bribes to many people.So you are claiming that they pulled a gun on you to prevent you from travelling down a public road? And the police won't do anything because he spends too much money? I would expect anyone who pulls a gun on another person except in the case of preventing a felony or extreme threats, would be facing a charge of Third Degree Assault.
Post by: Mr Mykiss on September 08, 2011, 01:40:02 PM
Post by: Woodchuck on September 08, 2011, 01:54:12 PM
Post by: BIGINNER on September 08, 2011, 01:55:53 PM
Post by: Woodchuck on September 08, 2011, 02:08:02 PM
Post by: Gringo31 on September 08, 2011, 02:09:19 PM
Bragging boards based on points alone are not what it is about IMO.
Gringo
Post by: jackmaster on September 08, 2011, 02:10:48 PM
I think guys like the mossback boys represent all the things that hunting is not about but what to some is evolving into. Hunting to me is getting away from the rat race, being in remote areas where a guy can see the beauty of God's creation, there is some heritage, tradition, family etc elements........:yeah: :yeah:
Bragging boards based on points alone are not what it is about IMO.
Gringo
Post by: Woodchuck on September 08, 2011, 02:11:10 PM
Post by: BIGINNER on September 08, 2011, 02:11:40 PM
I think guys like the mossback boys represent all the things that hunting is not about but what to some is evolving into. Hunting to me is getting away from the rat race, being in remote areas where a guy can see the beauty of God's creation, there is some heritage, tradition, family etc elements........:yeah: :yeah:
Bragging boards based on points alone are not what it is about IMO.
Gringo
:yeah: X 1000
Post by: rosscrazyelk on September 08, 2011, 02:34:01 PM
Just got word that tem mossback is back in town... I thought they were leaving last weekend....uggg
Well they were not gone long, I almost wonder if they were scouting other areas or they heard from their local source JT that the bull is off private ground again. :bash:
Post by: Woodchuck on September 08, 2011, 02:39:43 PM
Post by: gaddy on September 08, 2011, 02:45:51 PM
Post by: ac_156 on September 08, 2011, 02:52:00 PM
For all who are interested. I am going back Saturday and I will be hunting the exact same spot that they are/were
Just keep your cool, and stay within your rights. Don't be the aggressor, let their actions back themselves into a corner. If you are threatened, document what happened (take notes) and call the sheriff.I have had on actually start to pull a gun on me because i try to go around him on a quad. when i reported the incident to the game warden he told me they aren't allowed to mess with him, county cops said the same thing something needs to be done but most states , especially Utah won't touch him. he spends to much money, bribes to many people.So you are claiming that they pulled a gun on you to prevent you from travelling down a public road? And the police won't do anything because he spends too much money? I would expect anyone who pulls a gun on another person except in the case of preventing a felony or extreme threats, would be facing a charge of Third Degree Assault.
yes that is what happened sheriffs dept and game warden said they were orderd to stay away from him. that i could file a complaint with the state attorney generals office but that went nowhere. was filed for later reference
Post by: h20hunter on September 08, 2011, 03:03:01 PM
Post by: Woodchuck on September 08, 2011, 03:05:34 PM
Woodchuck, don't you have a callblaster for your foot searches ??No I don't but am hoping and praying that the new train horns I ordered for my truck show up tomorrow so I can get them wired up. Hadn't thought of using them like that but now that you mentioned that..... :chuckle:
Post by: BIGINNER on September 08, 2011, 03:09:48 PM
Woodchuck, don't you have a callblaster for your foot searches ??No I don't but am hoping and praying that the new train horns I ordered for my truck show up tomorrow so I can get them wired up. Hadn't thought of using them like that but now that you mentioned that..... :chuckle:
are the horns chrome? :tung:
Post by: runamuk on September 08, 2011, 03:14:35 PM
Pardon me for being a dummy but how do you not have the right to press charges?:yeah:
If you are threatened by someone you have the right to press charges...this isn't the old west we have more laws than we need....but pretty sure there isn't a jurisdiction in the country that can ban you from filing charges against someone who threatens you..... wait maybe Chicago is that corrupt
Post by: Woodchuck on September 08, 2011, 03:15:17 PM
Yup :IBCOOL:Woodchuck, don't you have a callblaster for your foot searches ??No I don't but am hoping and praying that the new train horns I ordered for my truck show up tomorrow so I can get them wired up. Hadn't thought of using them like that but now that you mentioned that..... :chuckle:
are the horns chrome? :tung:
Post by: ac_156 on September 08, 2011, 04:14:38 PM
Pardon me for being a dummy but how do you not have the right to press charges?i did but the state wouldn't pursue them because they didn't want to upset the flow of income/bribe money he puts out
Post by: Caseyd on September 08, 2011, 04:25:17 PM
Pardon me for being a dummy but how do you not have the right to press charges?i did but the state wouldn't pursue them because they didn't want to upset the flow of income/bribe money he puts out
i.e. He said vs He said :dunno:
Post by: shedcrazy on September 08, 2011, 04:31:07 PM
Post by: Knocker of rocks on September 08, 2011, 05:46:47 PM
Pardon me for being a dummy but how do you not have the right to press charges?i did but the state wouldn't pursue them because they didn't want to upset the flow of income/bribe money he puts out
That is a shocking allegation, that the Sheriff and his Deputies of a Utah county, the State Wildlife Agents, the State Attorney General, presumably the Utah State Police , the United States Forest Service and the Untied States Bureau of Land Management allow a group of individuals to run rampant around public lands, and to intimidate the general public with firearms. Most states would be charging these private individuals and their corrupt governmental cronies with a slew of charges, and I'm sure the Feds could be counted on to chime in with RICO.
How much does it cost to pay off these cops? I mean, we are talking about a professional guide service, not Tony Soprano. Mossback's gross can't be that high, can it? And he brings in so much, that his legal transgressions are overlooked? Sounds like a job for Buford Pusser
Post by: jackelope on September 08, 2011, 06:00:25 PM
Auction tag money does not go to the general fund.MANNNNN alot of you haters in here sound like a bunch of old ladies. what next? you gonna start in on our native friends next? tell me where does all the money go that the tag holder spends for that tag? i know here in oregon it goes right back into the managing of our game which helps alot. i hope they get the bull their looking for.
We are not complaining about the Govenors tag, The money for that does go to help with the wildlife what we are talking about is TEAM MOSSBACK. How they hunt is what I have a problem with..
this is WA money goes to the general fund and then is spent however the governor sees fit.....anyone acting like a *censored* on public lands deserves a hazing by locals...oh crap I just said what I thought inside my head, with my outside voice
Pardon me for being a dummy but how do you not have the right to press charges?i did but the state wouldn't pursue them because they didn't want to upset the flow of income/bribe money he puts out
I find this very hard to believe.
No offense, just doesn't sound right considering that this would be the 1st time they've been in the state "guiding" and I also believe the auction tag holder is not from Washington.
Post by: Knocker of rocks on September 08, 2011, 06:08:22 PM
I think the incident with a gun being pointed at AC occured in Utah. But I concur with your premise
Post by: Huntbear on September 08, 2011, 06:14:15 PM
Maybe we can come up with a solution to these jerks.... by combining this thread with the tannerite thread.. :dunno: :chuckle: :dunno:
Post by: runamuk on September 08, 2011, 06:21:15 PM
if these guys truly are dirtbags who think they are better than the rest and do lawfully questionable things then they need to be not only dealt with maybe knocked down a peg or two :dunno: :dunno: if all of the allegations are completely false then fine leave them be.....but usually the truth can be found somewhere in the middle :dunno:
Post by: Knocker of rocks on September 08, 2011, 06:24:00 PM
but usually the truth can be found somewhere in the middle :dunno:
:yeah:
Post by: rosscrazyelk on September 08, 2011, 09:42:13 PM
How much should this special temerary permit cost in your opinion?
Post by: Gringo31 on September 08, 2011, 09:46:02 PM
Why would someone have access to something the public doesn't?
I didn't know that the WDFW had a "special" catalog for permits to those with $$$$$
Post by: rosscrazyelk on September 08, 2011, 09:49:31 PM
Post by: firefighter4607 on September 09, 2011, 12:15:29 AM
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on September 09, 2011, 05:02:15 AM
If they have a permit in Utah would it carry over here since it is a National Forest and not a state forest?Nope. USFS commercial operator permits are area-specific.
Post by: Miles on September 09, 2011, 07:43:00 AM
All of their 400 class bulls are pushed to the hunter by 15-20 people
Now we can add a defacto charge of wrongfull employment conditions against Team Mossback. According to the web site of Team Mossback, clients are charged roughly $1000 to $1600 per hunter per day. From this we must subtract costs for food, lodging, pack animals, overhead, profit and according to ac, a multitude of bribes and payola to all levels of state government.
So if we take a average per day rate of $1300, and conservatively remove $300 for food, lodging and horses, another $150 for profit, overhead, USFS fee's and insurance, we are left with only with $850 for payola and 15 employees.
Even if we pay no bribes, we are down to $57 per day, for our 15 employees. It seems unlikely any employer with this cost structure could afford to correctly pay his employees at least minimum wage and all the attendant workers comp, UI, SS and other payroll taxes.
Someone is really bored... :rolleyes:
He must be doing something right, cause they're all still working for him.
Post by: mtncook on September 09, 2011, 07:46:24 AM
mtncook
Post by: Knocker of rocks on September 09, 2011, 07:49:39 AM
He must be doing something right, cause they're all still working for him.
Or maybe, just maybe, the claims of bribes, weapon pointing and a hoard of underpaid minions beating the brush for him is just a tad bit exaggerated.
Post by: Knocker of rocks on September 09, 2011, 08:03:37 AM
Be carefull about disclosing money figures in a public forum
How so? My figures are from his web-site, and using standard principles of corporate costs. Furthermore, I'm using these figures to demostrate how some of the claims against Mossback seemingly lack credence from a purely economic standpoint.
I contend that many if not all of the allegations against him are either based on hear-say, exaggerated or false.
He has been slandered on this site by individuals accusing him of large scale payola and of threatening the general public with deadly weapons. I believe these allegations are not true
Post by: MtnMuley on September 09, 2011, 08:15:19 AM
Post by: washingtonmuley on September 09, 2011, 08:27:59 AM
Post by: mtncook on September 09, 2011, 08:42:52 AM
mtncook
Post by: jager on September 09, 2011, 08:51:47 AM
Post by: MtnMuley on September 09, 2011, 10:56:00 AM
That temp permit is issued in an area that is not available for a commercial outfitter. It is parts of the Dayton and non-wilderness of Tucannon. They do not overlap my unit.
mtncook
Aah. That's good to hear. I never knew that type of permit was available.
Post by: rosscrazyelk on September 09, 2011, 11:45:49 AM
Post by: rosscrazyelk on September 09, 2011, 04:01:03 PM
Post by: Knocker of rocks on September 09, 2011, 04:14:57 PM
http://dw.courts.wa.gov/index.cfm?fa=home.home (http://dw.courts.wa.gov/index.cfm?fa=home.home)
Shows that one Josh Teal knows his way around the Walla Walla Courthouse
Post by: ribka on September 09, 2011, 04:18:58 PM
Mossback may be a heavy handed jerk, I don't know. I was merely trying to point out that the allegations of payola and bribery at the local and federal levels is a very serious allegation, which can have serious effect on those making the allegation if it demonstrated to be untrue, slanderous and/or libelous. One should tread carefully when asserting such things.
http://dw.courts.wa.gov/index.cfm?fa=home.home (http://dw.courts.wa.gov/index.cfm?fa=home.home)
Shows that one Josh Teal knows his way around the Walla Walla Courthouse
No worries Team Mossback, like the unfairly slandered wolves, only target the sick and the weak elk thereby strengthing the herd gentics and at the same time doing WA hunters a great service. Good people :tup:
Post by: Caseyd on September 09, 2011, 04:30:17 PM
For some of the doubters that are defending Mr. Moss I am not trying to make enemies here I am just sharing what I have been told and what I know. Besides the rumors that have gone around about how he does things and some on here who have experienced it first hand. Mr. Moss instead of hiring a reputable respected local to show him the country and add him to his team he hired Josh Teal.. Now if you have never seen his name before look on this site and see what you read. Also I invite you to walk the streets of Dayton and ask what they think of him. There are people on here that have hired him and got completely ripped off. Go ask some of the local landowners what they think of him. Better yet go to the court house and see his public record. If I was running a company and wanted people who represented me I sure would not hire this guy... Just saying..
Now that you mentioned Josh.......there are a couple more land owners that will be out and keeping an eye out :tup:
Post by: Huntbear on September 09, 2011, 05:05:02 PM
I can hear and see bottle rockets, fire crackers etc.... going off in some area where some person could be trying to corner the market on a certain bull.
Not that I advocate this kind of thing.. just saying.. :dunno: :dunno: :twocents:
Post by: 440bull on September 09, 2011, 07:19:42 PM
Post by: Huntbear on September 09, 2011, 07:22:04 PM
Hey Rosscrazy, not to make enemies either but since your willing to put out so much personal information and name names on the internet, i thinks it's only fair for you to put your own name on here for everybody to see, if you don't that lets all know who and what we are dealing with. Thanks
Your first post, your gonna call out a long standing member on here? Wow...... :bdid:
Post by: washingtonmuley on September 09, 2011, 07:22:28 PM
Hey Rosscrazy, not to make enemies either but since your willing to put out so much personal information and name names on the internet, i thinks it's only fair for you to put your own name on here for everybody to see, if you don't that lets all know who and what we are dealing with. Thanks440bull,
Nice request considering you have one post. Can you say " Team Mossback"
Post by: 3nails on September 09, 2011, 07:23:20 PM
Hey Rosscrazy, not to make enemies either but since your willing to put out so much personal information and name names on the internet, i thinks it's only fair for you to put your own name on here for everybody to see, if you don't that lets all know who and what we are dealing with. Thanks:'(
Post by: shedcrazy on September 09, 2011, 07:25:14 PM
Post by: TheHunt on September 09, 2011, 07:39:03 PM
Post by: rosscrazyelk on September 09, 2011, 08:28:40 PM
Hey Rosscrazy, not to make enemies either but since your willing to put out so much personal information and name names on the internet, i thinks it's only fair for you to put your own name on here for everybody to see, if you don't that lets all know who and what we are dealing with. Thanks
My name is out there.... There are plenty of people on here that know me and can vouch for my character.
Post by: runamuk on September 09, 2011, 08:32:47 PM
Hey Rosscrazy, not to make enemies either but since your willing to put out so much personal information and name names on the internet, i thinks it's only fair for you to put your own name on here for everybody to see, if you don't that lets all know who and what we are dealing with. Thanks
My name is out there.... There are plenty of people on here that know me and can vouch for my character.
gee I thought it was kinda obvious what his name was :dunno: and I aint no one but I will vouch for him being one of the good guys ;) a friend of a friend and someone who shared their journey on a forum like this from start to finish.... :dunno: none of the high dollar tag buyers ever did that....yet
Post by: deerslyr on September 09, 2011, 08:44:42 PM
Post by: Caseyd on September 09, 2011, 09:33:36 PM
Hey Rosscrazy, not to make enemies either but since your willing to put out so much personal information and name names on the internet, i thinks it's only fair for you to put your own name on here for everybody to see, if you don't that lets all know who and what we are dealing with. Thanks
Not like he mentioned any names that havnt already been mentioned.
Post by: BENCHLEG on September 09, 2011, 10:06:37 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on September 09, 2011, 10:19:22 PM
Post by: ridgefire on September 09, 2011, 11:02:00 PM
Post by: kramer on September 10, 2011, 09:07:04 AM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on September 10, 2011, 09:15:26 AM
i put in for the blues for a archery tag but would never even consider mossback if i was interested in hiring an outfitter. as far as im concerned they are not welcome here and would be much better off staying in utard. :dunno: just my opinionEspecially when Utard has some really big animals :tup:
Post by: TheHunt on September 10, 2011, 09:25:28 AM
Im waiting for the mossbacks to get on here :chuckle: Theyve gotta be watching this lol
You know they are reading... Mossback has the entire Monster Muley site under his control so you can not say anything bad about them. But on here he can only cry to the new owner.
Post by: rosscrazyelk on September 10, 2011, 09:33:32 AM
Not to stir pot or cause a problem but we hunted in Utah last year and ran into Doyle. He was a good person. He gave us Good solid info on our unit. This is the only encounter I have had . I base my judgement off of personal experience and not hear say. Not as bad as people say he is. People are always.going to talk especially when you continually kill big.animals. if he was this terrible don't u think he would get busted. I personally welcome them open arms. I go to there state hunting expecting the same.I am glad that your encounter was positive. Like I said In my original post I have never met the guy. I would think a guy that has been as blessed as he has with his business he would be a outstanding guy. With that said there are people on here who have had the opposite experience well at least with some of his guys anyway.. The people you hire are a refection of who you are. The hiring of Josh Teal leaves a really bad taste in my mouth. I just recently heard thou that Mr. Moss did send some of his guys home because of their actions, So maybe he is a standup guy I :dunno: but I would be more picky when I pick people to work for me..
Post by: MtnMuley on September 10, 2011, 11:23:33 AM
Post by: MtnMuley on September 10, 2011, 11:30:58 AM
Post by: firefighter4607 on September 10, 2011, 11:38:21 AM
.......Somebody surely knows the whole story on the latest Mossback encounter.........or should I say departure. ;):tinfoil: Who's is willing to share???? :brew:
Post by: boneaddict on September 10, 2011, 12:40:56 PM
Gringo had the best post on page three I think and why I dislike the likes of team mossback. Throw USO into the mix though they aren't in town. It was funny running into one of their minions in NM. The guy had 200 trailcams in the back of his truck. 200! Thats all he did. Ran it like a trapline. Now as a Joe Blow walking out in the woods and I come onto a waterhole or something with a trailcam, I try to avoid it so as to not mess with someones set up, but with one of x amount of guides with 200 of them. YIKES. I assume mossback uses some of the similiar tactics. To me its a black eye to hunting. Just sits weird I guess in the gut. I know you don't dis them whatsoever on monstermuleys.
Post by: TheHunt on September 10, 2011, 01:09:19 PM
I did get a few comments and when I asked to see their elk tag they shut up. So hunt on...
Post by: Atroxus on September 10, 2011, 01:15:32 PM
Here is what I learned many years ago. If you come on people who are bugling in the high desired areas where limited tags are available you keep on hunting. When I was in Arizona for every tag there was at least 15 people calling for that person. So if I saw anything I just kept hunting.
I did get a few comments and when I asked to see their elk tag they shut up. So hunt on...
Isn't that type of group hunting illegal in this state? Or am I misunderstanding the laws about that? :dunno:
Post by: benhuntin on September 10, 2011, 01:25:19 PM
I think its only considered group huntin if someone else is tryin to do any shootin :twocents:Here is what I learned many years ago. If you come on people who are bugling in the high desired areas where limited tags are available you keep on hunting. When I was in Arizona for every tag there was at least 15 people calling for that person. So if I saw anything I just kept hunting.
I did get a few comments and when I asked to see their elk tag they shut up. So hunt on...
Isn't that type of group hunting illegal in this state? Or am I misunderstanding the laws about that? :dunno:
Post by: kramer on September 10, 2011, 02:39:35 PM
Post by: firefighter4607 on September 10, 2011, 08:20:49 PM
if you have fifty employees which i believe is how many doyle has you are sure to have one or two people that mess up. it happens. we get it at my work and at any given time there is nine. all im saying is you shouldnt be bashing his name for something his guides have did. i doubt you will see any replys from team mossback. there never is on monster muleys when people start the same rants.You would think that if people start ranting about this the mossback team would speak up and defend what is being said about them. If I heard someone ragging on a company I work for and I know the info is wrong I would say so to defend the company.
Post by: bone head on September 10, 2011, 11:20:01 PM
Post by: BLUEBULLS on September 11, 2011, 05:01:44 AM
im starting to think they have alot more class than most guys in here, just my two :twocents:
Seriously? We watched them trespass on the most heavily posted land up there. Far from classy.
Post by: boneaddict on September 11, 2011, 02:18:37 PM
Post by: Built4Outdoors on September 11, 2011, 05:03:26 PM
I don't believe a landowner would be in violation of any law for not allowing someone to trespass in order to retrieve a dead animal.
Actually they would, landowners cannot block retrieval of animals shot elsewhere. Tresspassing is a different issue of course. I have several law enforcement relatives that have had to look it up in the books while on a call. And they will kindly wait while you retrieve your game if needed.
Of course I always recommend being a responsible hunter and notifying the property owner you need access to recover your game. Most landowners are very nice about it.
Post by: gaddy on September 11, 2011, 05:13:35 PM
Post by: Curly on September 11, 2011, 05:23:53 PM
I don't believe a landowner would be in violation of any law for not allowing someone to trespass in order to retrieve a dead animal.
Actually they would, landowners cannot block retrieval of animals shot elsewhere. Tresspassing is a different issue of course. I have several law enforcement relatives that have had to look it up in the books while on a call. And they will kindly wait while you retrieve your game if needed.
Of course I always recommend being a responsible hunter and notifying the property owner you need access to recover your game. Most landowners are very nice about it.
Built4, no disrespect, but you are misinformed. A landowner has no responsibility to allow access to his land to retrieve an animal.
Post by: MtnMuley on September 11, 2011, 10:32:43 PM
Post by: huntnnw on September 11, 2011, 11:02:26 PM
Post by: bearpaw on September 12, 2011, 12:53:09 AM
go to utah and hunt. almost every person who draws the tag brings 4-6 guys with them its crazy to see the amount of people that help for one tag. if you have fifty employees which i believe is how many doyle has you are sure to have one or two people that mess up. it happens. we get it at my work and at any given time there is nine. all im saying is you shouldnt be bashing his name for something his guides have did. i doubt you will see any replys from team mossback. there never is on monster muleys when people start the same rants.
I didn't read every post, but I think this comment by kramer pretty likely nails the situation. Moss has plenty of guides and there are lots of other people looking for big bulls so they can collect on his reward that he offers for finding monster bulls. There is no telling what lengths some of these people will go to, I doubt Moss asks them to break laws, but there is no way he has control over all these people's actions all the time. However, if something happens he is undoubtedly the one to take the blame. Not saying I agree with any of it, but I doubt he is actually telling these guides to go block roads, break laws, etc. That is not going to fly with the regulating agencies. Maybe he should tell them all to straighten out or hit the road, and maybe he has, none of us know what measures he may have taken one way or the other.
As far as the guy in the blues that is reportedly working for Moss, I doubt Moss knew the guy has a record. Here's an incident that happened to me, I hired a guy several years ago that talked a good story, seemed to be a good hunter, and sounded OK, when I tried to get him licensed in Idaho, his license was declined and I found out the guy had a string of poaching violations on his record, so I immediately got rid of him. So from personal experience I can tell you that Moss may not have known he was hiring a problem individual. If the guy had photos of a big bull that Moss needs he would be inclined to hire him. But it sounds like that individual may have already gotten Moss into some more hot water.
I would just like to remind everyone, there is so much jealousy in hunting that you need to know the facts before you bash someone based on rumors and 3rd hand stories. For example: every time a new world record is taken there are people who start vicious rumors, some people can't stand to see someone else get the biggest animals. (Chuck Adams Montana elk are a prime example.) I am not saying anyone here is at fault or that Moss does everything right, I really don't know. Just saying you might want to have the facts before you make accusations. :twocents:
What he said about Utah is true, when someone gets a primo tag, half the family plus friends just want to go along on the hunt. It's not necessarily about looking for 400 class bulls with many, it's just good times with family and friends. :twocents:
Post by: rosscrazyelk on September 12, 2011, 07:19:56 AM
Post by: PlateauNDN on September 12, 2011, 08:28:33 AM
go to utah and hunt. almost every person who draws the tag brings 4-6 guys with them its crazy to see the amount of people that help for one tag. if you have fifty employees which i believe is how many doyle has you are sure to have one or two people that mess up. it happens. we get it at my work and at any given time there is nine. all im saying is you shouldnt be bashing his name for something his guides have did. i doubt you will see any replys from team mossback. there never is on monster muleys when people start the same rants.
I didn't read every post, but I think this comment by kramer pretty likely nails the situation. Moss has plenty of guides and there are lots of other people looking for big bulls so they can collect on his reward that he offers for finding monster bulls. There is no telling what lengths some of these people will go to, I doubt Moss asks them to break laws, but there is no way he has control over all these people's actions all the time. However, if something happens he is undoubtedly the one to take the blame. Not saying I agree with any of it, but I doubt he is actually telling these guides to go block roads, break laws, etc. That is not going to fly with the regulating agencies. Maybe he should tell them all to straighten out or hit the road, and maybe he has, none of us know what measures he may have taken one way or the other.
As far as the guy in the blues that is reportedly working for Moss, I doubt Moss knew the guy has a record. Here's an incident that happened to me, I hired a guy several years ago that talked a good story, seemed to be a good hunter, and sounded OK, when I tried to get him licensed in Idaho, his license was declined and I found out the guy had a string of poaching violations on his record, so I immediately got rid of him. So from personal experience I can tell you that Moss may not have known he was hiring a problem individual. If the guy had photos of a big bull that Moss needs he would be inclined to hire him. But it sounds like that individual may have already gotten Moss into some more hot water.
I would just like to remind everyone, there is so much jealousy in hunting that you need to know the facts before you bash someone based on rumors and 3rd hand stories. For example: every time a new world record is taken there are people who start vicious rumors, some people can't stand to see someone else get the biggest animals. (Chuck Adams Montana elk are a prime example.) I am not saying anyone here is at fault or that Moss does everything right, I really don't know. Just saying you might want to have the facts before you make accusations. :twocents:
What he said about Utah is true, when someone gets a primo tag, half the family plus friends just want to go along on the hunt. It's not necessarily about looking for 400 class bulls with many, it's just good times with family and friends. :twocents:
Well said Bear.
Post by: Mr Mykiss on September 12, 2011, 02:18:41 PM
Post by: firefighter4607 on September 12, 2011, 02:26:23 PM
I didn't get their bull... and I won't get it, not this year. My tag has been punched. 9/11 bull baby!!
PICS PICS PICS :drool: :chuckle: :chuckle:
Post by: Woodchuck on September 12, 2011, 02:30:58 PM
Post by: runamuk on September 12, 2011, 03:03:35 PM
I didn't get their bull... and I won't get it, not this year. My tag has been punched. 9/11 bull baby!!
rule is no pics it didnt happen ;) now where are those pics
Post by: mainstreamfishing on September 13, 2011, 04:01:13 PM
Post by: washingtonmuley on September 13, 2011, 04:03:45 PM
Post by: Knocker of rocks on September 13, 2011, 04:09:24 PM
What specifically did Mr. Teal do that disqualifies him from guiding? Lots of heresay, no specifics.
Well, if you read this thread, he went to work for Mossback, which seems to be some sort of felonious act in and of itself.
Post by: mainstreamfishing on September 13, 2011, 04:09:35 PM
Post by: Knocker of rocks on September 13, 2011, 04:18:19 PM
How about a little intro first mainstream? Quite a post to jump into for your first post.
Not really
Post by: Woodchuck on September 13, 2011, 04:28:10 PM
http://dw.courts.wa.gov/index.cfm?fa=home.home (http://dw.courts.wa.gov/index.cfm?fa=home.home)
'bout sums it up :dunno:
Post by: 257 Wby Mag on September 13, 2011, 04:37:49 PM
Post by: 257 Wby Mag on September 13, 2011, 04:47:57 PM
Melissa Dawn Teal Is Awarded Judgment
Against Joshua Barlow Teal For Back Support
In The Amount Of
Plus Interest At 12% Per Annum
Phuckin cull can't even pay for his own flesh and blood..... I'd say that speaks VOLUMES.....
Post by: Woodchuck on September 13, 2011, 05:21:05 PM
Post by: TheHunt on September 13, 2011, 05:36:38 PM
Post by: longrangekiller on September 13, 2011, 05:45:31 PM
I have had it happen to me in Utah, they come in harass everybody in the area until only they are the only ones there then block the roads with unmarked vehicles if you try to go around them they start to threaten you. have had on actually start to pull a gun on me because i try to go around him on a quad. when i reported the incident to the game warden he told me they aren't allowed to mess with him, county cops said the same thing something needs to be done but most states , especially Utah won't touch him. he spends to much money, bribes to many people.
haha good luck pulling a gun on me or my hunting partners first off i got a 44 mag that dont *#$k around and second of all most of the guys i hunt with are army special forces. they might have a little bump in the hunt hahaha
Post by: rosscrazyelk on September 13, 2011, 05:51:51 PM
This is the kind of guy Josh Teal is. Ruined a quality elk dream hunt for a very nice lady. HE should be :mgun2:
Post by: 257 Wby Mag on September 13, 2011, 06:00:13 PM
Post by: 257 Wby Mag on September 13, 2011, 06:07:27 PM
Post by: BluMtHunter on September 13, 2011, 07:48:19 PM
Post by: Cougeyes on September 13, 2011, 08:08:06 PM
Post by: bigpaw 77 on September 13, 2011, 08:12:23 PM
Post by: 257 Wby Mag on September 13, 2011, 08:16:40 PM
Then after Josh begged me to give him another chance, against my better judgement, I took it. Josh sends me to Wilbur Eatons place! The day after the results were posted, I had permission from Wilber to hunt his land for free. Josh says, ther are 7 bulls every night entering here, go sit here, and wait, so we do. Low and behold, here come 7 elk, right where Josh said, only problem was, there were 6 cows and a scraggly spike. Huh, what are the chances of that?
After retuning home, a couple phone calls with Josh, Josh agreed to send my money back. weeks pass by, no check, no answered phone calls. Folks started reccommending I take him to small claims court. After speaking with a unamed source at the Columbia County Court House, finding out that he basically doesn't exist, it would be moot to waste my timetraveling to Dayton, burning vaction etc trying to get money out of somebody that doesn't exist on paper.
As for the water, it is pumped from the creek, the propane, Kevin said not worry about it, and Jerry's whiskey wasn't worth drinking. I don't drink on hunts unless somthing gets killed, sooooo guess what, I didn't have a lick to drink.. Keep grasping at straws, cause thats all you got....
Post by: remington300mag on September 13, 2011, 08:28:43 PM
Post by: 257 Wby Mag on September 13, 2011, 08:29:13 PM
OK, THIS CRAP HAS GOTTEN WAY OUT OF HAND, I LIVE 12 MILES OUT OF DAYTON SMACK IN THE MIDDLE OF THE BIGGEST BULLS IN THE STATE, JOSH TEAL IS ONE OF THE HARDEST WORKING HUMANS I HAVE EVER MET AND NO ONE I MEAN NO ONE KNOWS MORE ABOUT THE ELK IN THE AREA MORE THAN HIM, GRANTED NOT MANY OF US LOCALS WERE FOND OF THE MOSSBACK CREW CRAWLING ALL OVER OUR COUNTY BUT THAT IS WHAT IT IS JOSH IS A HONEST HARD WORKING GUIDE THAT WILL NOT TRESPASS HE IS IN CONSTANT CONTACT WITH ARE LOCAL GAME WARDEN. PEOPLE IN GENERAL ARE JEALOUS NO ONE SEEMS TO LIKE THE TOP DOG, SO HIS NAME IS SLANDERED TO MANY LAND OWNERS, SOME OF WHICH THINK THEY HAVE CONTROL OVER LAND THAT AJOINS THERES THAT IN FACT IS OPEN TO PUBLIC HUNTING.. THIS GUY ON HERE RAISING ALL THE CRAP IS A FLAT OUT LIAR , HE AND HIS WIFE WERE PUT UP IN A REAL NICE CABIN, IN THERE SHORT STAY THEY USED UP ALL THE WATER, PROPANE, AND DRANK ALL THE BOOZE, AND SHE HAD A SHOT AT A REAL NICE BULL AND DID NOT TAKE IT, I PERSONALLY DONT NOW ALL THE DETAILS OF WY THEY LEFT BUT THEY DID, BUT THIS GUY BRINGING UP SOMEONES PAST AND PERSONAL FAMILY STUFF IS BULL S%%T, AND AS SOME ONE ELSE ALL READY SAID HE SHOULD PUT HIS NAME ON HERE SO EVERY ONE NOWS WHO HE IS.. WE LIVE HERE AND ARE REAL TIRED OF ALL THE BULL CRAP PEOPLE TALK ABOUT AND HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THERE TALKING ABOUT, SO IF YOU DONT KNOW THE FACTS YOU SHOULD KEEP YOUR TRAP SHUT!!! JOSH HAS MANY RETURN CUSTOMERS AND MANY REFERRALS FROM PAST AND HAS GUIDED TO MANY MORE LARGE BULLS THAN ANY OF HIS COMPETITION. NOT MANY PEOPLE THAT ARE LUCKY ENOUGH TO DRAW ONE OF THESE COVETED TAGS CAN AFFORD TO HIRE A GUIDE , BUT IF YOU DO AND CAN HE IS THE MAN HANDS DOWN..
By the way dumb dumb, I just talked to kevin last week, he's trying tto get ahold of Jerry, the owner of the cabin that we abused so bad, so the pard and I can hunt the backside of Robinette. After last weekend though, we'll turn it down..
Post by: wackmaster on September 13, 2011, 08:31:34 PM
Post by: 257 Wby Mag on September 13, 2011, 08:32:04 PM
Just so you know BluMtHunter we can all type his name into the Washington Court Records data base and see his VERY LENGTHY history.....so ya, that is not a lie....and can be proven by anyone that wants to look it up.......I would never trust a guy that has a record like that!!! He obviously has no regard for laws!!
Thats exactly right, a leopard don't change his spots, he just gets sneakier.... He'll get caught up again, just a matter of time....
Post by: BLUEBULLS on September 13, 2011, 08:33:32 PM
Post by: BluMtWA on September 13, 2011, 08:34:59 PM
Post by: 257 Wby Mag on September 13, 2011, 08:39:54 PM
Post by: BluMtWA on September 13, 2011, 08:41:59 PM
Ask him where his trail camera is now. Pretty sure it found it's way to the sherriff.The camera was stolen by a local butt wipe who thinks he is above the law. The REAL law is taking care of it now. :yeah:
Post by: wackmaster on September 13, 2011, 08:44:06 PM
Post by: BLUEBULLS on September 13, 2011, 08:46:57 PM
Post by: huntnphool on September 13, 2011, 08:48:43 PM
Post by: BLUEBULLS on September 13, 2011, 08:53:29 PM
Sounds to me like this thread has run its course. :twocents:
I think you're right. I think the big picture is "the internet is what is going to ruin hunting"
Post by: 257 Wby Mag on September 13, 2011, 08:54:56 PM
So Kevin, you've killed 8 spikes up here huh? Another wierd look, who told you that, I've killed 3.
I could go on and on, don't forget, BlueMtn boys, 2 days before the hunt, we drank a 1/2 gallon of Pendelton with ol Josh, you know the old saying..... I could go on and on with the bullschitt he baffled me with, but I don't want to feel any stupider than I allready do for believeing what I did... Later boys
Post by: ICEMAN on September 13, 2011, 08:57:37 PM
Is this crap really needed? Makes hunters look like a bunch of whiny arguementative jerks.