How many doe whackers we have out there ?

[bearpaw]

I like eating wild game, it's healthier than eating domestic meat. Because I hunt several states we usually put some does, bucks, and an elk or two in the freezer most years. I usually try to buy extra doe tags or cow elk tags to insure a full freezer, that way when I do get to buck hunt for myself, I can hunt for horns. I like hunting with any weapon, it's nice when I can do some bow hunting and rifle hunting in the same year.

[hoyt5199]

Like most, I am a hunter who would love to take a monster black tail, but being on the wetside we all know how hard this can be. I will shoot a doe, I hate eating tags and afterall, you cannot eat the horns.

[Kain]

Healthy buck to doe ratio is very important to healthy deer populations and competition between bucks makes it a lot more fun with them responding to calls and rattling.  Habitat is much more important at this time to larger deer populations than letting does survive and breed.  If a certain area has the maximum sustainable population, then any production in excess of the natural death rate will mean more deer will die of starvation and disease because of overpopulation or need to be harvested by hunting.

Ideally, if you could have a 1:1 buck to breeding doe ratio, competition between buck for those few does would make for some exciting action.  If you killed 1/2 the breeding does, the remaining 1/2 could in theory produce enough does to replace the ones that were killed and produce as many bucks...which would have to be harvested from the buck side to keep the population stable.

Lets play with some numbers (assuming carrying capacity is 200 deer):

100 buck and 100 does...harvest 50 does and 50 bucks...remaining 50 does on average will produce 50 does and 50 bucks...leaving 100 does and 100 bucks

from same starting point harvest 10 does and 90 bucks...remaining 90 does will produce 90 bucks and 90 does...leaving 180 does and 100 bucks (90% young bucks)  Now you have 80 more animals than can be sustained, so you will kill off 50 does and 30 bucks to starvation leaving 130 does and 70 bucks.  You can probably see where that trend would end up

lets start with 50 bucks and 100 does.  Kill 10 bucks and 50 does.  Remaining 50 will produce 50 does and 50 bucks leaving 90 bucks and 100 does (none die...190 deer).  Next year take 40 bucks and 50 does.  You'll be left with 100 does and 100 bucks

Might be a little oversimplification (especially assuming that each doe can produce 2 offspring each year, but you can see the point.  Killing does (as long as production rate replenishes the breeding doe population) in the long run lets you kill more bucks, and the bucks are older a.k.a bigger (you're letting half the bucks walk and survive another year)

So yes, I'll kill a doe every time...until a buck bigger than any other that I have shot walks out.  Now I won't shoot a doe when I'm elk hunting, but I also won't kill any buck that isn't a wall hanger.

This is a very good example except for one thing.  When populations are over carrying capacity it is not just the excess that die.  That is a very common misunderstanding. 

Take your example.  A certain area can sustain 200 deer.  100 are does and they have one fawn each.  For the whole next year that area will be over carrying capacity by 100 deer.  When you ask most people how many will die because of it they will say 100.  Right?  Well that is not how it actually works.  You had 300 deer where only 200 could be sustained.  You have 300 deer competing for 200 deers worth of food, water, space and shelter.  That means EVERY deer in that area had less all year long.    When winter comes along MOST will die or be so malnourished or stressed that few will have offspring the next spring.

Most people think that "carrying capacity" is the number the area should have but in reality it is the maximum an areas can have an still maintain healthy animals.  Even being near carrying capacity is bad for most wildlife.

Remember kids I am not a biologist I just play one on the internet.   

[jrebel]

Everything depends on the seasons outlook.  Example:  I am going to Montana this year, drew a cow muzzy tag here and also drew a palouse buck tag.....this means no doe shooting for me until late season. 

If I have no other plans it will depend on how much meat is in the freezer?  If it's getting low on deer burger then I will kill a doe on the first day if she is big enough. 

Lots of variables.

[Yak-NDN]

The deer population seems down, I have no problem with killing antlerles but I just try to keep every doe alive for reproduction.

[Curly]

The deer population seems down, I have no problem with killing antlerles but I just try to keep every doe alive for reproduction.

Same here.

I passed up a few does last year during late muzzleloader season (and a few spikes) because I know the population is lower than what it historically has been. 

[Yak-NDN]

The deer population seems down, I have no problem with killing antlerles but I just try to keep every doe alive for reproduction.

Same here.

I passed up a few does last year during late muzzleloader season (and a few spikes) because I know the population is lower than what it historically has been.

Should be dropping them spikes but a little small not much for the freezer on them.

[Kain]

The deer population seems down, I have no problem with killing antlerles but I just try to keep every doe alive for reproduction.

Same here.

I passed up a few does last year during late muzzleloader season (and a few spikes) because I know the population is lower than what it historically has been.

Thats good. Hunters know their areas and what it can handle as far as hunting pressure.  My area seems stable but I have been hunting predators just to keep their numbers down when I can.  Next step would be to not take doe's if I thought they needed it, despite what the regs are.

[pips4bucks]

I've been known to let the air out of a slick head from time to time.  As long as she doesn't have fawns, and it's legal to hunt 'em, game on!  I'll target bucks if I can, but won't pass a nice, fat, barren doe.  YUM!   

I leave the game management to the people who get paid to do so.  Some of them may be idiots, but they have a plan of some sorts.  If we play our part as hunters it'll help them with their management.

[bare.hunter]

We know that good managnent requirer that we take some does.there is a good example here there is
an area that gets hunted hard and alot of small bucks get killed and that leaves more does well there is
not enough bucks to breed those does in the first or second rut so what happens is alot of fawns are born
really late they have a much harder time making it.Last year in early muzzy season I say two spoted fawns
in late sept.this tells me the buck to doe ratio is way out of wack time to kill does and leave some buck to
grow up and breed.It is this reason Iam a doe killer and the steaks arnt bad either.

[jstone]

Used to but not any more.

[Jeffrey]

Late season 2010.  She sure tasted great!  !

[Snapshot]

[I have never 'whacked' anything.] Given the opportunity I will kill a doe.

[NWWABOWHNTR]

Nice one Snapshot!

[iRem]

I usually take a doe if it presents it self and 90% of the time they always do This year I will not take a doe with in the early season. I think I'll pass until the late season and see if I can take a buck in the rut for archery.