WDFW-Why our Early Elk Season is Shorter

[pianoman9701]

Pianoman at the end of this post I'll list what we learned.  I think it would strengthen our community.  Yes we would probably lose about 10% of our numbers but we would lose the 10% that shouldn't be carrying a bow during the season anyways.  We would be a stronger and more ethical community.  For people who are serious bowhunters and do their own research probably about 75% of the stuff taught will be a review.  But for the people who are not as serious and don't do much research it will make them a much better/safer/more ethical bowhunter.  I say we would lose at least 10% because they are the ones who are not all that serious about bowhunting and would say *censored* it and feel its a huge pain in the rear and go back to gun hunting.  It would separate the bowhunters from the guys who just hunt with a bow.  On the plus side not only would we lose the "less dedicated" or less desirables all that would attend these courses would learn something and would get better at their craft.  I know I do ALOT of research and I still learned stuff.  Here is a rundown of how the course I attended in Alabama went.  Now granted since it was in Alabama it was a little bit treestand heavy so I'm sure a WA based one would be structured slightly different.

1.) They taught a class on parts and pieces of a bow, how to care for your bow and travel with your bow and taught how to properly tune your bow and also the importance of doing so. 
2.) They inspected all our bows for safety etc.  We then shot all of our bows and had an accuracy test.  Had to hit deer vitals  3 out of 4 times at unknown distances from 20-35 yds. 
3.) We got a class on the different types of tree stands and how to properly use them.  We learned how to properly wear a safety harness and learned how to get in and out of a treestand without falling.  We then had to fall out of the tree stand and get back in the treestand (The stand was 4 feet off the ground not 20)
4.) We got a class on what ethical shots were and when not to take a shot.  We then got a class on the steps to take once you have made the shot until you start tracking the deer.  Also how to tell where you shot by the reaction of the deer and the hair and blood etc. 
5.) We then got a class on following blood trails and there was a mock blood trail for us to follow.
6.) We then got a class on what to expect for out of state hunts and how to prepare for them.  Ironically enough I met one guy who has hunted up in the Rimrock GMU.  Most of the instructors go to Idaho and hunt elk every year.  I also learned that expandables are not that popular down here.
7.) The last class was about wilderness survival, map reading, gps usage and first aid in the field. 

Oh we also got a free lunch that was deer burgers and deer hotdogs with chips pop etc.  Overall it was a really good class.  It was fun and really laid back.  I did learn alot and I feel it is one more piece of info i can use.  The total cost was $45.  My bow hunter safety card is good in every state and in Canada.

Thanks for the info, Colockum. I'm all for good ethics and increased effectiveness afield. I just wish there were some way to reward bow hunters for taking this course voluntarily, like special hunts or dates open only to graduates, much like the MH program has. I suppose that sooner rather than later this will be required. But, it would be nice to see people do it on their own and it would be a measure of their commitment to ethics and archery as a whole.

[Matt]

Nope.  3 total.  It is still a loss either way but not extreme.  I think that losing the last week of September deer effects more than anything.  We have a total of days 29 in the woods on the East side and 36 on the West for archery elk, that's more days than I have vacation time.  Do we really want to fight this battle for more or be happy with what we have.

This is the type of attitude which will guarantee that we lose more and more hunting privileges.  This type of attitude led to the loss of hunting branch bulls on the east side forever (unless you draw a permit), the loss of hunting cows during the ML season on the east side, the loss of a late ML season on the east side, the shorter archery seasons, the loss of hunting cows in the Colockum during archery season, not being able to shoot cows in the Bumping an the Nile during archery season, and the Colockum going to true spike only.  I could continue for awhile. 

The point is, is that this type of attitude leads to less and less hunting for us.  Too many people say "Well it can't get anyworse, we should be thankfull for what we have."  Then what happens?  They take more hunting from us then what do people say. "Well it can't get any worse, we should be thankfull for what we have."  Then what happens?  They take more hunting from us, then what do people say........  You all get the idea. 

Its the attitude that me and Pianoman have that will hopefully stop the WDFW and hopefully get back some of our hunting our at the very least keep them from taking more opportunities.  I don't mean to single you out Matt.  You are definately not the only one who thinks like this.  Most people think like this.  You just happened to provide me with a really good quote that represents this type of attitude.

Horse pooey.  Not only do we have to defend out allocation of time with WDFW, but also the gun hunters who want our time restricted and now the movement from some trad guys to split it so they have their own season.  Trust me I don't want to lose any more days and I do my share of rallying.  The key is not to fight so much but to unite and present proposals that are a win win.  Something well thought out that they cannot dispute nor deny.  Listening to folks turns into a big whine session and those guys listening have an easy time defending their decision. 

The ultimate goal is to sustain a herd so that we can continue hunting.  There is no way to please everyone, especially when they have to consider the general public that doesn't look at hunting as a necessity.  With the initiative process we could lose hunting all together if it was ever put to a vote.  There are no truely correct harvest numbers nor is there an exact count of the populations.  Everything is a guess.  But we can all agree that there is over crowding while out hunting.  At least with archery and rifle.  So how do we balance a healthy herd and make a good majority of the hunters happy?

By the way when it comes to a bowhunters course I am at the head of the line of supporters.  I can't go into an archery shop this time of year because of all those that think they can bowhunt and are buying their first bow this week or just pulled it out and found out the string has broke.....etc.  This is a sport of skill and detication not something that looks cool and easy on tv.

[colockumelk]

Matt and Pianoman you both make some really good points. I agree.

[Snapshot]

... and now the movement from some trad guys to split it so they have their own season.

Can you please send me a PM and direct me to some of those guys? I'd like to know exactly what (beyond talking about it around a campfire) has been, or is being, done to advance such an idea.

[colockumelk]

It would ne hard to do but if you did a search you could find this topic. It's been brought up before but not for awhile. I also know that some proposed it to wdfw a few years back. Thank goodness it didn't gain any traction because if archers get split we will have less of a voice

[Snapshot]

I suspect it is a red herring...people are constantly asking this or asking that of the WDFW. But I don't think any real proposal has been put to them.

[JLS]

Pianoman at the end of this post I'll list what we learned.  I think it would strengthen our community.  Yes we would probably lose about 10% of our numbers but we would lose the 10% that shouldn't be carrying a bow during the season anyways.  We would be a stronger and more ethical community.  For people who are serious bowhunters and do their own research probably about 75% of the stuff taught will be a review.  But for the people who are not as serious and don't do much research it will make them a much better/safer/more ethical bowhunter.  I say we would lose at least 10% because they are the ones who are not all that serious about bowhunting and would say *censored* it and feel its a huge pain in the rear and go back to gun hunting.  It would separate the bowhunters from the guys who just hunt with a bow.  On the plus side not only would we lose the "less dedicated" or less desirables all that would attend these courses would learn something and would get better at their craft.  I know I do ALOT of research and I still learned stuff.  Here is a rundown of how the course I attended in Alabama went.  Now granted since it was in Alabama it was a little bit treestand heavy so I'm sure a WA based one would be structured slightly different.

1.) They taught a class on parts and pieces of a bow, how to care for your bow and travel with your bow and taught how to properly tune your bow and also the importance of doing so. 
2.) They inspected all our bows for safety etc.  We then shot all of our bows and had an accuracy test.  Had to hit deer vitals  3 out of 4 times at unknown distances from 20-35 yds. 
3.) We got a class on the different types of tree stands and how to properly use them.  We learned how to properly wear a safety harness and learned how to get in and out of a treestand without falling.  We then had to fall out of the tree stand and get back in the treestand (The stand was 4 feet off the ground not 20)
4.) We got a class on what ethical shots were and when not to take a shot.  We then got a class on the steps to take once you have made the shot until you start tracking the deer.  Also how to tell where you shot by the reaction of the deer and the hair and blood etc. 
5.) We then got a class on following blood trails and there was a mock blood trail for us to follow.
6.) We then got a class on what to expect for out of state hunts and how to prepare for them.  Ironically enough I met one guy who has hunted up in the Rimrock GMU.  Most of the instructors go to Idaho and hunt elk every year.  I also learned that expandables are not that popular down here.
7.) The last class was about wilderness survival, map reading, gps usage and first aid in the field. 

Oh we also got a free lunch that was deer burgers and deer hotdogs with chips pop etc.  Overall it was a really good class.  It was fun and really laid back.  I did learn alot and I feel it is one more piece of info i can use.  The total cost was $45.  My bow hunter safety card is good in every state and in Canada.

Thanks for the info, Colockum. I'm all for good ethics and increased effectiveness afield. I just wish there were some way to reward bow hunters for taking this course voluntarily, like special hunts or dates open only to graduates, much like the MH program has. I suppose that sooner rather than later this will be required. But, it would be nice to see people do it on their own and it would be a measure of their commitment to ethics and archery as a whole.

I would fully support a mandatory bowhunter ed.  Montana requires it, and I learned a lot from it.