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Author Topic: "Red Flag" Laws in Practice  (Read 12105 times)

Offline Tinmaniac

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Re: "Red Flag" Laws in Practice
« Reply #30 on: November 13, 2018, 06:09:44 PM »
Google Red Flag laws.

Offline KFhunter

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Re: "Red Flag" Laws in Practice
« Reply #31 on: November 13, 2018, 06:17:57 PM »
It's much more likely that this guy was nuts,which is why the cops were there to take his guns.I would like to believe that most cops don't get out of bed in the morning and say "today I am going to kill someone ".For anyone that thinks he was shot without reason try pulling your gun on a cop and see what happens.Farewell to thee....

I don't disagree, one shouldn't ever fight with the cops, the courts are for that. 


Offline Special T

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Re: "Red Flag" Laws in Practice
« Reply #32 on: November 13, 2018, 06:20:06 PM »
Could Face Perjury... is what it says in most articles on the Marryland article. If the batting record is better than DV, abuse or other issues currently rampant with fraud I might be ok with it... Better yet if we adopted the same kinds of requirements for those other issues i mentioned I might become a cheerleader.
In archery we have something like the way of the superior man. When the archer misses the center of the target, he turns round and seeks for the cause of his failure in himself. 

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Offline KFhunter

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Re: "Red Flag" Laws in Practice
« Reply #33 on: November 13, 2018, 06:24:34 PM »
You guys should read up on how a red flag order is granted.It goes in front of a judge and he decides if there is probable cause to carry out the order.Do you think the judges and prosecutors don't remind the person making the complaint that they will be prosecuted for making false complaints.?Common sense seems to be in short supply,but then the cops are Nazis so why am I surprised.

I know red flag laws are difficult to get now, we're still in the honey moon test phase. 

After it becomes more "mainstream" and commonplace years down the road it won't be so difficult. As time progresses people get conditioned to it, getting a red flag on someone will become easier. 

If they resist and get shot....the ends have justified the means.  Don't you have a problem with that?

Offline Tinmaniac

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Re: "Red Flag" Laws in Practice
« Reply #34 on: November 13, 2018, 06:36:55 PM »
I have no problem with law enforcement doing whatever they deem necessary when a person CHOOSES to not follow their commands.They do a job that I would not be good at.They have my utmost respect.

Offline Badhabit

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Re: "Red Flag" Laws in Practice
« Reply #35 on: November 13, 2018, 07:30:11 PM »
Tinmaniac,
I have  read plenty of SIRs and can tell you there are officers with agenda's that write the PC request for a warrant without a factual basis. Which I personally find loathsome. I wonder why Indiana allows citizens to shoot LEO's when they are trying to do unlawful actions. Making a statement that there's a lack of common sense is a two way street.

Offline Tinmaniac

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Re: "Red Flag" Laws in Practice
« Reply #36 on: November 13, 2018, 08:00:32 PM »
The Castle Doctrine does not allow citizens to shoot police.It allows for a self defense argument to be made and is very narrow in scope.

Offline ctwiggs1

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Re: "Red Flag" Laws in Practice
« Reply #37 on: November 14, 2018, 07:02:09 AM »
Very troubling story. The caller could have set him for the deadly encounter with the police. Now just wait the caller will hire an attorney and claim wrongful death and get a big payout. If it happened in Washington the officer involved in the shooting could face criminal charges with the passing of the latest initiative 940.

Have you actually read I940?  Not the voters pamphlet summary, but the actual text?  I don't like it as a law, but I don't think what you're saying has a grain of accuracy. 

Just to be clear,I am the only one so far actually defending the cops shooting this moron.Also the last person that would call cops Nazis.

Did you not read what I posted yesterday?   :dunno:


You guys should read up on how a red flag order is granted.It goes in front of a judge and he decides if there is probable cause to carry out the order.Do you think the judges and prosecutors don't remind the person making the complaint that they will be prosecuted for making false complaints.?Common sense seems to be in short supply,but then the cops are Nazis so why am I surprised.

I know red flag laws are difficult to get now, we're still in the honey moon test phase. 

After it becomes more "mainstream" and commonplace years down the road it won't be so difficult. As time progresses people get conditioned to it, getting a red flag on someone will become easier. 

If they resist and get shot....the ends have justified the means.  Don't you have a problem with that?

Yes and no.  I don't like someone losing their guns, but at the same time I do think that we need to recognize there are people out there (and not just felons) who shouldn't own guns.  It's a slippery slope for sure, but it's something that needs to be addressed.  I don't like the category of "mental health", because that could be a catch-all.  Shoot, every single human is expected to experience depression in their lifetime.  That doesn't mean every single human is suicidal.  If, however, they found that certain diagnoses were far more likely to be involved in violent crimes or suicide, I'd lean a little more toward temporary removal of firearms.

I can tell you this with full certainty - if uniformed police officers show up at my house and tell me they are there to take my guns, I am going to work with them and get a complete, itemized inventory of everything they are taking.  It will be non violent and fully compliant.  I will demonstrate to my kids and the people around me that the police officers are doing their jobs and we will still show them respect, despite the frustrating circumstances.

After that, I'm going to bankrupt every person involved in court.

Offline Special T

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Re: "Red Flag" Laws in Practice
« Reply #38 on: November 14, 2018, 08:42:38 AM »
When cops came door to door in The Katrina aftermath there were plenty of folks that didn't get thier guns back, and those were "orders" given by the police.

The lack of prosecutions of other liers and purjurors doesnt give me confidence.

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In archery we have something like the way of the superior man. When the archer misses the center of the target, he turns round and seeks for the cause of his failure in himself. 

Confucius

Offline ctwiggs1

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Re: "Red Flag" Laws in Practice
« Reply #39 on: November 14, 2018, 08:44:29 AM »
When cops came door to door in The Katrina aftermath there were plenty of folks that didn't get thier guns back, and those were "orders" given by the police.

The lack of prosecutions of other liers and purjurors doesnt give me confidence.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

Would you pull a gun on a cop?

I sure won't. 

Offline fastdam

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Re: "Red Flag" Laws in Practice
« Reply #40 on: November 14, 2018, 08:50:23 AM »
Cops who enforce unconstitutional "laws" are not good guys. They are oppressors. The purpose of government i's to protect our rights.  If they instead violate your rights, then they are the bad guys. Not the good guys.     I hope people start shooting back and don't let these pirates get awY withgun confiscation.
 Our right to be armed is inherent with your birth. No man has a right tI interfere. It doesn't matter if he wears a badge or if he wears a black dress.

Offline KFhunter

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Re: "Red Flag" Laws in Practice
« Reply #41 on: November 14, 2018, 09:40:55 AM »
Very troubling story. The caller could have set him for the deadly encounter with the police. Now just wait the caller will hire an attorney and claim wrongful death and get a big payout. If it happened in Washington the officer involved in the shooting could face criminal charges with the passing of the latest initiative 940.

Have you actually read I940?  Not the voters pamphlet summary, but the actual text?  I don't like it as a law, but I don't think what you're saying has a grain of accuracy. 

Just to be clear,I am the only one so far actually defending the cops shooting this moron.Also the last person that would call cops Nazis.

Did you not read what I posted yesterday?   :dunno:


You guys should read up on how a red flag order is granted.It goes in front of a judge and he decides if there is probable cause to carry out the order.Do you think the judges and prosecutors don't remind the person making the complaint that they will be prosecuted for making false complaints.?Common sense seems to be in short supply,but then the cops are Nazis so why am I surprised.

I know red flag laws are difficult to get now, we're still in the honey moon test phase. 

After it becomes more "mainstream" and commonplace years down the road it won't be so difficult. As time progresses people get conditioned to it, getting a red flag on someone will become easier. 

If they resist and get shot....the ends have justified the means.  Don't you have a problem with that?

Yes and no.  I don't like someone losing their guns, but at the same time I do think that we need to recognize there are people out there (and not just felons) who shouldn't own guns.  It's a slippery slope for sure, but it's something that needs to be addressed.  I don't like the category of "mental health", because that could be a catch-all.  Shoot, every single human is expected to experience depression in their lifetime.  That doesn't mean every single human is suicidal.  If, however, they found that certain diagnoses were far more likely to be involved in violent crimes or suicide, I'd lean a little more toward temporary removal of firearms.

I can tell you this with full certainty - if uniformed police officers show up at my house and tell me they are there to take my guns, I am going to work with them and get a complete, itemized inventory of everything they are taking.  It will be non violent and fully compliant.  I will demonstrate to my kids and the people around me that the police officers are doing their jobs and we will still show them respect, despite the frustrating circumstances.

After that, I'm going to bankrupt every person involved in court.



I guarantee there're folks out there that are good decent law abiding people that just happen to have a deep mistrust for the government, and will fight anyone who comes for their guns.   

How many Molon labe's meme's have you seen splashed across FB? What do you think that means?  "come and take"  it means they'll fight, just like this guy did who got shot. 

This law is going to kill police, and those targeted by the courts under this red flag law.  The first time or two the police get killed serving this illegal court order and the cops will start using SWAT teams to take guns because it's dangerous.  We all know that entering people's houses with a SWAT team is risky, then it'll evolve into serving a no knock court order to take guns...this isn't going to end well. 



EDIT:  read the post just above mine for an example of a melon labe type,  I know of more more extreme examples. 

Offline KFhunter

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Re: "Red Flag" Laws in Practice
« Reply #42 on: November 14, 2018, 09:47:15 AM »
PSA:  Anyone living in a red flag state had better be very careful what they say on social media, and what they say to family members, work staff, schools ect ect. 

"red flag" is a censorship on free speech,  talk too much......*knock* *knock*

Offline ctwiggs1

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Re: "Red Flag" Laws in Practice
« Reply #43 on: November 14, 2018, 10:11:59 AM »
So where do you guys draw the line?  Are you ok with felons owning guns? 

Offline KFhunter

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Re: "Red Flag" Laws in Practice
« Reply #44 on: November 14, 2018, 10:24:06 AM »
So where do you guys draw the line?  Are you ok with felons owning guns?

irrelevant

 


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