Post by: jnutzalot on January 19, 2015, 08:32:17 PM
Edit: Took 2 months to get the meat back. Here's the time line of trying to contact them since people keep asking.
1) I contracted them at 3 weeks and asked if my order was ready (they never attempted to contact me). At that time they took my information so they could check on my order but never called me back. (week 3)
2) I contacted them at the start of the following week and received their message machine during normal business hours, I don't leave a message. I figure they still aren't done. My friends tell me not to worry. (beginning of week 4)
3) I contacted them again at the end of the week and received their message machine again, I leave a message stating, "it's now been a month and I haven't received my meat" or something to that extent. (end of week 4)
4) I call the following week and get someone on the phone. I give them my name and they say they don't see my ticket up and that I had a bunch of orders ahead of me but they will be working all weekend to get caught up on orders, blah, blah, blah - It should be ready in 1-2 weeks. (week 5)
5) The following week I call and my call does not go through - I get one of those phone company error messages. Later I find out their card machine shares a line with their main line so maybe that is why.
6) I call again later that day and get the same error message. I start to worry they went out of business or something. (Week 6, it's now been a 1.5 months)
7) I call again the following week and get a their message machine again, It's mid morning and I figure maybe they aren't in yet, or not answering their phone as usual. (beginning of week 7)
8 ) I call back mid week and get a hold of the manager, tell him how long I have been waiting, and he tells me my Elk is up and being worked on and they will call me as soon as it is ready. (week 7)
9 ) A week goes by and they call and leave a message on my voice mail that my elk is ready. (week 8 )
A heads up - I live 2 hrs from butcher, not that easy for me to just drive to his shop on a whim.
Update 3: The butcher called me back today. He agreed that they were at fault. He also agreed to replace my meat with Farm Elk. We agreed on 92 pounds of rounds and burger, and 40 lbs of tenderloins and backstrap. He stated he would be docking the pay from the employee that mishandled the meat and apologized.
Now comes the part to see if he follows through.
Update 2: The Butcher did not call me back all day, again! I had to call back and the Manager once again gave me the runaround about the supposed employee that botched the order...My patience has about ran out at this point. He promises to call me tomorrow at 10:00 to settle this up. We'll see what happens, this is such a joke.
Update 1: So after calling the butcher at 10:00 he never called me back. I waited until about 1:30pm until calling him back. He stated at that time that he hadn't "seen the kid that butchered my elk yet". I asked about the tenderloins and he still didnt have an answer. I brought up the rancid smell and taste of the meat and he ask me, "Did you bring them in, in game bags? They might have got stored in the game bags, let me get hold of this kid and I'll call you back". He never called back.
I thawed out the backstraps today, they smell like a garbage can, like rancid meat. I gagged just smelling them, pretty sure I would get sick if I ate any of the steak. The straps were in perfect shape when we had them for dinner the night I brought the Elk into the shop, they smelt sweet, and tasted like lean beef before sitting in his shop for 2 months.
On the upside the burger does taste good, and smells proper. Although I'm figuring it's cut with a great deal of beef or all beef, it dosesn't look that rich red that elk burger has, here's a pic....
Post by: KFhunter on January 19, 2015, 08:35:40 PM
next step is to call this butcher and ask what's up.
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 19, 2015, 08:36:39 PM
Post by: longwalker on January 19, 2015, 08:39:57 PM
Post by: jrebel on January 19, 2015, 08:40:56 PM
I would call them and ask first. If they don't have a reason and it is not a mistake, then I would do a write up on here so it never happens to another sportsmen.
Why are you just now getting your elk back? When did you harvest it?
So many questions unanswered!!!!
Post by: bobcat on January 19, 2015, 08:42:34 PM
Post by: mkcj on January 19, 2015, 08:43:37 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on January 19, 2015, 08:48:42 PM
So I no longer get lazy :dunno: :chuckle:
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on January 19, 2015, 08:50:50 PM
Post by: jnutzalot on January 19, 2015, 09:03:41 PM
The butcher was 2 hours from home, I couldn't take him to my regular butcher in town due to how far away we were and the fact that we still had more hunting left to do. I'm going to talk to the butcher tomorrow to get to the bottom of this, he is closed Sunday and Monday...
Edit: It was 2 months not 3 I took it in on Nov 8th and got a call to pick up on Jan 9th. Picked it up the following Saturday.
Post by: jnutzalot on January 19, 2015, 09:09:05 PM
Does the 190 pounds that you brought in include the rib cage and back bone? What size elk was it? Bull or cow?The weight did not include the ribcage we did not get much rib meat out (no bone). It was a bull.
Post by: bobcat on January 19, 2015, 09:13:11 PM
Unless your bull had a ton of blood shot meat or something, I don't see how you could get only 73 pounds of meat. 150 would be more like it.
Post by: lonedave on January 19, 2015, 09:15:47 PM
Post by: jnutzalot on January 19, 2015, 09:16:39 PM
Wow! A bull like that... should have got twice as much meat back as what you got. A spike bull I got a few years ago was 160 pounds of mostly boned out meat. The only bone we packed out was the shoulders, which doesn't weigh much.Yea...I'm starting to get pretty worked up.
Unless your bull had a ton of blood shot meat or something, I don't see how you could get only 73 pounds of meat. 150 would be more like it.
Post by: jrebel on January 19, 2015, 09:18:25 PM
Nice bull though!! What did you do with the head / horns.
Post by: JimmyHoffa on January 19, 2015, 09:19:01 PM
Post by: Tbar on January 19, 2015, 09:19:18 PM
Wow! A bull like that... should have got twice as much meat back as what you got. A spike bull I got a few years ago was 160 pounds of mostly boned out meat. The only bone we packed out was the shoulders, which doesn't weigh much.:yeah:
Unless your bull had a ton of blood shot meat or something, I don't see how you could get only 73 pounds of meat. 150 would be more like it.
That age class of bull would probably field dress in the low to mid 400lb range. I can tell you I get just over 60% boneless meat when I do my own. My Butcher gets closer to 70%. Something is wrong.
Post by: jnutzalot on January 19, 2015, 09:35:44 PM
Post by: Mfowl on January 19, 2015, 09:38:08 PM
Post by: jnutzalot on January 19, 2015, 09:44:45 PM
Post by: Bullkllr on January 19, 2015, 09:47:28 PM
Post by: _TONY_ on January 19, 2015, 09:47:32 PM
Post by: ellensburgpo on January 19, 2015, 09:54:35 PM
Post by: builtfordtough on January 19, 2015, 09:57:41 PM
Post by: huntnnw on January 19, 2015, 09:59:55 PM
Post by: KFhunter on January 19, 2015, 10:01:10 PM
Post by: jnutzalot on January 19, 2015, 10:04:57 PM
Post by: jnutzalot on January 19, 2015, 10:26:58 PM
My cow netted us 90 lbs of burger this year and that doesn't count the steaks. You got the shaft. Hope it was a mistake and he forgot to give you some.Getting a shoulder sneak mount done on him, I'm thinking ears back. I should have better luck with the taxidermist than I did the butcher.
Nice bull though!! What did you do with the head / horns.
Post by: stevemiller on January 19, 2015, 10:27:52 PM
Post by: builtfordtough on January 19, 2015, 10:30:30 PM
Post by: jrebel on January 19, 2015, 10:31:15 PM
I wonder if you got someones cow instead of your bull.
That would be a small cow.
Post by: stevemiller on January 19, 2015, 10:33:23 PM
Agreed but without the roast to be able to compare size to,They are just not there for the weight either.Maybe they are still there,if not then its not right.I wonder if you got someones cow instead of your bull.
That would be a small cow.
Post by: bone collector 12 on January 19, 2015, 10:35:36 PM
Post by: stevemiller on January 19, 2015, 10:45:01 PM
Average elk bull weighs 474 pounds
Hanging weight skinned no head no legs 337 pounds
total meat yield 242
steak and roast 77
burger 165.
left shoulder 29
right shoulder 30
left hind 50
right hind 44
flank and rib 37 of burger
backstrap 31
neck 17 for trim
tenderloins 4
bone 95
hide head and horns 62
about 75 for legs and guts.
Post by: huntnnw on January 19, 2015, 11:18:33 PM
Post by: NumaJohn on January 20, 2015, 12:04:46 AM
I can only echo huntnnw's comment about the benefit of processing your own animals. It takes time--though less time the more you do it--but it's always more satisfying to know everything about what you are eating and how it was cared for from the field to the plate.
I hope you and the butcher can come to some sort of resolution.
John
Post by: huntnnw on January 20, 2015, 12:33:47 AM
Post by: syoungs on January 20, 2015, 12:37:16 AM
I would hope that maybe the butcher left a box or 2 in the freezer and it was an honest mistake, but im really doubting its your animal if it was so funky you had to throw some away already.
Sorry to hear it man, I wouldnt hold out for to much of a resolution, just keep in mind its easier to catch flys with honey, be the nice guy at first and see what his reaction is.
with you tube, and the price of processing equipment now a days, it really is a good idea to do it yourself if at all possible, I know sometimes it isnt feasable, but its a very rewarding experience.
Post by: Bean Counter on January 20, 2015, 12:43:24 AM
We normally get 200-250 out of a bull. Lots of trimming as I don't like silverseam and tendon in my meat. I would definitely ask where the meat was for 3 months. If it was more than a few weeks refrigeration, even under the most ideal circumstances, won't keep it. It would likely have to be frozen lest it spoil.
I gotta play devils advocate. How was your field care? Did you let your elk sit for 24 hours in the warm sun before getting I the processor? Did you blast through his hind legs a few times? I've got less than 50% of what I normally do when I had a bad shot once.
Post by: Widgeondeke on January 20, 2015, 05:13:32 AM
:sry: sorry this happened. I really hope you call today and get "yes we have an entire flat still here"
Not that it helps you, but my sons forkie blacktail gave us over 50# of meat when I was done processing it. I weighed it all on our digital small animal scale
Good luck with that phone call.
Post by: Kuduman on January 20, 2015, 06:06:01 AM
weather that elk meat is yours or not would be pretty hard to prove. However, what is the real issue is the yield and the lack of steaks that you received. That combined with the turn around time tells me that you got hosed.
I had a deer butchered about 25 years ago and when I went to pick up the meat I was given one box that weighed about 30 pounds of all burger. My instructions to the butcher upon drop off was........ As many steaks as possible and as little burger as possible. This was a neck shot buck with a hanging weight of 115#. I was told by an employee that my steaks were given to another customer by mistake. So not only did I not receive my meat but I was charged for the steaks that were given away :yike:
Ive done my own butchering ever since.
Good Luck... Looking forward to seeing how this ends.
Post by: jackelope on January 20, 2015, 06:29:02 AM
Post by: wildweeds on January 20, 2015, 07:12:39 AM
Post by: pianoman9701 on January 20, 2015, 07:16:20 AM
Post by: Elkrunner on January 20, 2015, 07:30:13 AM
It took 3 months to get my elk back. Shot him during modern on or around the 12th of November....Just him back on saturday. I really didnt notice how little meat was there until I started going through it today for dinner preparations, then I weighed it.
The butcher was near the Packwood area, I couldn't take him to my regular butcher in town due to how far away we were and the fact that we still had more hunting left to do. I'm going to talk to the butcher tomorrow to get to the bottom of this, he is closed Sunday and Monday...
3 months??? That is definitely messed up. I have never heard of it taking more than 2 weeks. Something is really fishy here
Post by: birddogdad on January 20, 2015, 07:32:45 AM
Post by: Bullkllr on January 20, 2015, 07:54:11 AM
It took 3 months to get my elk back. Shot him during modern on or around the 12th of November....Just him back on saturday. I really didnt notice how little meat was there until I started going through it today for dinner preparations, then I weighed it.
The butcher was near the Packwood area, I couldn't take him to my regular butcher in town due to how far away we were and the fact that we still had more hunting left to do. I'm going to talk to the butcher tomorrow to get to the bottom of this, he is closed Sunday and Monday...
3 months??? That is definitely messed up. I have never heard of it taking more than 2 weeks. Something is really fishy here
:yeah:
The processing probably takes a few hours at most. No way was it hanging that long. Unless they froze it to go on vacation or something, that's beyond reasonable and highly suspect.
Post by: Smokepole on January 20, 2015, 08:19:03 AM
Post by: lokidog on January 20, 2015, 08:38:44 AM
Just found this in Long Range hunting magazine.
Average elk bull weighs 474 pounds
Hanging weight skinned no head no legs 337 pounds
total meat yield 242
steak and roast 77
burger 165.
I'm sorry for the OP, however, I'm not sure I believe 200+ pounds out of an elk. :dunno: The last elk I weighed my meat, self processed archery killl, no bloodshot meat, was about 110 pounds. This was a 5 point Margaret bull, unless I am thinking of the cow I shot a few years later. I'm pretty sure it was the bull though and I did not save rib meat, birds need to eat too. ** OK, maybe it was the cow, young one. **
I do know that my moose was 500+ pounds of meat (untrimmed, no bones) brought to the butcher, and I find it hard to believe that more than a small percentage of elk would come close to half that, and cleaned up meat no less. ** Still hold be this.**
Post by: pianoman9701 on January 20, 2015, 08:41:56 AM
Post by: Bob33 on January 20, 2015, 08:45:23 AM
"The boneless lean yield averaged 50 percent of the field dressed weight."
"The clean dressed weight (field-dressed weight minus the head and hide) of these carcasses, the great majority of which were bulls, was 305 pounds. The weight of boneless cuts was 159 pounds."
"Average field-dressed weights, boneless meat yield, and the proportion of Wyoming elk harvested in each age class are shown in Table 3. These figures, in addition to the proportion of bulls and cows harvested in 2001, were used to calculate an overall weighted average for field-dressed elk in Wyoming. The weighted average for all elk, including calves, was 328.2 pounds field dressed, which can be converted to 164.1 pounds of boneless elk meat per animal."
Post by: NRA4LIFE on January 20, 2015, 09:37:22 AM
Post by: buckhorn2 on January 20, 2015, 09:47:03 AM
Post by: KFhunter on January 20, 2015, 09:51:59 AM
We took an elk to the butchers and while we were hanging it his wife walks in and asked him what he wanted for dinner and he went over to an elk he was working on and cut out a piece of backstrap and gave it to her for his dinner you might have found the same butcher.
theft, unless it was his name on the tag.
I think you all have it worse on that side of the state than we do on this side :o
Post by: KFhunter on January 20, 2015, 09:53:55 AM
good thread to visit before choosing your next butcher
Post by: Hunterman on January 20, 2015, 10:09:44 AM
I would suggest to smell the meat, it will probably all stink.
Hunterman(Tony)
Post by: Kuduman on January 20, 2015, 10:38:43 AM
We took an elk to the butchers and while we were hanging it his wife walks in and asked him what he wanted for dinner and he went over to an elk he was working on and cut out a piece of backstrap and gave it to her for his dinner you might have found the same butcher.
Your Kidding :yike:
Post by: Band on January 20, 2015, 10:39:43 AM
No question about it, this meat processor needs to be called out and raked over the coals! :bash:
To the OP, one of the lessons I hope you learned is to get an estimated completion date and be a squeaky wheel when that date has passed. If you're the one customer who isn't a squeaky wheel, you'll be the most likely to be screwed by the processor's poor business management. Sorry it happened to you.
I know you're calling him today and I'll bet good money you'll get nothing but excuses and/or obfuscation.
Post by: bear hunter on January 20, 2015, 10:41:52 AM
Post by: Bean Counter on January 20, 2015, 11:05:18 AM
No question about it, this meat processor needs to be called out and raked over the coals! :bash:
There IS a question about it, Band. Witch hunts don't flatter our reputation as a forum community. :twocents:
There are two sides to most stories and the butcher deserves his day in "court" if we are going to run yet another a kangaroo court. Namely, its entirely possible that the severe meat shortage is explained by sloppy field care. IDK whether that's the case but having killed a few critters in my day I can see how a few sloppy habits can cause significant spoilage or waste.
Its entirely to unfair to a butcher to drag him over the coals if he was handed 100 pounds of boned out meat and 50% of it was filthy and expect that 100 pounds be delivered. I sure wouldn't go into business to put up with that.
Post by: Maverick on January 20, 2015, 11:13:02 AM
Wow, 3 months is a loooong time to wait to get your bull back. I wonder if something happened to your elk, and It took him a while to skim meat from other customers to replace the meat? Could be why you got so little back with cuts/burger that you didn't want and no tenderloins....Just a thought.
I was wondering that myself?
Post by: krapmit on January 20, 2015, 11:45:42 AM
WHY WOULD HIS 4 QUARTERS ONLY BE 190 LBS IN THE FIRST PLACE?
Post by: Timberstalker on January 20, 2015, 12:18:03 PM
THIS GUYS ORIGINAL POST DOESNT MAKE ANY SENSE :dunno: ....HE SAID THE BULL IN QUARTERS WEIGHED 190 LBS...My 5x5 west side bull this year hung at 440lb. and I got a 59% return (260 lbs of meat back) which is pretty good. You're typically looking for 55-60% return on an animal.
WHY WOULD HIS 4 QUARTERS ONLY BE 190 LBS IN THE FIRST PLACE?
This is a good point..........
Post by: Bob33 on January 20, 2015, 12:26:28 PM
Wow! A bull like that... should have got twice as much meat back as what you got. A spike bull I got a few years ago was 160 pounds of mostly boned out meat. The only bone we packed out was the shoulders, which doesn't weigh much.You're not going to get 150 pounds of meat out of 190 pounds of unbutchered elk quarters. About 50% is typical, which should be around 90 pounds. If some of the 90 was spoiled, bloodshot, or dirty then 73 could be reasonable.
Unless your bull had a ton of blood shot meat or something, I don't see how you could get only 73 pounds of meat. 150 would be more like it.
Post by: pianoman9701 on January 20, 2015, 12:29:47 PM
THIS GUYS ORIGINAL POST DOESNT MAKE ANY SENSE :dunno: ....HE SAID THE BULL IN QUARTERS WEIGHED 190 LBS...My 5x5 west side bull this year hung at 440lb. and I got a 59% return (260 lbs of meat back) which is pretty good. You're typically looking for 55-60% return on an animal.
WHY WOULD HIS 4 QUARTERS ONLY BE 190 LBS IN THE FIRST PLACE?
This is a good point..........
Boned out?
Post by: Curly on January 20, 2015, 12:35:16 PM
Post by: ghosthunter on January 20, 2015, 12:36:10 PM
THIS GUYS ORIGINAL POST DOESNT MAKE ANY SENSE :dunno: ....HE SAID THE BULL IN QUARTERS WEIGHED 190 LBS...My 5x5 west side bull this year hung at 440lb. and I got a 59% return (260 lbs of meat back) which is pretty good. You're typically looking for 55-60% return on an animal.
WHY WOULD HIS 4 QUARTERS ONLY BE 190 LBS IN THE FIRST PLACE?
You cannot compare East side elk with west side either. The west siders run a lot bigger in some areas.
Two big cows on east side were 170- 180 hanging on the butcher hook .
Cow I shot west side was 400 lbs on the butcher hook.
My east side spike ran 165 lbs on the butcher hook.
Just not the same thing. :twocents:
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on January 20, 2015, 12:39:53 PM
Post by: bobcat on January 20, 2015, 12:39:55 PM
Wow! A bull like that... should have got twice as much meat back as what you got. A spike bull I got a few years ago was 160 pounds of mostly boned out meat. The only bone we packed out was the shoulders, which doesn't weigh much.You're not going to get 150 pounds of meat out of 190 pounds of unbutchered elk quarters. About 50% is typical, which should be around 90 pounds. If some of the 90 was spoiled, bloodshot, or dirty then 73 could be reasonable.
Unless your bull had a ton of blood shot meat or something, I don't see how you could get only 73 pounds of meat. 150 would be more like it.
Depends what kind of quarters we're talking about. I'm pretty sure he said this was with no rib cage or backbone. I'd sure expect to get way more than 50% of the 190.
Just going by the size of the bull, it's definitely a big enough elk that I'd expect 150 pounds minimum. That's about what I got from a spike! A large mule deer can yield 73 pounds of meat, which is what he got from a relatively large bull elk!
A cow elk I got many years ago was 287 pounds of meat that we got back from the butcher, although if I remember correctly they did not completely debone the meat.
Post by: Bob33 on January 20, 2015, 12:51:03 PM
If you're getting 150 pounds of meat from 190 pounds of quarters, you're doing far better than average.Wow! A bull like that... should have got twice as much meat back as what you got. A spike bull I got a few years ago was 160 pounds of mostly boned out meat. The only bone we packed out was the shoulders, which doesn't weigh much.You're not going to get 150 pounds of meat out of 190 pounds of unbutchered elk quarters. About 50% is typical, which should be around 90 pounds. If some of the 90 was spoiled, bloodshot, or dirty then 73 could be reasonable.
Unless your bull had a ton of blood shot meat or something, I don't see how you could get only 73 pounds of meat. 150 would be more like it.
Depends what kind of quarters we're talking about. I'm pretty sure he said this was with no rib cage or backbone. I'd sure expect to get way more than 50% of the 190.
Just going by the size of the bull, it's definitely a big enough elk that I'd expect 150 pounds minimum. That's about what I got from a spike! A large mule deer can yield 73 pounds of meat, which is what he got from a relatively large bull elk!
A cow elk I got many years ago was 287 pounds of meat that we got back from the butcher, although if I remember correctly they did not completely debone the meat.
I can guarantee that you won't get 287 pounds of meat from 190 pounds of quarters. ;)
http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,168940.msg2231653.html#msg2231653 (http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,168940.msg2231653.html#msg2231653)
Post by: Nice Racks on January 20, 2015, 01:05:09 PM
Post by: Rob on January 20, 2015, 01:17:27 PM
Not sure if you got what you should have or not. some questions that might yield less than you think:
1. Did you convert any to jerky or sausage? some places do a 2lb for every one pound conversion
2. Was the meat in good condition? if it was spoiled or became spoiled shortly after you dropped it then the butcher would have disposed of it (I would have thought they would have told you though)
3. Was there dirt or hair in the meat? This might have reduced your take once processed
4. Was there extensive bloodshot meat? this would again reduce your take
5. how much bone did you bring in?
Did you weigh it when you dropped it? I took mine to Golden Steer in Bellevue and he weighed it out in front of me before I dropped it and wrote it down on a piece of paper.
Could be there was another box tucked away in the freezer he forgot to give you.
Post by: bobcat on January 20, 2015, 01:34:40 PM
:dunno:
Post by: grundy53 on January 20, 2015, 01:50:13 PM
One thing that just occurred to me- why is the butcher being blamed for no tenderloin? If the elk was quartered, and was brought in with no rib cage, the tenderloins would have been removed by the hunter. (As well as the backstrap)Unless he brought them in with the quarters.
:dunno:
Post by: bobcat on January 20, 2015, 01:52:30 PM
One thing that just occurred to me- why is the butcher being blamed for no tenderloin? If the elk was quartered, and was brought in with no rib cage, the tenderloins would have been removed by the hunter. (As well as the backstrap)Unless he brought them in with the quarters.
:dunno:
People do that? :yike:
Hint: don't ever give the tenderloins or the backstrap to a butcher! :bdid:
Post by: grundy53 on January 20, 2015, 01:56:10 PM
From the sound of it he was still in camp and took all of his meat to the butcher. I agree, I wouldn't want to leave the tenderloins unattended. Lol. I butcher my own.One thing that just occurred to me- why is the butcher being blamed for no tenderloin? If the elk was quartered, and was brought in with no rib cage, the tenderloins would have been removed by the hunter. (As well as the backstrap)Unless he brought them in with the quarters.
:dunno:
People do that? :yike:
Hint: don't ever give the tenderloins or the backstrap to a butcher!
Post by: jrebel on January 20, 2015, 01:56:43 PM
Out of 5 east side archery cow elk that our camp has harvested in recent years 4 hung at between 296 lbs and 350 lbs. We seem to net about 50% packaged meat. 190 in quarters seems light to me for such a big bodied bull. :twocents:
Post by: jnutzalot on January 20, 2015, 02:18:30 PM
One thing that just occurred to me- why is the butcher being blamed for no tenderloin? If the elk was quartered, and was brought in with no rib cage, the tenderloins would have been removed by the hunter. (As well as the backstrap)We removed the tenderloins and packed them - I obviously would not be expecting tenderloins if i left them in the body cavity...
:dunno:
Did the bull have hoof rot by any chance? :dunno:no
This is what the butcher said it weighed in at. I don't know what to tell you. My first Elk so I'm not sure what other people have encountered but it seemed about right to me.THIS GUYS ORIGINAL POST DOESNT MAKE ANY SENSE :dunno: ....HE SAID THE BULL IN QUARTERS WEIGHED 190 LBS...My 5x5 west side bull this year hung at 440lb. and I got a 59% return (260 lbs of meat back) which is pretty good. You're typically looking for 55-60% return on an animal.
WHY WOULD HIS 4 QUARTERS ONLY BE 190 LBS IN THE FIRST PLACE?
This is a good point..........
Post by: jnutzalot on January 20, 2015, 02:25:00 PM
Why has the OP updated us yet.....I am getting anxious. There are still a lot of unanswered questions. I hope he got it figured out.
Out of 5 east side archery cow elk that our camp has harvested in recent years 4 hung at between 296 lbs and 350 lbs. We seem to net about 50% packaged meat. 190 in quarters seems light to me for such a big bodied bull. :twocents:
So I'm waiting for a call back - The Manager says he is trying to get a hold of the employee that did the butchering of my elk. No real answers as to the mystery of the lost tenderloins... No real reasoning behind the weight, or why it took so long. Although some on this board seem to think that maybe 70ish lbs is about right for processed meat, so who knows at this point.
He said he noted a shot on the hind quarter while processing, which is true, but it was really low towards the knee. We cut out the blood spot and thought it looked pretty good when I took it in. Maybe it was worse than I thought.
Post by: bear hunter on January 20, 2015, 02:26:34 PM
:chuckle: I did :bash: but they were frozen in the game bag. I should of pulled them right away then cut and rapped. But they cut and rapped them for me. Thinking about it maybe 200 pounds out of 4 quarters is right.One thing that just occurred to me- why is the butcher being blamed for no tenderloin? If the elk was quartered, and was brought in with no rib cage, the tenderloins would have been removed by the hunter. (As well as the backstrap)Unless he brought them in with the quarters.
:dunno:
People do that? :yike:
Hint: don't ever give the tenderloins or the backstrap to a butcher! :bdid:
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 20, 2015, 02:31:51 PM
When did you harvest your Elk?
How long after harvesting did you get your Meat to the butcher?
Did you drop all 4 quarters and the back straps off at the butcher?
A 50% yield is what you should expect when butchering a "Whole Carcass", minus guts, hide, head, and lower legs. Your yield should be considerably higher if all you have are the quarters and back strap. Of a 190lbs of quartered meat (bone in), I would expect a return of at least 140-150lbs. IF the meat has been properly cared for.
Post by: jnutzalot on January 20, 2015, 02:38:26 PM
jnutzalot,November 7th I believe and had to butcher by the 8th. Temperatures in the high 30s low 40s. Hung for a night and morning and then went into the butcher.
When did you harvest your Elk?
How long after harvesting did you get your Meat to the butcher?
Did you drop all 4 quarters and the back straps off at the butcher?
A 50% yield is what you should expect when butchering a "Whole Carcass", minus guts, hide, head, and lower legs. Your yield should be considerably higher if all you have are the quarters and back strap. Of a 190lbs of quartered meat (bone in), I would expect a return of at least 140-150lbs. IF the meat has been properly cared for.
Yes I dropped off all 4 quarters, tenderloins, backstraps, and some misc neck and rib meat.
In retrospect I should have just held on the the backstraps and tenderloins. It's not like they are hard to carve up.
Post by: bobcat on January 20, 2015, 02:47:11 PM
If you're getting 150 pounds of meat from 190 pounds of quarters, you're doing far better than average.Wow! A bull like that... should have got twice as much meat back as what you got. A spike bull I got a few years ago was 160 pounds of mostly boned out meat. The only bone we packed out was the shoulders, which doesn't weigh much.You're not going to get 150 pounds of meat out of 190 pounds of unbutchered elk quarters. About 50% is typical, which should be around 90 pounds. If some of the 90 was spoiled, bloodshot, or dirty then 73 could be reasonable.
Unless your bull had a ton of blood shot meat or something, I don't see how you could get only 73 pounds of meat. 150 would be more like it.
Depends what kind of quarters we're talking about. I'm pretty sure he said this was with no rib cage or backbone. I'd sure expect to get way more than 50% of the 190.
Just going by the size of the bull, it's definitely a big enough elk that I'd expect 150 pounds minimum. That's about what I got from a spike! A large mule deer can yield 73 pounds of meat, which is what he got from a relatively large bull elk!
A cow elk I got many years ago was 287 pounds of meat that we got back from the butcher, although if I remember correctly they did not completely debone the meat.
I can guarantee that you won't get 287 pounds of meat from 190 pounds of quarters. ;)
http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,168940.msg2231653.html#msg2231653 (http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,168940.msg2231653.html#msg2231653)
The statistics that show a 50% yield is from a "field dressed" carcass. What we're talking about here is four quarters removed from the carcass. I asked if the 190 pounds included rib cage or backbone. He said it didn't. No way is it going to be 50% bone, 50% meat in this case. More like 75% meat and 25% bone.
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 20, 2015, 03:07:59 PM
I've never heard of it taking 3 months to get an animal back from a butcher. I've never waited more than 2 weeks. I could see how it could possibly take another week if I had smoked products or some kind of special order. Though I butcher the majority of the animals I harvest, I prefer to take Beef and Elk to my butcher. Due to lack of time and space to do it properly.
Now maybe they did have your Elk butchered within the 2 weeks after dropping it off. Due to this being there busiest time of year maybe communications got crossed or paper work got put in the wrong box or folder and they forgot to call and notify you that it was finished. Once things slowed down and there freezers started emptying out they probably started going through the boxes that were left and getting a hold of people.
They could quite possibly still have some of your meat in the freezer. They may have thought they grabbed all the boxes. Then again maybe an employee accidentally grabbed one of your boxes of meat and gave it to another customer with his order. Things like that do happen unintentionally.
Could some of your meat have been bone soured? Maybe they found an infection in one of the quarters due to an injury the animal had? They may have had some loss due to that. Ask them if they wrote down any notes to that effect.
I use to work for a Butcher. They call them Deer Processors in the south. I have cut into quite a few hams and right into fist size puss pockets full if Key Lime filling. :puke: I've also cut into shoulders that had these puss pockets. More than likely a result of a tine to the body during a fight. The outside heals before the inside does and the infection remains and builds until the body either takes care of it or it comes to the surface.
And for those of you Drama Queens, how do you know the OP didn't leave the elk hang in camp for a week before taking it in to be butchered? Or couldn't find the elk after he shot it and left it lay over night? You didn't bother to ask. You asume because someone comes on and complains they have a legitimate reason.
Ask questions before you come up with your conspiracy theories or before you start telling someone they are getting screwed. All your doing is making the OP paranoid. Instead of giving him good information that he can then use when approaching the butcher to find out what happen to him Elk Meat.
Post by: grundy53 on January 20, 2015, 03:19:41 PM
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 20, 2015, 03:34:53 PM
Most Business owners want to run a perfect Business. In reality that is impossible.
Post by: grundy53 on January 20, 2015, 03:41:27 PM
Post by: Bean Counter on January 20, 2015, 03:44:32 PM
Post by: jnutzalot on January 20, 2015, 03:55:43 PM
1) they massively underestimated how long it would take to process my elk - they said 3 weeks originally.
2) they took 2+months to process the animal. (it was not 3 months)
3) during that time they did not return my calls - I left several messages during regular business hours (no one answered the phone)
4) they did not follow my order instructions
5) they were completely missing part of my order
6) the manager had to ask me how much I brought in when I came to pick up the order because according to him the employee that weighted in my meat did not record it.
I just expect a business/owner to act professionally regardless of how busy they are. I don't think this chain of events reflects professionalism.
Post by: h20hunter on January 20, 2015, 03:59:16 PM
Now that you have reached this point have you had any feedback from the business regarding the employee that did the cutting? Have you begun to discuss how you will be compensated?
Accidents do happen, people do make mistakes. However whether it be a butcher, an outfitter, or a taxidermist, if there is no communication, an apparent disregard for order instructions, a gross delay on processing, and apparent complete disregard for honest business practices then they get what they deserve.
Post by: pianoman9701 on January 20, 2015, 04:01:03 PM
I'm trying to give the butcher the benefit of the doubt. Accidents happen, people make honest mistakes. Still, I feel this business has made several mistakes:
1) they massively underestimated how long it would take to process my elk - they said 3 weeks originally.
2) they took 2+months to process the animal. (it was not 3 months)
3) during that time they did not return my calls - I left several messages during regular business hours (no one answered the phone)
4) they did not follow my order instructions
5) they were missing completely missing part of my order
6) the manager had to ask me how much I brought in when came to pick up the order because according to him the employee that weighted in my meat did not record it.
I just expect a business/owner to act professionally regardless of how busy are. I don't think this chain of events reflects professionalism.
I would report them to the WDFW. There may even be a wastage charge applicable. It sounds ridiculous to me, the amount of time is suspect, the weight is suspect, their lack of response is suspect.
Post by: KFhunter on January 20, 2015, 04:01:05 PM
:peep:
Post by: 92xj on January 20, 2015, 04:04:30 PM
Sir.....sounds like you have been royally screwed. I'd be bent so far outta shape its not funny.
Now that you have reached this point have you had any feedback from the business regarding the employee that did the cutting? Have you begun to discuss how you will be compensated?
Accidents do happen, people do make mistakes. However whether it be a butcher, an outfitter, or a taxidermist, if there is no communication, an apparent disregard for order instructions, a gross delay on processing, and apparent complete disregard for honest business practices then they get what they deserve.
It's never their own fault.
Post by: h20hunter on January 20, 2015, 04:05:32 PM
Post by: KFhunter on January 20, 2015, 04:07:03 PM
I'm trying to give the butcher the benefit of the doubt. Accidents happen, people make honest mistakes. Still, I feel this business has made several mistakes:
1) they massively underestimated how long it would take to process my elk - they said 3 weeks originally.
2) they took 2+months to process the animal. (it was not 3 months)
3) during that time they did not return my calls - I left several messages during regular business hours (no one answered the phone)
4) they did not follow my order instructions
5) they were missing completely missing part of my order
6) the manager had to ask me how much I brought in when came to pick up the order because according to him the employee that weighted in my meat did not record it.
I just expect a business/owner to act professionally regardless of how busy are. I don't think this chain of events reflects professionalism.
I would report them to the WDFW. There may even be a wastage charge applicable. It sounds ridiculous to me, the amount of time is suspect, the weight is suspect, their lack of response is suspect.
I would even suggest they send in an undercover warden to buy elk meat out the back door. Well, maybe when Cenci is gone that is.
Post by: 92xj on January 20, 2015, 04:09:38 PM
Roger that!
To be clear I was referencing businesses in general not the OP.
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 20, 2015, 04:34:21 PM
Interesting how much heavier the northern deer are. I didn't weigh the ones I took up there BITD. Down where I live in the southwest with hotter climates they must be much smaller bodied deer overall. I process them all myself and am usually doing good to put 40pounds of packages of meat in the freezer.
Does in GA on Average were 100-130 on the hoof, the heaviest I weighed was 180ish lbs. Bucks on average went 140-175. Mature Bucks that came in 6 years or older went roughly 175-225lbs. The heaviest buck I weighted went close to 300lbs.
Post by: _TONY_ on January 20, 2015, 05:21:46 PM
Then again things happen and people get busy and forget. It gets really busy for butchers that time of year. Things get overlooked or forgotten once in a while.
I think once they are done with the wrapping, since he ordered no special products, it would have been really simple to call and say " hey your order is ready for pickup"... I can't see how they didn't notice a box of wrapped meat sitting there DONE for like two months... :twocents:
Post by: Band on January 20, 2015, 05:41:26 PM
Had the customer reported getting his meat back in a reasonable amount of time and simply complained about the lack of final product compared to what he brought in, I would not have wanted the business called out. Simply because, as you suggest, we are only getting one side of the story and the meat very well could have been brought in with a lot of dirt, hair, or spoilage. However, when the customer reports his order taking 3 months to be complete that is an enormous red flag that cannot be overlooked. No above board butcher on the face of the earth will take 3 months to process a game animal and that tells me there is funny business going on at the processor.No question about it, this meat processor needs to be called out and raked over the coals! :bash:
There IS a question about it, Band. Witch hunts don't flatter our reputation as a forum community. :twocents:
There are two sides to most stories and the butcher deserves his day in "court" if we are going to run yet another a kangaroo court. Namely, its entirely possible that the severe meat shortage is explained by sloppy field care. IDK whether that's the case but having killed a few critters in my day I can see how a few sloppy habits can cause significant spoilage or waste.
Its entirely to unfair to a butcher to drag him over the coals if he was handed 100 pounds of boned out meat and 50% of it was filthy and expect that 100 pounds be delivered. I sure wouldn't go into business to put up with that.
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 20, 2015, 06:17:43 PM
Then again things happen and people get busy and forget. It gets really busy for butchers that time of year. Things get overlooked or forgotten once in a while.
I think once they are done with the wrapping, since he ordered no special products, it would have been really simple to call and say " hey your order is ready for pickup"... I can't see how they didn't notice a box of wrapped meat sitting there DONE for like two months... :twocents:
Have you ever worked for or been into a Butchers Shop? In the back where the work is done, meat is hung, and butchered meat is stored?
There isn't just 1 box sitting around with one persons animal in it. One Whole average size Elk with no special requests (sausage, peperstix, etc) should fill 3-5 Boxes depending on the size of the Box and the size of the Elk.
I worked 4 seasons (3months each) for a Butcher / Game Processor. We typically had at least 1-3 people out back skinning and gutting deer and getting them hung up in the coolers, 2-5 people cutting and wrapping, making sausage and doing other special orders, and 1 dedicated person making phone calls and doing paper work. Not including the Owner. People moved around and helped where they were needed.
During the busiest part of the season, which lasted about 6-8 weeks. During the week days we brought in 10-40 deer a day. On Saturday and Sunday between 80-200 deer each weekend. We had 2-300 Deer in the cooler waiting to be processed. That's not including Wild Pigs, the occasional farm Pigs, Beef, etc.
I can't remember exactly what the count was at the end of the season but I believe it was around 3000-3,500 Deer Processed in a 3-4 month period. The majority of Deer fit in 1-2 Boxes, occasionally a 3rd box was required. I don't remember how large the freezer was that the boxes of meat were kept but I know there were easily 200-300 boxes of meat in there for around 6-8 weeks during the busiest time of season. They tried to keep orders together as much as possible and organized.
Do you honestly think a Business with multiple employees, over half being seasonal, can run a perfectly flawless business?
Every year they handled the exact same complaints. "We should have more meat than this", "our order was cut wrong", etc.
Post by: grundy53 on January 20, 2015, 06:26:26 PM
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 20, 2015, 06:29:14 PM
Had the customer reported getting his meat back in a reasonable amount of time and simply complained about the lack of final product compared to what he brought in, I would not have wanted the business called out. Simply because, as you suggest, we are only getting one side of the story and the meat very well could have been brought in with a lot of dirt, hair, or spoilage. However, when the customer reports his order taking 3 months to be complete that is an enormous red flag that cannot be overlooked. No above board butcher on the face of the earth will take 3 months to process a game animal and that tells me there is funny business going on at the processor.No question about it, this meat processor needs to be called out and raked over the coals! :bash:
There IS a question about it, Band. Witch hunts don't flatter our reputation as a forum community. :twocents:
There are two sides to most stories and the butcher deserves his day in "court" if we are going to run yet another a kangaroo court. Namely, its entirely possible that the severe meat shortage is explained by sloppy field care. IDK whether that's the case but having killed a few critters in my day I can see how a few sloppy habits can cause significant spoilage or waste.
Its entirely to unfair to a butcher to drag him over the coals if he was handed 100 pounds of boned out meat and 50% of it was filthy and expect that 100 pounds be delivered. I sure wouldn't go into business to put up with that.
No butcher is going to leave an Elk hanging in the Cooler for 2.5 months before cutting and wrapping. The Elk would be way beyond a little funk after that amount of time.
How do we know the Elk wasn't butchered within 2 weeks after being brought in and they couldn't get a hold of the customer for pick up?
Maybe one of the numbers in his phone number looked to much like another due to bad hand writing and they called and left messages on someone else machine? Until someone figured it out.
Or after it was cut up the person responsible for making calls simply picked up 2 call sheets instead of 1 when going to the next person to call skipping over the OP by accident?
Someone may have just simply thought they or someone else had made the call?
If damaged meat had to be removed and discarded due to bone sour, injury, infection, poor field care, etc. . . . Could be part of the reason he got more burger that steak and the pounds he got back? Depends on how much they had to remove in how many different places or had to discard a full quarter.
There are a lot of things that could be going on here.
Post by: grundy53 on January 20, 2015, 06:30:58 PM
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 20, 2015, 06:31:12 PM
Luckily for the butchers up here the bag limits are a lot less generous and demand is a lot less over all.
Yeah, but they have more Beef, Pork, Lamb, and game coming in from out of state, on top of what is brought in from local hunters.
Down there Deer Processors are open for roughly 4 months a year. Then closed for 8.
Post by: KFhunter on January 20, 2015, 06:38:22 PM
Yep, lot's of excuses...
All of which should have been addressed at the drop off, any butcher is going to immediately see problems with the animal and let the hunter know what's up.
Anything else that wasn't noted at drop off should have triggered a phone call.
Post by: Bean Counter on January 20, 2015, 06:42:35 PM
Had the customer reported getting his meat back in a reasonable amount of time and simply complained about the lack of final product compared to what he brought in, I would not have wanted the business called out. Simply because, as you suggest, we are only getting one side of the story and the meat very well could have been brought in with a lot of dirt, hair, or spoilage. However, when the customer reports his order taking 3 months to be complete that is an enormous red flag that cannot be overlooked. No above board butcher on the face of the earth will take 3 months to process a game animal and that tells me there is funny business going on at the processor.No question about it, this meat processor needs to be called out and raked over the coals! :bash:
There IS a question about it, Band. Witch hunts don't flatter our reputation as a forum community. :twocents:
There are two sides to most stories and the butcher deserves his day in "court" if we are going to run yet another a kangaroo court. Namely, its entirely possible that the severe meat shortage is explained by sloppy field care. IDK whether that's the case but having killed a few critters in my day I can see how a few sloppy habits can cause significant spoilage or waste.
Its entirely to unfair to a butcher to drag him over the coals if he was handed 100 pounds of boned out meat and 50% of it was filthy and expect that 100 pounds be delivered. I sure wouldn't go into business to put up with that.
Michelle pointed out lots of possibilities that are feasible. We just don't know. If you're comfortable lighting the torches after hearing only one side of the story then I have a white hoodie for you. I've learned the hard way one too many times that its best to get both sides of a story. I've grown tired of the taste of my own boot. :twocents:
Post by: Bullkllr on January 20, 2015, 06:45:35 PM
Remember the last guy vs butcher thread?
..."oh, well I really didn't have anything to complain about, so it's all good now"...after several pages of rants?
Post by: KFhunter on January 20, 2015, 06:46:44 PM
3.5 months later to get 75 lbs back and some of that cut in beef.......you could run it over with a semi truck and still pull 75lbs of meat off the carcass.
Post by: Becky on January 20, 2015, 06:49:04 PM
Post by: Charlie on January 20, 2015, 06:53:12 PM
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 20, 2015, 06:53:51 PM
(Not directed at you KFhunter) People keep talking about professionalism as a business. People should think about there comments before posting and show a little bit of it in return. Especially when there are a LOT of unanswered questions.
Post by: grundy53 on January 20, 2015, 06:58:19 PM
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 20, 2015, 07:22:00 PM
Accountability is apparently a dying trait...
We have one side of the story, the OP's. We have not yet heard from the butcher yet. How is your comment relevant? Other than just needing something to say?
Post by: grundy53 on January 20, 2015, 07:26:35 PM
You keep making lists of excuses for said butcher. Most if not all of which should have garnered an immediate call to the OP.Accountability is apparently a dying trait...
We have one side of the story, the OP's. We have not yet heard from the butcher yet. How is your comment relevant? Other than just needing something to say?
Post by: bobcat on January 20, 2015, 07:28:14 PM
Post by: grundy53 on January 20, 2015, 07:33:38 PM
To be a little more to the point. My comment wasn't even really directed to this butcher specifically. More so towards your long list of excuses. If someone is going to run a business they should take responsibility for their mistakes.Accountability is apparently a dying trait...
We have one side of the story, the OP's. We have not yet heard from the butcher yet. How is your comment relevant? Other than just needing something to say?
Post by: h20hunter on January 20, 2015, 07:34:43 PM
Post by: dscubame on January 20, 2015, 07:34:55 PM
To be a little more to the point. My comment wasn't even really directed to this butcher specifically. More so towards your long list of excuses. If someone is going to run a business they should take responsibility for their mistakes.Accountability is apparently a dying trait...
We have one side of the story, the OP's. We have not yet heard from the butcher yet. How is your comment relevant? Other than just needing something to say?
:tup: for shizzle
Post by: KFhunter on January 20, 2015, 07:47:56 PM
KFhunter, that's the problem. Your assuming and so is everyone else since we only have one side of the story.
(Not directed at you KFhunter) People keep talking about professionalism as a business. People should think about there comments before posting and show a little bit of it in return. Especially when there are a LOT of unanswered questions.
I understand your sensitivity to this issue Michelle, but all we have to go on is the OP's story and I'm having difficulty finding fault in his telling of events. It's very plausible that he did indeed get taken advantage of by not really knowing the weight of the animal being dropped off, nor really knowing how much he should receive back in return. I applaud his courage in letting other HW members share in his story. I think perhaps next year a few more successful hunters will be a little more cautious in dropping off there game animals and doing some additional research, hopefully taking advantage of that thread Bearpaw made.
It's also in my experience that a person fabricating a story about a business usually gets ousted if/when things don't add up. Enough negative reviews all happen to the same business owner then perhaps that needs to be known. It's not a conspiracy, it's just multiple reviews all showing the same flaws in a service.
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 20, 2015, 07:48:28 PM
You keep making lists of excuses for said butcher. Most if not all of which should have garnered an immediate call to the OP.Accountability is apparently a dying trait...
We have one side of the story, the OP's. We have not yet heard from the butcher yet. How is your comment relevant? Other than just needing something to say?
It was not a list of excuses. Apparently you were not reading what I wrote. Which is pretty apparent from some of your other comments. It must be the ADD.
If you would have been paying attention, it is called playing devils advocate.
Like I said before multiple times. We only have one side of the story, the OP's side. I never said I thought he was lying or giving us a story or that he wasn't telling us the truth. The fact remains we still only have 1 side of the story. I tend, not to jump to conclusions based on one side.
Considering I have 4 years of experience working in a butcher shop. I know what can, does, and what could happen.
Post by: grundy53 on January 20, 2015, 07:56:48 PM
You're right. Must be my ADD... :chuckle:You keep making lists of excuses for said butcher. Most if not all of which should have garnered an immediate call to the OP.Accountability is apparently a dying trait...
We have one side of the story, the OP's. We have not yet heard from the butcher yet. How is your comment relevant? Other than just needing something to say?
It was not a list of excuses. Apparently you were not reading what I wrote. Which is pretty apparent from some of your other comments. It must be the ADD.
If you would have been paying attention, it is called playing devils advocate.
Like I said before multiple times. We only have one side of the story, the OP's side. I never said I thought he was lying or giving us a story or that he wasn't telling us the truth. The fact remains we still only have 1 side of the story. I tend, not to jump to conclusions based on one side.
Considering I have 4 years of experience working in a butcher shop. I know what can, does, and what could happen.
Post by: _TONY_ on January 20, 2015, 07:59:44 PM
Then again things happen and people get busy and forget. It gets really busy for butchers that time of year. Things get overlooked or forgotten once in a while.
I think once they are done with the wrapping, since he ordered no special products, it would have been really simple to call and say " hey your order is ready for pickup"... I can't see how they didn't notice a box of wrapped meat sitting there DONE for like two months... :twocents:
Have you ever worked for or been into a Butchers Shop? In the back where the work is done, meat is hung, and butchered meat is stored?
There isn't just 1 box sitting around with one persons animal in it. One Whole average size Elk with no special requests (sausage, peperstix, etc) should fill 3-5 Boxes depending on the size of the Box and the size of the Elk.
I worked 4 seasons (3months each) for a Butcher / Game Processor. We typically had at least 1-3 people out back skinning and gutting deer and getting them hung up in the coolers, 2-5 people cutting and wrapping, making sausage and doing other special orders, and 1 dedicated person making phone calls and doing paper work. Not including the Owner. People moved around and helped where they were needed.
During the busiest part of the season, which lasted about 6-8 weeks. During the week days we brought in 10-40 deer a day. On Saturday and Sunday between 80-200 deer each weekend. We had 2-300 Deer in the cooler waiting to be processed. That's not including Wild Pigs, the occasional farm Pigs, Beef, etc.
I can't remember exactly what the count was at the end of the season but I believe it was around 3000-3,500 Deer Processed in a 3-4 month period. The majority of Deer fit in 1-2 Boxes, occasionally a 3rd box was required. I don't remember how large the freezer was that the boxes of meat were kept but I know there were easily 200-300 boxes of meat in there for around 6-8 weeks during the busiest time of season. They tried to keep orders together as much as possible and organized.
Do you honestly think a Business with multiple employees, over half being seasonal, can run a perfectly flawless business?
Every year they handled the exact same complaints. "We should have more meat than this", "our order was cut wrong", etc.
Well, then it should have been even harder not to notice 3-5 boxes sitting there... Right?
Post by: pilebuck on January 20, 2015, 08:01:38 PM
Post by: Becky on January 20, 2015, 08:08:43 PM
Post by: Hunterman on January 20, 2015, 08:12:55 PM
This isn't a taxidermy review thread, it's about a questionable butcher and what the OP should do. Lets get back on topic and wait for that phone call back, shall we?
:yeah: Good call Smossy's Girl..Now take the taxi smashing to the taxi thread.
Hunterman(Tony)
Post by: jnutzalot on January 20, 2015, 08:14:11 PM
I thawed out the backstraps today, they smell like a garbage can, like rancid meat. I gagged just smelling them, pretty sure I would get sick if I ate any of the steak. The straps were in perfect shape when we had them for dinner the night I brought the Elk into the shop, they smelt sweet, and tasted like lean beef before sitting in his shop for 2 months.
On the upside the burger does taste good, and smells proper. Although I'm figuring it's cut with a great deal of beef, it dosesn't look that rich red that elk burger has, here's a pic....
Post by: h20hunter on January 20, 2015, 08:16:16 PM
Post by: Hunterman on January 20, 2015, 08:20:23 PM
Hunterman(Tony)
Post by: KFhunter on January 20, 2015, 08:21:29 PM
Hows that beef taste? Dude you got screwed.
Hunterman(Tony)
Looks like store bought beef...
I've NEVER had brown game meat - ever! :puke:
Never had brown beef either until the last few years suffering buying some burger out the grocery chains.
Post by: csaaphill on January 20, 2015, 08:49:49 PM
Post by: ridgefire on January 20, 2015, 08:56:59 PM
Post by: jnutzalot on January 20, 2015, 09:03:34 PM
Been reading about bad butcher care a lot these days. Do these people know they corner the market so they don't care anymore or what? Hope if asked your Pming people who this guy is so they don't have that same mistake in the future. hate that since htis is a dying breed and art cutting and and wrapping, and butchering game meat people think they can just mess with people like this. This sucks. >:(I'm going to give it another day...If the shop doesn't make it right I'll let everyone know who it is.
Post by: Jason on January 20, 2015, 09:10:02 PM
Jnutzalot hopefully you get the rest of your meat back!
Post by: pilebuck on January 20, 2015, 09:14:02 PM
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 20, 2015, 09:17:14 PM
Been reading about bad butcher care a lot these days. Do these people know they corner the market so they don't care anymore or what? Hope if asked your Pming people who this guy is so they don't have that same mistake in the future. hate that since htis is a dying breed and art cutting and and wrapping, and butchering game meat people think they can just mess with people like this. This sucks. >:(
I don't see how Butchers have a corner on the market?
There are several good butchers out there. The one I use I have never had issue with. I have not heard any bad reviews from the people I have sent to him.
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on January 20, 2015, 09:18:01 PM
Been reading about bad butcher care a lot these days. Do these people know they corner the market so they don't care anymore or what? Hope if asked your Pming people who this guy is so they don't have that same mistake in the future. hate that since htis is a dying breed and art cutting and and wrapping, and butchering game meat people think they can just mess with people like this. This sucks. >:(I'm going to give it another day...If the shop doesn't make it right I'll let everyone know who it is.
That seems pretty fair since you have contacted the butcher......
Post by: bobcat on January 20, 2015, 09:20:58 PM
Not only that but hunting season can only keep them busy for a couple months out of the year.
Post by: KFhunter on January 20, 2015, 09:24:19 PM
It's hard to find a butcher that wants to work on game animals. Most nowadays only want to do domestic livestock, as that apparently is where the money is. Can't say I blame them. Deer and elk get brought in dirty, half rotten, and full of bullet holes. When they're done trimming the bad meat off and cleaning what's salvageable, there's not much left to wrap and the customers are likely to complain about how little meat they got back.
Not only that but hunting season can only keep them busy for a couple months out of the year.
:yeah:
not to mention all the sanitary hoops the state recently imposed on butcher shops going from domestic to game and back, a lot of them said heck with it we don't do game meat anymore.
Post by: pilebuck on January 20, 2015, 09:27:33 PM
Post by: kisfish on January 20, 2015, 09:28:42 PM
Cut more than my fair share of pure garbage brought in by hunters.
Post by: Hawgdawg on January 20, 2015, 09:31:55 PM
It's hard to find a butcher that wants to work on game animals. Most nowadays only want to do domestic livestock, as that apparently is where the money is. Can't say I blame them. Deer and elk get brought in dirty, half rotten, and full of bullet holes. When they're done trimming the bad meat off and cleaning what's salvageable, there's not much left to wrap and the customers are likely to complain about how little meat they got back.
Not only that but hunting season can only keep them busy for a couple months out of the year.
:yeah: just cut up this cow for a neighbor friend. Big fat Enumclaw girl. Got all the steaks and roasts out of her and still got 165lbs of burger after adding 15lbs of beef fat. Not a hair on it and no ribs were hit. Nice hauling them out in the tractor. Clean and mean and not blood shot.
Post by: Hawgdawg on January 20, 2015, 09:34:15 PM
Here is the pic I meant to post.
Post by: pilebuck on January 20, 2015, 09:35:59 PM
Post by: JackOfAllTrades on January 20, 2015, 09:39:45 PM
Small Claims Court!
Post the butcher's name so other people don't get ripped off!
-Steve
Post by: kisfish on January 20, 2015, 09:40:12 PM
Post by: stevemiller on January 20, 2015, 09:43:58 PM
Not sure this is in an outmagazine,maybe they are lying :dunno:. All the math adds up.I agree you should get 55% of on the hoof in your meat.If the rib cage and back bone are gone so is that 55% figure should be more like 70%-75%.Bye the way an average bull elk is a 5x5.Just found this in Long Range hunting magazine.
Average elk bull weighs 474 pounds
Hanging weight skinned no head no legs 337 pounds
total meat yield 242
steak and roast 77
burger 165.
I'm sorry for the OP, however, I'm not sure I believe 200+ pounds out of an elk. :dunno: The last elk I weighed my meat, self processed archery killl, no bloodshot meat, was about 110 pounds. This was a 5 point Margaret bull, unless I am thinking of the cow I shot a few years later. I'm pretty sure it was the bull though and I did not save rib meat, birds need to eat too. ** OK, maybe it was the cow, young one. **
I do know that my moose was 500+ pounds of meat (untrimmed, no bones) brought to the butcher, and I find it hard to believe that more than a small percentage of elk would come close to half that, and cleaned up meat no less. ** Still hold be this.**
Post by: KFhunter on January 20, 2015, 09:44:03 PM
I wouldn't wait more than a few weeks to get my meat back. No matter what animal! There would be no second phone call. I'd be at his door and the butcher would have some esplainin to do and provide my animal meat pronto! Months? you've got to be kidding me! That's like waiting years for Taxidermy!
Small Claims Court!
Post the butcher's name so other people don't get ripped off!
-Steve
one more phone call and a day later isn't going to hurt, no one's bringing in game meat now anyways.
Post by: csaaphill on January 20, 2015, 10:11:38 PM
Didn't say there aren't good ones, but I have been reading on different forumns how they got screwed on Elk, and other game meats. They do kind of corner it nowdays for it is a dying business. Theres only one or two near us, and only one that will take game meat, the other wont even touch it. The one I liked he died and went out of business his son klled himself so ya aint no one to take his business anymore. he actually only did it for us because he knew us, but he'd quit doing game meat years before. So yes they do! Seems like I see at least one, or two on here every year. The other forum I've been going to just had one where he was missing meat, and just like this was more likely not his elk he'd braught in. Meaning he the butcher mixed his meat with others etc...Been reading about bad butcher care a lot these days. Do these people know they corner the market so they don't care anymore or what? Hope if asked your Pming people who this guy is so they don't have that same mistake in the future. hate that since htis is a dying breed and art cutting and and wrapping, and butchering game meat people think they can just mess with people like this. This sucks. >:(
I don't see how Butchers have a corner on the market?
There are several good butchers out there. The one I use I have never had issue with. I have not heard any bad reviews from the people I have sent to him.
So yes it's a dying bread much like Taxidermists not a lot of call for them as it used to be, or ferriers (people that show horses) Not a huge demand for them either only in selective markets. Obviously on the Wet side and over there there may be a few more than here, but most here will only do cow and pig and rarlely sheep, they don't even touch game meat anymore. If I dont use the guy down the street from me I'd have to drive well over 50-60 miles out of my way to get one that actually does game meat.
Post by: csaaphill on January 20, 2015, 10:14:49 PM
Some people r a joke this post is worthless with all the negative comments :tup:How else should we comment? >:( Huh? Hurray! he got screwed? Huh? OR dont blame butchers they got it hard?
Seems were commenting appropriatly for the post at least were not making comments on when old navy opens or something. :chuckle: :stirthepot: :-X
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 20, 2015, 10:23:29 PM
Didn't say there aren't good ones, but I have been reading on different forumns how they got screwed on Elk, and other game meats. They do kind of corner it nowdays for it is a dying business. Theres only one or two near us, and only one that will take game meat, the other wont even touch it. The on I liked he died and went out of business his son klled himself so ya aint no one to take his business anymore. he actually only did it for us because he knew us, but he'd quit doing game meat years before. So yes they do! Seems like I see at least one, or two on here every year. The other forum I've been going to just had one where he was missing meat, and just like this was more likely not his elk he'd braught in. Meaning he the butcher mixed his meat with others etc...Been reading about bad butcher care a lot these days. Do these people know they corner the market so they don't care anymore or what? Hope if asked your Pming people who this guy is so they don't have that same mistake in the future. hate that since htis is a dying breed and art cutting and and wrapping, and butchering game meat people think they can just mess with people like this. This sucks. >:(
I don't see how Butchers have a corner on the market?
There are several good butchers out there. The one I use I have never had issue with. I have not heard any bad reviews from the people I have sent to him.
So yes it's a dying bread much like Taxidermists not a lot of call for them as it used to be, or ferriers (people that show horses) Not a huge demand for them either only in selective markets. Obviously on the Wet side and over there there may be a few more than here, but most here will only do cow and pig and rarlely sheep, htey don't even touch game meat anymore. If I dont use the guy down the street from me I'd have to drive well over 50-60 miles out of my way to get one that actually does game meat.
There are quite a few Butchers around me. Just off the top of my head I can think of Stewarts, Heritage, Western, Beef Shop, Littlerock, and a few I can't think of the names of but are fairly local. That the slaughter trucks will deliver to from my location. Not as many people raising and slaughtering beef for themselves since you can buy it in the store.
There are actually more Licensed Taxidermists today then there was 20 years ago. Now a days anyone with a computer and access to YouTube can watch a few videos, thrown a set of eyes and a skin on a manikin and call themselves a Taxidermist.
Post by: csaaphill on January 20, 2015, 10:35:01 PM
Where? none around me taxidermists I mean. Only Taxidermist I know of other than heading to Seattle or that sides is like 170 miles away. That doesn't mean their taxidermists it just means they take the time to utilise the internet. Heck there are a few on here that advertise, and heck theres enough information on here that one can get if they search this site hard enough they can do their own too, that's not the point. thepoint is other than youtube and other such sites there are not a lot of Taxidermists around any more. Maybe in your neck of the woods but not near me. there used to be one close by but he closed. So now If I want taxidermist done and not wanting to troll youtube for hours i'd have to drive 170 miles at least.Didn't say there aren't good ones, but I have been reading on different forumns how they got screwed on Elk, and other game meats. They do kind of corner it nowdays for it is a dying business. Theres only one or two near us, and only one that will take game meat, the other wont even touch it. The on I liked he died and went out of business his son klled himself so ya aint no one to take his business anymore. he actually only did it for us because he knew us, but he'd quit doing game meat years before. So yes they do! Seems like I see at least one, or two on here every year. The other forum I've been going to just had one where he was missing meat, and just like this was more likely not his elk he'd braught in. Meaning he the butcher mixed his meat with others etc...Been reading about bad butcher care a lot these days. Do these people know they corner the market so they don't care anymore or what? Hope if asked your Pming people who this guy is so they don't have that same mistake in the future. hate that since htis is a dying breed and art cutting and and wrapping, and butchering game meat people think they can just mess with people like this. This sucks. >:(
I don't see how Butchers have a corner on the market?
There are several good butchers out there. The one I use I have never had issue with. I have not heard any bad reviews from the people I have sent to him.
So yes it's a dying bread much like Taxidermists not a lot of call for them as it used to be, or ferriers (people that show horses) Not a huge demand for them either only in selective markets. Obviously on the Wet side and over there there may be a few more than here, but most here will only do cow and pig and rarlely sheep, htey don't even touch game meat anymore. If I dont use the guy down the street from me I'd have to drive well over 50-60 miles out of my way to get one that actually does game meat.
There are quite a few Butchers around me. Just off the top of my head I can think of Stewarts, Heritage, Western, Beef Shop, Littlerock, and a few I can't think of the names of but are fairly local. That the slaughter trucks will deliver to from my location. Not as many people raising and slaughtering beef for themselves since you can buy it in the store.
There are actually more Licensed Taxidermists today then there was 20 years ago. Now a days anyone with a computer and access to YouTube can watch a few videos, thrown a set of eyes and a skin on a manikin and call themselves a Taxidermist.
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 20, 2015, 10:44:02 PM
Where? none around me taxidermists I mean. Only Taxidermist I know of other than heading to Seattle or that sides is like 170 miles away. That doesn't mean their taxidermists it just means they take the time to utilise the internet. Heck there are a few on here that advertise, and heck theres enough information on here that one can get if they search this site hard enough they can do their own too, that's not the point. thepoint is other than youtube and other such sites there are not a lot of Taxidermists around any more. Maybe in your neck of the woods but not near me. there used to be one close by but he closed. So now If I want taxidermist done and not wanting to troll youtube for hours i'd have to drive 170 miles at least.Didn't say there aren't good ones, but I have been reading on different forumns how they got screwed on Elk, and other game meats. They do kind of corner it nowdays for it is a dying business. Theres only one or two near us, and only one that will take game meat, the other wont even touch it. The on I liked he died and went out of business his son klled himself so ya aint no one to take his business anymore. he actually only did it for us because he knew us, but he'd quit doing game meat years before. So yes they do! Seems like I see at least one, or two on here every year. The other forum I've been going to just had one where he was missing meat, and just like this was more likely not his elk he'd braught in. Meaning he the butcher mixed his meat with others etc...Been reading about bad butcher care a lot these days. Do these people know they corner the market so they don't care anymore or what? Hope if asked your Pming people who this guy is so they don't have that same mistake in the future. hate that since htis is a dying breed and art cutting and and wrapping, and butchering game meat people think they can just mess with people like this. This sucks. >:(
I don't see how Butchers have a corner on the market?
There are several good butchers out there. The one I use I have never had issue with. I have not heard any bad reviews from the people I have sent to him.
So yes it's a dying bread much like Taxidermists not a lot of call for them as it used to be, or ferriers (people that show horses) Not a huge demand for them either only in selective markets. Obviously on the Wet side and over there there may be a few more than here, but most here will only do cow and pig and rarlely sheep, htey don't even touch game meat anymore. If I dont use the guy down the street from me I'd have to drive well over 50-60 miles out of my way to get one that actually does game meat.
There are quite a few Butchers around me. Just off the top of my head I can think of Stewarts, Heritage, Western, Beef Shop, Littlerock, and a few I can't think of the names of but are fairly local. That the slaughter trucks will deliver to from my location. Not as many people raising and slaughtering beef for themselves since you can buy it in the store.
There are actually more Licensed Taxidermists today then there was 20 years ago. Now a days anyone with a computer and access to YouTube can watch a few videos, thrown a set of eyes and a skin on a manikin and call themselves a Taxidermist.
Your area may not support a Full time Taxidermist. But I guarantee you there are more taxidermists today by far then there was 20 years ago. I have a lot of friends in the business in many states some have been doing this 4x longer than I have and they will say the same thing. We get into this discussion a couple times a year.
Post by: csaaphill on January 21, 2015, 12:54:29 AM
not to keep arguing but I highly dobt it. I was watching a show hunting show on the outdoor chanel and they were stating that taxidermy is a dying art.Where? none around me taxidermists I mean. Only Taxidermist I know of other than heading to Seattle or that sides is like 170 miles away. That doesn't mean their taxidermists it just means they take the time to utilise the internet. Heck there are a few on here that advertise, and heck theres enough information on here that one can get if they search this site hard enough they can do their own too, that's not the point. thepoint is other than youtube and other such sites there are not a lot of Taxidermists around any more. Maybe in your neck of the woods but not near me. there used to be one close by but he closed. So now If I want taxidermist done and not wanting to troll youtube for hours i'd have to drive 170 miles at least.Didn't say there aren't good ones, but I have been reading on different forumns how they got screwed on Elk, and other game meats. They do kind of corner it nowdays for it is a dying business. Theres only one or two near us, and only one that will take game meat, the other wont even touch it. The on I liked he died and went out of business his son klled himself so ya aint no one to take his business anymore. he actually only did it for us because he knew us, but he'd quit doing game meat years before. So yes they do! Seems like I see at least one, or two on here every year. The other forum I've been going to just had one where he was missing meat, and just like this was more likely not his elk he'd braught in. Meaning he the butcher mixed his meat with others etc...Been reading about bad butcher care a lot these days. Do these people know they corner the market so they don't care anymore or what? Hope if asked your Pming people who this guy is so they don't have that same mistake in the future. hate that since htis is a dying breed and art cutting and and wrapping, and butchering game meat people think they can just mess with people like this. This sucks. >:(
I don't see how Butchers have a corner on the market?
There are several good butchers out there. The one I use I have never had issue with. I have not heard any bad reviews from the people I have sent to him.
So yes it's a dying bread much like Taxidermists not a lot of call for them as it used to be, or ferriers (people that show horses) Not a huge demand for them either only in selective markets. Obviously on the Wet side and over there there may be a few more than here, but most here will only do cow and pig and rarlely sheep, htey don't even touch game meat anymore. If I dont use the guy down the street from me I'd have to drive well over 50-60 miles out of my way to get one that actually does game meat.
There are quite a few Butchers around me. Just off the top of my head I can think of Stewarts, Heritage, Western, Beef Shop, Littlerock, and a few I can't think of the names of but are fairly local. That the slaughter trucks will deliver to from my location. Not as many people raising and slaughtering beef for themselves since you can buy it in the store.
There are actually more Licensed Taxidermists today then there was 20 years ago. Now a days anyone with a computer and access to YouTube can watch a few videos, thrown a set of eyes and a skin on a manikin and call themselves a Taxidermist.
Your area may not support a Full time Taxidermist. But I guarantee you there are more taxidermists today by far then there was 20 years ago. I have a lot of friends in the business in many states some have been doing this 4x longer than I have and they will say the same thing. We get into this discussion a couple times a year.
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 21, 2015, 04:47:58 AM
not to keep arguing but I highly dobt it. I was watching a show hunting show on the outdoor chanel and they were stating that taxidermy is a dying art.Where? none around me taxidermists I mean. Only Taxidermist I know of other than heading to Seattle or that sides is like 170 miles away. That doesn't mean their taxidermists it just means they take the time to utilise the internet. Heck there are a few on here that advertise, and heck theres enough information on here that one can get if they search this site hard enough they can do their own too, that's not the point. thepoint is other than youtube and other such sites there are not a lot of Taxidermists around any more. Maybe in your neck of the woods but not near me. there used to be one close by but he closed. So now If I want taxidermist done and not wanting to troll youtube for hours i'd have to drive 170 miles at least.Didn't say there aren't good ones, but I have been reading on different forumns how they got screwed on Elk, and other game meats. They do kind of corner it nowdays for it is a dying business. Theres only one or two near us, and only one that will take game meat, the other wont even touch it. The on I liked he died and went out of business his son klled himself so ya aint no one to take his business anymore. he actually only did it for us because he knew us, but he'd quit doing game meat years before. So yes they do! Seems like I see at least one, or two on here every year. The other forum I've been going to just had one where he was missing meat, and just like this was more likely not his elk he'd braught in. Meaning he the butcher mixed his meat with others etc...Been reading about bad butcher care a lot these days. Do these people know they corner the market so they don't care anymore or what? Hope if asked your Pming people who this guy is so they don't have that same mistake in the future. hate that since htis is a dying breed and art cutting and and wrapping, and butchering game meat people think they can just mess with people like this. This sucks. >:(
I don't see how Butchers have a corner on the market?
There are several good butchers out there. The one I use I have never had issue with. I have not heard any bad reviews from the people I have sent to him.
So yes it's a dying bread much like Taxidermists not a lot of call for them as it used to be, or ferriers (people that show horses) Not a huge demand for them either only in selective markets. Obviously on the Wet side and over there there may be a few more than here, but most here will only do cow and pig and rarlely sheep, htey don't even touch game meat anymore. If I dont use the guy down the street from me I'd have to drive well over 50-60 miles out of my way to get one that actually does game meat.
There are quite a few Butchers around me. Just off the top of my head I can think of Stewarts, Heritage, Western, Beef Shop, Littlerock, and a few I can't think of the names of but are fairly local. That the slaughter trucks will deliver to from my location. Not as many people raising and slaughtering beef for themselves since you can buy it in the store.
There are actually more Licensed Taxidermists today then there was 20 years ago. Now a days anyone with a computer and access to YouTube can watch a few videos, thrown a set of eyes and a skin on a manikin and call themselves a Taxidermist.
Your area may not support a Full time Taxidermist. But I guarantee you there are more taxidermists today by far then there was 20 years ago. I have a lot of friends in the business in many states some have been doing this 4x longer than I have and they will say the same thing. We get into this discussion a couple times a year.
Please don't tell me you believe everything you hear on TV.
The reason they say Taxidermy is a dying art is because the market has become so advanced that pretty much anyone that gets ahold of a few taxidermy videos or you-tube videos can put a pair of eyes on a form with a cape and they call themselves a Taxidermist. Taxidermy Suppliers have come up with detailed inner noses, jawsets, pre made earliners, preset eyes already installed in forms, etc. It makes it easy for people to get started.
It's when you get into doing Life Size, African, and Specialty poses where there are no forms you find out who the real taxidermists are.
Taxidermy is a dying art because it wasn't to long ago they were still making there own forms out of the real skull and paper mache with lead earliners. Take a guess as to how many taxidermists can or could do that today? Back then if you wanted an open mouth anything they used the real jaws and teeth. Some lifesize were actually the entire cleaned skeleton wrapped and the skin mounted over.
Yes I would agree that "Real Taxidermy" is a dying art. As far as the number of Taxidermists today? No, there are more Taxidermists today then there was 20 years ago.
Post by: jackelope on January 21, 2015, 06:55:58 AM
Post by: jnutzalot on January 21, 2015, 03:11:09 PM
Post by: h20hunter on January 21, 2015, 03:12:12 PM
Post by: Becky on January 21, 2015, 03:15:03 PM
Stay the course man.....don't let up or give up until there is a resolution that you are satisfied with.:yeah: squeaky wheel gets the grease.
Post by: jnutzalot on January 21, 2015, 03:15:20 PM
Stay the course man.....don't let up or give up until there is a resolution that you are satisfied with.I haven't and won't. I'm still being patient with him but I was sure to let him know today how dissatisfied I am with their service and communication.
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 21, 2015, 03:42:00 PM
Post by: stevemiller on January 21, 2015, 04:21:57 PM
Post by: KFhunter on January 21, 2015, 04:27:24 PM
Update 2: The Butcher did not call me back all day, again! I had to call back and the Manager once again gave me the runaround about the supposed employee that botched the order...My patience has about ran out at this point. He promises to call me tomorrow at 10:00 to settle this up. We'll see what happens, this is such a joke.
This will be the runaround phase of dealing with a customer complaint. Let us know when you're done with this and get to the customer retribution phase.
Post by: KFhunter on January 21, 2015, 04:37:14 PM
What did the butcher say about the Employee that cut up your Elk? Is he still trying to get a hold of him?
"The employee" is irrelevant to the end consumer, sure the business owner will want to know who-what-when-where-why; but to the end consumer that's irrelevant.
It appears to me this business owner is using "the employee" as a scape goat type aid in giving the customer the run-a-round.
Post by: stevemiller on January 21, 2015, 04:46:58 PM
Post by: Band on January 21, 2015, 04:59:29 PM
Post by: stevemiller on January 21, 2015, 05:04:37 PM
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 21, 2015, 05:10:21 PM
Update 2: The Butcher did not call me back all day, again! I had to call back and the Manager once again gave me the runaround about the supposed employee that botched the order...My patience has about ran out at this point. He promises to call me tomorrow at 10:00 to settle this up. We'll see what happens, this is such a joke.
This will be the runaround phase of dealing with a customer complaint. Let us know when you're done with this and get to the customer retribution phase.
If this is the employees weekend or this is a seasonal employee and he is currently laid off for the season, this is the "employees" time not his employers. This may very well be requested time off by the employee. If it is requested time off he may not be home, he may be out of town, funeral, visiting family, who knows.
The Owner quite possibly wants to find the customers paperwork/cut ticket and find out from the employee what his side is. The condition of the animal when it came in, any spoiled meat they encountered, etc. I see no fault in this. The owner is probably trying to be prepared for dealing with an upset customer, he wants all his ducks in a row so he can answer his questions.
Post by: KFhunter on January 21, 2015, 05:19:17 PM
Update 2: The Butcher did not call me back all day, again! I had to call back and the Manager once again gave me the runaround about the supposed employee that botched the order...My patience has about ran out at this point. He promises to call me tomorrow at 10:00 to settle this up. We'll see what happens, this is such a joke.
This will be the runaround phase of dealing with a customer complaint. Let us know when you're done with this and get to the customer retribution phase.
If this is the employees weekend or this is a seasonal employee and he is currently laid off for the season, this is the "employees" time not his employers. This may very well be requested time off by the employee. If it is requested time off he may not be home, he may be out of town, funeral, visiting family, who knows.
The Owner quite possibly wants to find the customers paperwork/cut ticket and find out from the employee what his side is. The condition of the animal when it came in, any spoiled meat they encountered, etc. I see no fault in this. The owner is probably trying to be prepared for dealing with an upset customer, he wants all his ducks in a row so he can answer his questions.
All of those concerns are on the employer side, not the consumer side. The consumer should have been made aware of spoiled meat at the time of drop off.
You worked for a processer and you seen some bad meat, shot up meat, dirty meat and just plain nasty meat....did you simply take the carcass and not tell the person dropping it off the problems immediately visible? Any processor should at a glance know right away the quality of the carcass and expected return to the consumer. I know I'd go over the bad areas and even be able to toss out a rough estimate how much meat they should get back, and I'm not a professional yet.
Michelle_Nelson you're taking this far too personal, so I'm not going to get into a lengthy back and forth dialog with you.
Post by: sirmissalot on January 21, 2015, 05:21:39 PM
Update 2: The Butcher did not call me back all day, again! I had to call back and the Manager once again gave me the runaround about the supposed employee that botched the order...My patience has about ran out at this point. He promises to call me tomorrow at 10:00 to settle this up. We'll see what happens, this is such a joke.
This will be the runaround phase of dealing with a customer complaint. Let us know when you're done with this and get to the customer retribution phase.
If this is the employees weekend or this is a seasonal employee and he is currently laid off for the season, this is the "employees" time not his employers. This may very well be requested time off by the employee. If it is requested time off he may not be home, he may be out of town, funeral, visiting family, who knows.
The Owner quite possibly wants to find the customers paperwork/cut ticket and find out from the employee what his side is. The condition of the animal when it came in, any spoiled meat they encountered, etc. I see no fault in this. The owner is probably trying to be prepared for dealing with an upset customer, he wants all his ducks in a row so he can answer his questions.
You don't think the owner would be concerned a customer didn't receive his meat for over two months? The owner shouldn't be clueless, he/she should have have known if there was a box of meat that had been sitting in his freezer since November. He/she should also be concerned that a customer received rancid meat from his shop... You see no fault in this? Amazing how people will continually make excuse after excuse.
Post by: JimmyHoffa on January 21, 2015, 05:28:16 PM
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 21, 2015, 05:32:13 PM
Owner: Why wasn't I notified?
Owner: I don't know. You should have been.
Customer: Why did I get so little meat back when I brought in 190lbs quartered out Elk.
Owner: I don't know I didn't cut your Elk. I don't have the cut paperwork in front of me and the Employee that did cut your elk isn't working today.
Customer: Why didn't they cut my elk the way I asked?
Owner: I don't know I didn't cut your Elk. I don't have the cut paperwork in front of me and the Employee that did cut your elk isn't working today.
Customer: Why didn't you call me when it was ready?
Owner: I don't know but you should have been. We try to contact all customers with in 24 hours after there animal has been finished. I don't have your paperwork in front of me at the moment to see if they did or didn't.
Post by: stevemiller on January 21, 2015, 05:35:35 PM
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 21, 2015, 05:41:00 PM
Update 2: The Butcher did not call me back all day, again! I had to call back and the Manager once again gave me the runaround about the supposed employee that botched the order...My patience has about ran out at this point. He promises to call me tomorrow at 10:00 to settle this up. We'll see what happens, this is such a joke.
This will be the runaround phase of dealing with a customer complaint. Let us know when you're done with this and get to the customer retribution phase.
If this is the employees weekend or this is a seasonal employee and he is currently laid off for the season, this is the "employees" time not his employers. This may very well be requested time off by the employee. If it is requested time off he may not be home, he may be out of town, funeral, visiting family, who knows.
The Owner quite possibly wants to find the customers paperwork/cut ticket and find out from the employee what his side is. The condition of the animal when it came in, any spoiled meat they encountered, etc. I see no fault in this. The owner is probably trying to be prepared for dealing with an upset customer, he wants all his ducks in a row so he can answer his questions.
You don't think the owner would be concerned a customer didn't receive his meat for over two months? The owner shouldn't be clueless, he/she should have have known if there was a box of meat that had been sitting in his freezer since November. He/she should also be concerned that a customer received rancid meat from his shop... You see no fault in this? Amazing how people will continually make excuse after excuse.
. . . .and how do you know that the Owner is not concerned? Where you on another line listening to the OP and the Owners phone calls?
Sounds to me he is trying to get to the bottom of it by talking to the employee who cut the OP's Elk and pulling his paperwork. The Owner has more than likely pulled the paperwork. Quite possibly there is information missing on the paperwork and the Owner wants to find out "WHY".
How do you know that the employee isn't going to say Mr.Owner you should have seen the condition of the Elk meat the OP dropped off. It had dirt and hair all over it. I could tell it had been stored in wet game bags until he brought it in. I told him there was going to be considerable meat loss. He told me to cut it anyway.
That's right, you don't know. You are making an assumption.
Post by: jrebel on January 21, 2015, 05:42:56 PM
[/b]Update 2: The Butcher did not call me back all day, again! I had to call back and the Manager once again gave me the runaround about the supposed employee that botched the order...My patience has about ran out at this point. He promises to call me tomorrow at 10:00 to settle this up. We'll see what happens, this is such a joke.
This will be the runaround phase of dealing with a customer complaint. Let us know when you're done with this and get to the customer retribution phase.
If this is the employees weekend or this is a seasonal employee and he is currently laid off for the season, this is the "employees" time not his employers. This may very well be requested time off by the employee. If it is requested time off he may not be home, he may be out of town, funeral, visiting family, who knows.
The Owner quite possibly wants to find the customers paperwork/cut ticket and find out from the employee what his side is. The condition of the animal when it came in, any spoiled meat they encountered, etc. I see no fault in this. The owner is probably trying to be prepared for dealing with an upset customer, he wants all his ducks in a row so he can answer his questions.
You don't think the owner would be concerned a customer didn't receive his meat for over two months? The owner shouldn't be clueless, he/she should have have known if there was a box of meat that had been sitting in his freezer since November. He/she should also be concerned that a customer received rancid meat from his shop... You see no fault in this? Amazing how people will continually make excuse after excuse.
I'm not sure excuses are being made. As most situations.....there is fault to be had by both parties. The OP left his meat there for 3 months and is now giving a one sided story. We don't (and probably never will) have the butchers side of the story. If the situation came up 2-4 weeks after dropping off the elk, maybe there would be more credibility to the OP's story....but lets face it, who leave meat at the butcher for 3 months and expects a good outcome. As a sportsman this should have been dealt with months ago.
Now for the butcher.....he has a responsibility to the customer. If the elk showed up spoiled or a mess, he should have not taken it in. Being that he took it, I will make the assumption that it was viable, decently cleaned meat / carcass. The OP should have received his meat in a timely fashion and in the cuts he requested. Being that he didn't it should be made right. I don't respect business that play "pass the buck" (pun intended :chuckle:) to avoid the situation. With that said, it would be a lot harder to "pass the buck" if it was dealt with in a more timely fashion.
Hope it all works out...but lets face the facts. It is probably not going to be resolved (again because this is three months after the fact) and the OP has learned a very hard but valuable lesson. Butcher your own meat. :tup:
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 21, 2015, 05:53:37 PM
Right out of the gate people were telling the OP he was getting screwed, and how bad he got it, etc. Didn't bother asking questions or giving useful advice. They automatically assumed because the OP was the first to complain he was on the right side.
No one saw the Elk meat that was turned over to the butcher, no one was there the day the meat was cut, No one was there to see if the Butcher did make an attempt to contact the OP, etc. So lets all jump to conclusions.
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 21, 2015, 05:57:09 PM
Update 2: The Butcher did not call me back all day, again! I had to call back and the Manager once again gave me the runaround about the supposed employee that botched the order...My patience has about ran out at this point. He promises to call me tomorrow at 10:00 to settle this up. We'll see what happens, this is such a joke.
This will be the runaround phase of dealing with a customer complaint. Let us know when you're done with this and get to the customer retribution phase.
If this is the employees weekend or this is a seasonal employee and he is currently laid off for the season, this is the "employees" time not his employers. This may very well be requested time off by the employee. If it is requested time off he may not be home, he may be out of town, funeral, visiting family, who knows.
The Owner quite possibly wants to find the customers paperwork/cut ticket and find out from the employee what his side is. The condition of the animal when it came in, any spoiled meat they encountered, etc. I see no fault in this. The owner is probably trying to be prepared for dealing with an upset customer, he wants all his ducks in a row so he can answer his questions.
You don't think the owner would be concerned a customer didn't receive his meat for over two months? The owner shouldn't be clueless, he/she should have have known if there was a box of meat that had been sitting in his freezer since November. He/she should also be concerned that a customer received rancid meat from his shop... You see no fault in this? Amazing how people will continually make excuse after excuse.
. . . .and how do you know that the Owner is not concerned? Where you on another line listening to the OP and the Owners phone calls?
Sounds to me he is trying to get to the bottom of it by talking to the employee who cut the OP's Elk and pulling his paperwork. The Owner has more than likely pulled the paperwork. Quite possibly there is information missing on the paperwork and the Owner wants to find out "WHY".
How do you know that the employee isn't going to say Mr.Owner you should have seen the condition of the Elk meat the OP dropped off. It had dirt and hair all over it. I could tell it had been stored in wet game bags until he brought it in. I told him there was going to be considerable meat loss. He told me to cut it anyway.
That's right, you don't know. You are making an assumption.
So are you, and don't have a lot of room to talk in how to be a good business owner with your reputation.
Considering you have never done business with me personally, you really have no room to talk either.
Post by: Bullkllr on January 21, 2015, 05:59:33 PM
Post by: JODakota on January 21, 2015, 05:59:51 PM
Exactly, your current/former customers were kind enough to let everybody make sure that others didn't make that mistake. Back in my lane now mods.Update 2: The Butcher did not call me back all day, again! I had to call back and the Manager once again gave me the runaround about the supposed employee that botched the order...My patience has about ran out at this point. He promises to call me tomorrow at 10:00 to settle this up. We'll see what happens, this is such a joke.
This will be the runaround phase of dealing with a customer complaint. Let us know when you're done with this and get to the customer retribution phase.
If this is the employees weekend or this is a seasonal employee and he is currently laid off for the season, this is the "employees" time not his employers. This may very well be requested time off by the employee. If it is requested time off he may not be home, he may be out of town, funeral, visiting family, who knows.
The Owner quite possibly wants to find the customers paperwork/cut ticket and find out from the employee what his side is. The condition of the animal when it came in, any spoiled meat they encountered, etc. I see no fault in this. The owner is probably trying to be prepared for dealing with an upset customer, he wants all his ducks in a row so he can answer his questions.
You don't think the owner would be concerned a customer didn't receive his meat for over two months? The owner shouldn't be clueless, he/she should have have known if there was a box of meat that had been sitting in his freezer since November. He/she should also be concerned that a customer received rancid meat from his shop... You see no fault in this? Amazing how people will continually make excuse after excuse.
. . . .and how do you know that the Owner is not concerned? Where you on another line listening to the OP and the Owners phone calls?
Sounds to me he is trying to get to the bottom of it by talking to the employee who cut the OP's Elk and pulling his paperwork. The Owner has more than likely pulled the paperwork. Quite possibly there is information missing on the paperwork and the Owner wants to find out "WHY".
How do you know that the employee isn't going to say Mr.Owner you should have seen the condition of the Elk meat the OP dropped off. It had dirt and hair all over it. I could tell it had been stored in wet game bags until he brought it in. I told him there was going to be considerable meat loss. He told me to cut it anyway.
That's right, you don't know. You are making an assumption.
So are you, and don't have a lot of room to talk in how to be a good business owner with your reputation.
Considering you have never done business with me personally, you really have no room to talk either.
Post by: KFhunter on January 21, 2015, 06:00:13 PM
Please keep this thread on track. It's about a butcher shop and a customer of the shop.
again, in case you all missed the warning.
Keep. it. on. track.
Post by: jrebel on January 21, 2015, 06:00:40 PM
Update 2: The Butcher did not call me back all day, again! I had to call back and the Manager once again gave me the runaround about the supposed employee that botched the order...My patience has about ran out at this point. He promises to call me tomorrow at 10:00 to settle this up. We'll see what happens, this is such a joke.
This will be the runaround phase of dealing with a customer complaint. Let us know when you're done with this and get to the customer retribution phase.
If this is the employees weekend or this is a seasonal employee and he is currently laid off for the season, this is the "employees" time not his employers. This may very well be requested time off by the employee. If it is requested time off he may not be home, he may be out of town, funeral, visiting family, who knows.
The Owner quite possibly wants to find the customers paperwork/cut ticket and find out from the employee what his side is. The condition of the animal when it came in, any spoiled meat they encountered, etc. I see no fault in this. The owner is probably trying to be prepared for dealing with an upset customer, he wants all his ducks in a row so he can answer his questions.
You don't think the owner would be concerned a customer didn't receive his meat for over two months? The owner shouldn't be clueless, he/she should have have known if there was a box of meat that had been sitting in his freezer since November. He/she should also be concerned that a customer received rancid meat from his shop... You see no fault in this? Amazing how people will continually make excuse after excuse.
. . . .and how do you know that the Owner is not concerned? Where you on another line listening to the OP and the Owners phone calls?
Sounds to me he is trying to get to the bottom of it by talking to the employee who cut the OP's Elk and pulling his paperwork. The Owner has more than likely pulled the paperwork. Quite possibly there is information missing on the paperwork and the Owner wants to find out "WHY".
How do you know that the employee isn't going to say Mr.Owner you should have seen the condition of the Elk meat the OP dropped off. It had dirt and hair all over it. I could tell it had been stored in wet game bags until he brought it in. I told him there was going to be considerable meat loss. He told me to cut it anyway.
That's right, you don't know. You are making an assumption.
So are you, and don't have a lot of room to talk in how to be a good business owner with your reputation.
That really adds no value to this topic. Though I don't agree 100% with Michelle, I do understand her point and agree with some of what she has to say. Attacking someone personally is no way to make your argument / point stronger. Please refrain. :tup: and keep it on topic.
Post by: HntnFsh on January 21, 2015, 06:02:52 PM
If you guys that want to sit here and argue, put words into my mouth that were not said, would actually go through and "read" what I've posted, I have in no way defended the Owner of the Butcher Shop. I am being devils advocate, and looking at it from the butchers side.
Right out of the gate people were telling the OP he was getting screwed, and how bad he got it, etc. Didn't bother asking questions or giving useful advice. They automatically assumed because the OP was the first to complain he was on the right side.
No one saw the Elk meat that was turned over to the butcher, no one was there the day the meat was cut, No one was there to see if the Butcher did make an attempt to contact the OP, etc. So lets all jump to conclusions.
My wife and her first husband had a custom meat cutting shop. Shes told me more stories than I can count. Your spot on, on this one Michelle. Cant judge this one until both sides of the story are heard!
Post by: Band on January 21, 2015, 06:07:32 PM
Post by: h20hunter on January 21, 2015, 06:08:53 PM
Op, let us know what's new tomorrow.
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 21, 2015, 06:17:59 PM
A good business owner does not allow a game animal to sit for the length of time this one did before having the product finished for the customer. Period. A good business owner does not deliver such a tiny percentage of finished product as was delivered to this customer without a thorough explanation either at the time of dropoff, during the cutting process, or at the very least when the customer picks up the final product. Period. There is no valid excuse.
How do you know that the animal wasn't cut within a week or 2 and attempts were made to contact the customer to come pick it up?
How do you know that a phone call wasn't attempted during the cutting process to talk over bad meat or damage they noticed? So they were not able to make contact, what is the bitcher supposed to do? Hang the meat back up for a couple days, so more of it can go bad, while they try to get a hold of the customer?
How do you know that an employee or the OP didn't accidentally write the phone number down wrong? Or one of the numbers didn't look similar to another due to a smudge of ink? Maybe one or the other has sloppy hand writing?
Good chance that the person that gave the OP his meat at pick up was the same person that took it in or cut and wrapped it. If it is not that employees responsibility to notify customers of spoiled meat while cutting how is that person supposed to give an explanation ? The OP didn't realize the shortage until after he got the meat home and was making dinner.
If the Owner did not check the animal in or cut and wrap the animal how is he supposed to answer any of the OP's questions until he himself is able to get the answers unless he talks to the employee that did the cut and wrap and pulls the paperwork?
Post by: Bob33 on January 21, 2015, 06:23:00 PM
(3) It is prima facie evidence of waste if:
(a) A processor purchases or engages a quantity of food fish, shellfish, or game fish that cannot be processed within sixty hours after the food fish, game fish, or shellfish are taken from the water, unless the food fish, game fish, or shellfish are preserved in good marketable condition; or
(b) A person brings a big game animal to a wildlife meat cutter and then abandons the animal. For purposes of this subsection (3)(b), a big game animal is deemed to be abandoned when its carcass is placed in the custody of a wildlife meat cutter for butchering and processing and:
(i) Having been placed in such custody for an unspecified period of time, the meat is not removed within thirty days after the wildlife meat cutter gives notice to the person who brought in the carcass or, having been so notified, the person who brought in the carcass refuses or fails to pay the agreed upon or reasonable charges for the butchering or processing of the carcass; or
(ii) Having been placed in such custody for a specified period of time, the meat is not removed at the end of the specified period or the person who brought in the carcass refuses to pay the agreed upon or reasonable charges for the butchering or processing of the carcass.
Post by: h20hunter on January 21, 2015, 06:23:25 PM
No problem with the edit at all. Everyone is thinking it. Everyone knows it. Delete my comment, half this thread, I'll be the first to say thanks.
Post by: Bob33 on January 21, 2015, 06:25:58 PM
Seriously, can we get a halt to this.Yes, we can. Any further comments about anything other than the topic of the OP, which specifically deals with a butcher and does not deal with taxidermy or any other related topic will be removed.
Post by: Band on January 21, 2015, 06:31:27 PM
If the Owner did not check the animal in or cut and wrap the animal how is he supposed to answer any of the OP's questions until he himself is able to get the answers unless he talks to the employee that did the cut and wrap and pulls the paperwork?If the owner does not have a management system in place and has not trained his employees to provide a full explanation of such a tiny yield of final product to the customer when they are face to face at the time of pickup, regardless of who actually processed the animal the owner is a POOR business manager. No excuse!
Post by: gasman on January 21, 2015, 06:34:26 PM
Hope this turns out good for you :hello:
Post by: jnutzalot on January 21, 2015, 07:57:02 PM
[/b]Update 2: The Butcher did not call me back all day, again! I had to call back and the Manager once again gave me the runaround about the supposed employee that botched the order...My patience has about ran out at this point. He promises to call me tomorrow at 10:00 to settle this up. We'll see what happens, this is such a joke.
This will be the runaround phase of dealing with a customer complaint. Let us know when you're done with this and get to the customer retribution phase.
If this is the employees weekend or this is a seasonal employee and he is currently laid off for the season, this is the "employees" time not his employers. This may very well be requested time off by the employee. If it is requested time off he may not be home, he may be out of town, funeral, visiting family, who knows.
The Owner quite possibly wants to find the customers paperwork/cut ticket and find out from the employee what his side is. The condition of the animal when it came in, any spoiled meat they encountered, etc. I see no fault in this. The owner is probably trying to be prepared for dealing with an upset customer, he wants all his ducks in a row so he can answer his questions.
You don't think the owner would be concerned a customer didn't receive his meat for over two months? The owner shouldn't be clueless, he/she should have have known if there was a box of meat that had been sitting in his freezer since November. He/she should also be concerned that a customer received rancid meat from his shop... You see no fault in this? Amazing how people will continually make excuse after excuse.
I'm not sure excuses are being made. As most situations.....there is fault to be had by both parties. The OP left his meat there for 3 months and is now giving a one sided story. We don't (and probably never will) have the butchers side of the story. If the situation came up 2-4 weeks after dropping off the elk, maybe there would be more credibility to the OP's story....but lets face it, who leave meat at the butcher for 3 months and expects a good outcome. As a sportsman this should have been dealt with months ago.
Now for the butcher.....he has a responsibility to the customer. If the elk showed up spoiled or a mess, he should have not taken it in. Being that he took it, I will make the assumption that it was viable, decently cleaned meat / carcass. The OP should have received his meat in a timely fashion and in the cuts he requested. Being that he didn't it should be made right. I don't respect business that play "pass the buck" (pun intended :chuckle:) to avoid the situation. With that said, it would be a lot harder to "pass the buck" if it was dealt with in a more timely fashion.
Hope it all works out...but lets face the facts. It is probably not going to be resolved (again because this is three months after the fact) and the OP has learned a very hard but valuable lesson. Butcher your own meat. :tup:
Now wait a minute, I didn't just drop of my elk and forget about it for 2 months (it was 2 months not 3). I was told it would be ready in 3 weeks because they were busy. So...
1) I contracted them at 3 weeks and asked if my order was ready (they never attempted to contact me). At that time they took my information so they could check on my order but never called me back. (week 3)
2) I contacted them at the start of the following week and received their message machine during normal business hours, I don't leave a message. I figure they still aren't done. My friends tell me not to worry. (beginning of week 4)
3) I contacted them again at the end of the week and received their message machine again, I leave a message stating, "it's now been a month and I haven't received my meat" or something to that extent. (end of week 4)
4) I call the following week and get someone on the phone. I give them my name and they say they don't see my ticket up and that I had a bunch of orders ahead of me but they will be working all weekend to get caught up on orders, blah, blah, blah - It should be ready in 1-2 weeks. (week 5)
4) The following week I call and my call does not go through - I get one of those phone company error messages. Later I find out their card machine shares a line with their main line so maybe that is why.
5) I call again later that day and get the same error message. I start to worry they went out of business or something. (Week 6, it's now been a 1.5 months)
6) I call again the following week and get a their message machine again, It's mid morning and I figure maybe they aren't in yet, or not answering their phone as usual. (beginning of week 7)
7) I call back mid week and get a hold of the manager, tell him how long I have been waiting, and he tells me my Elk is up and being worked on and they will call me as soon as it is ready. (week 7)
8 ) A week goes by and they call and leave a message on my voice mail that my elk is ready. (week 8 )
I made massive attempts to try to contract them by phone. This butcher is 2 hours from where I live, so it's not like I can just swing by his shop on a whim and find out what's going on. This is my third year hunting, so maybe I was ignorant and should have flipped out after a month went by without getting my meat back. After all it only took 2 weeks to get my deer back from my local butcher and that included smoked sausage and summer sausage....
One thing is for sure though, no matter what the outcome this will be the last time I take my animal to a butcher. I'm going to take the advice of people on here and invest in my own processing equipment.
In the end I could have forgave how long it took if my order hadn't been messed up in every way possible.
Post by: bobcat on January 21, 2015, 08:06:15 PM
Post by: jnutzalot on January 21, 2015, 08:09:57 PM
:yike: On week 7 they were working on your elk? I'd of been very concerned at that point!I figured and prayed they had froze the meat. Which is what the butcher claimed he did when I talked to him today.
Post by: jrebel on January 21, 2015, 08:13:10 PM
Have you tried any other since? What does it taste like?
Post by: jnutzalot on January 21, 2015, 08:14:59 PM
Yeah, hanging an elk for more than three weeks is a bad mojo. That might explain the rank steak that you had to throw out.I tried a piece of tip Sirloin and the back strap. Both were rancid and smelt like a garbage can.
Have you tried any other since? What does it taste like?
The burger was fine - but I don't even know how much if any is elk meat. It doesn't look like any of the Elk burger I've ever seen or had. And if the other meat was rancid why wouldnt the burger meat be rancid...it doesn't make any sense.
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 21, 2015, 08:15:13 PM
Well I can call B.S. on the Butcher if they told you 7 weeks later after dropping it off that they hadn't cut it yet. If they had let your Elk hang 7 weeks before cutting it, it would have been rotten, you wouldn't just notice a little funk. They either didn't want to look up the information or they didn't want to go through the cooler and look for it.
Game Meat isn't like Beef. They do not age the same, and it shouldn't be hung as long as a Beef. Beef is typically hung for 7-14 days. Depending on the animal and the cuts the animal is going to be cut for.
Post by: jnutzalot on January 21, 2015, 08:17:31 PM
jnutzalot,I asked him about that and he claims they would have froze it until they got to it. I dont believe any of their *censored* at this point. I just want them to replace my meat with some farm Elk and be done with it.
Well I can call on B.S. on the Butcher if they told you 7 weeks later after dropping it off that they hadn't cut it yet. If they had let your Elk hang 7 weeks before cutting it, it would have been rotten, you wouldn't just notice a little funk. They either didn't want to look up the information or they didn't want to go through the cooler and look for it.
Game Meat isn't like Beef. They do not age the same, and it shouldn't be hung as long as a Beef. Beef is typically hung for 7-14 days. Depending on the animal and the cuts the animal is going to be cut for.
Post by: elk247 on January 21, 2015, 08:19:46 PM
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 21, 2015, 08:20:46 PM
Pretty hard for someone that didn't handle his elk to answer his questions. For that he would need to locate the customers paperwork after 2-3 months and talk to the person who cut his Elk. Otherwise the conversation is pretty much going to be a short one. :rolleyes:
Owner: Why wasn't I notified?
Owner: I don't know. You should have been.
Customer: Why did I get so little meat back when I brought in 190lbs quartered out Elk.
Owner: I don't know I didn't cut your Elk. I don't have the cut paperwork in front of me and the Employee that did cut your elk isn't working today.
Customer: Why didn't they cut my elk the way I asked?
Owner: I don't know I didn't cut your Elk. I don't have the cut paperwork in front of me and the Employee that did cut your elk isn't working today.
Customer: Why didn't you call me when it was ready?
Owner: I don't know but you should have been. We try to contact all customers with in 24 hours after there animal has been finished. I don't have your paperwork in front of me at the moment to see if they did or didn't.
"owner" needs to learn how to run a business.
"Owner" should know why the heck it took 3 months for one of his employees to butcher an elk.
If I gave a customer the "I don't know" answers you've suggested, I'd be looking for a new job.
Owners with employees don't always know everything.
So when a Customer calls you and asks you a question that you don't know the answer to are you just going to make up something so that you can give him an answer? Or are you going to say "Sorry Sir I do not have the answer to your question but I will look into it and have an answer for you"
You can't tell me you know absolutely everything that goes on in the shop at every moment and that you have never had to ask one of your mechanics or parts department for an update.
Post by: Bob33 on January 21, 2015, 08:21:54 PM
One thing is for sure though, no matter what the outcome this will be the last time I take my animal to a butcher. I'm going to take the advice of people on here and invest in my own processing equipment.That sentiment is understandable, but i can assure you that not all butchers are bad. In fact the vast majority I've dealt with were exceptional and exceeded my expectations. More power to you if you wish to butcher your own, but I think you got snake bit with this one.
I'm sorry you had such a poor experience.
Post by: jrebel on January 21, 2015, 08:25:58 PM
Yeah, hanging an elk for more than three weeks is a bad mojo. That might explain the rank steak that you had to throw out.I tried a piece of tip Sirloin and the back strap. Both were rancid and smelt like a garbage can.
Have you tried any other since? What does it taste like?
It was never frozen and it probably is your elk. My guess is the reason you got so little is because he had to cut off a bunch of moldy meat.
Just so we are clear.....I was agreeing with you on the above post (for the most part). I do believe you have some fault for leaving it that long. Unfortunately this will be a hard lesson learned but it sounds like you won't make the same mistake. If you ever have to use a butcher again.....two (maybe three) weeks is the longest I would ever leave meat for standard processing. Jerky, pepperoni, etc. etc. may take longer....but that meat is usually frozen prior to processing if it is going to take longer.
Hopefully the butcher makes it right by you. Well as right as it can be made. My suggestion now would be to have a couple solutions that will make you happy and suggest them to the butcher next time you talk to him. Let him know "these are the options." example: Full Refund, Keep the money and give me x lbs of beef, etc. etc. etc. If you wait for him to suggest a resolution, you will be waiting for a long time.
Post by: 7mmstalker on January 21, 2015, 08:27:11 PM
It is not productive , nor does it right a wrong to publicly tear down a business, that possibly already has some serious problems.
That being said, I have been in a very similar position and it really burns to have your patience and understanding taken for granted, it seems that you have been very patient and persistent with reasonable expectations from the beginning.
Most of my life, I've been in some kind of "customer service" business, retail, wholesale, courier, shipping, and more.
When the customer is habitually ignored and the responsible party -management or owner- avoids accepting the responsibility for his business and employees, the natural and correct conclusion is trouble.
I hope you can, and do pursue satisfaction, your story is heart breaking, and I am sure going forward you will at least be wiser for the experience.
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 21, 2015, 08:29:38 PM
jnutzalot,I asked him about that and he claims they would have froze it until they got to it. I dont believe any of their *censored* at this point. I just want them to replace my meat with some farm Elk and be done with it.
Well I can call on B.S. on the Butcher if they told you 7 weeks later after dropping it off that they hadn't cut it yet. If they had let your Elk hang 7 weeks before cutting it, it would have been rotten, you wouldn't just notice a little funk. They either didn't want to look up the information or they didn't want to go through the cooler and look for it.
Game Meat isn't like Beef. They do not age the same, and it shouldn't be hung as long as a Beef. Beef is typically hung for 7-14 days. Depending on the animal and the cuts the animal is going to be cut for.
They are not going to replace your Elk with Farm Raised Elk, I am willing to bet on that.
When I was working as seasonal help for the Game Processor we never froze meat until we could get to it. I've never heard of that. Maybe that is something this particular shop does.
I will tell you what I will do I ask the Owner of the Shop I use to butcher my Beef/Elk and see if that is a common practice by Butchers up here and see what he says.
Post by: Hunterman on January 21, 2015, 08:36:01 PM
Hunterman(Tony)
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 21, 2015, 08:36:12 PM
ME: Hey, question for you.
My Butcher: Hi Michelle
ME: Is it a common thing for Butchers to freeze animals if they are behind and need more time to work on them? Specifically Game meat?
My Butcher: Nooooo
My Butcher: Should never happen
ME: The reason I ask is because a fellow hunter took an Elk to a Butcher over in Packwood area and it took him 2 months to get it back, he said he didn't get anything special just the common cuts.
My Butcher: Omg, that's horrible and should never happen
Me: The butcher apparently told him they freeze meat when behind and are able to get to it.
He said his steaks are rancid smelling
My Butcher: I have a 8 day turnaround. No more ever
ME: His Elk burger looks like Beef it has a ton of fat.
My Butcher: Probably not his elk. They let his spoil
My Butcher: Nobody ever does that
My Butcher: Wild game can't hang long cause there's no fat cover to protect it from rotting
Post by: dreamingbig on January 21, 2015, 08:37:00 PM
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: jnutzalot on January 21, 2015, 08:41:07 PM
jnutzalot, you have my sympathy, and sincere hope for some satisfaction to "make things right" on your terms.I have not disclosed the name of the business nor will I if they make a reasonable attempt to remedy the situation. However, if they do not make it right, I'm not going to keep quiet - I'll make every effort to share my experience and the name of the business.
It is not productive , nor does it right a wrong to publicly tear down a business, that possibly already has some serious problems.
That being said, I have been in a very similar position and it really burns to have your patience and understanding taken for granted, it seems that you have been very patient and persistent with reasonable expectations from the beginning.
Most of my life, I've been in some kind of "customer service" business, retail, wholesale, courier, shipping, and more.
When the customer is habitually ignored and the responsible party -management or owner- avoids accepting the responsibility for his business and employees, the natural and correct conclusion is trouble.
I hope you can, and do pursue satisfaction, your story is heart braking, and I am sure going forward you will at least be wiser for the experience.
Post by: jnutzalot on January 21, 2015, 08:45:11 PM
Who was this so called butcher, and what town? You got hosed on your elk. No way in hell would I let some twit keep my elk longer than 3 weeks. A lot of things went way too wrong with this elk. There is not a thing you can do about it. Your elk rotted. Unfortunately this is one bad ending to an otherwise great hunt, and a great elk. I hope you took care looking for a taxi for your mount. Make sure you check out their business practice. Just like the butcher you used, they make more excuses than honor.I took it to Cedar River Taxidermy in Enumclaw. I saw that several people had recommended him in the taxi thread, I was also able to physically see several of his pieces and they were all extremely well done.
Hunterman(Tony)
Post by: Bob33 on January 21, 2015, 08:48:13 PM
I took it to Cedar River Taxidermy in Enumclaw. I saw that several people had recommended him in the taxi thread, I was also able to physically see several of his pieces and they were all extremely well done.A taxi? Maybe he thought you wanted your meat shoulder mounted. That can take up to a year. ;)
Post by: MtnMuley on January 21, 2015, 08:55:59 PM
LMAO :chuckle:I took it to Cedar River Taxidermy in Enumclaw. I saw that several people had recommended him in the taxi thread, I was also able to physically see several of his pieces and they were all extremely well done.A taxi? Maybe he thought you wanted your meat shoulder mounted. That can take up to a year. ;)
Post by: jackelope on January 21, 2015, 08:59:43 PM
Pretty hard for someone that didn't handle his elk to answer his questions. For that he would need to locate the customers paperwork after 2-3 months and talk to the person who cut his Elk. Otherwise the conversation is pretty much going to be a short one. :rolleyes:
Owner: Why wasn't I notified?
Owner: I don't know. You should have been.
Customer: Why did I get so little meat back when I brought in 190lbs quartered out Elk.
Owner: I don't know I didn't cut your Elk. I don't have the cut paperwork in front of me and the Employee that did cut your elk isn't working today.
Customer: Why didn't they cut my elk the way I asked?
Owner: I don't know I didn't cut your Elk. I don't have the cut paperwork in front of me and the Employee that did cut your elk isn't working today.
Customer: Why didn't you call me when it was ready?
Owner: I don't know but you should have been. We try to contact all customers with in 24 hours after there animal has been finished. I don't have your paperwork in front of me at the moment to see if they did or didn't.
"owner" needs to learn how to run a business.
"Owner" should know why the heck it took 3 months for one of his employees to butcher an elk.
If I gave a customer the "I don't know" answers you've suggested, I'd be looking for a new job.
Owners with employees don't always know everything.
So when a Customer calls you and asks you a question that you don't know the answer to are you just going to make up something so that you can give him an answer? Or are you going to say "Sorry Sir I do not have the answer to your question but I will look into it and have an answer for you"
You can't tell me you know absolutely everything that goes on in the shop at every moment and that you have never had to ask one of your mechanics or parts department for an update.
Owners better know why it takes 3 months to butcher an elk. Guaranteed I will know why it is taking 3 months to replace an engine.
Post by: grundy53 on January 21, 2015, 09:01:16 PM
I am very sorry for your horrible experience. It sounds like you did everything right trying to contact them.[/b]Update 2: The Butcher did not call me back all day, again! I had to call back and the Manager once again gave me the runaround about the supposed employee that botched the order...My patience has about ran out at this point. He promises to call me tomorrow at 10:00 to settle this up. We'll see what happens, this is such a joke.
This will be the runaround phase of dealing with a customer complaint. Let us know when you're done with this and get to the customer retribution phase.
If this is the employees weekend or this is a seasonal employee and he is currently laid off for the season, this is the "employees" time not his employers. This may very well be requested time off by the employee. If it is requested time off he may not be home, he may be out of town, funeral, visiting family, who knows.
The Owner quite possibly wants to find the customers paperwork/cut ticket and find out from the employee what his side is. The condition of the animal when it came in, any spoiled meat they encountered, etc. I see no fault in this. The owner is probably trying to be prepared for dealing with an upset customer, he wants all his ducks in a row so he can answer his questions.
You don't think the owner would be concerned a customer didn't receive his meat for over two months? The owner shouldn't be clueless, he/she should have have known if there was a box of meat that had been sitting in his freezer since November. He/she should also be concerned that a customer received rancid meat from his shop... You see no fault in this? Amazing how people will continually make excuse after excuse.
I'm not sure excuses are being made. As most situations.....there is fault to be had by both parties. The OP left his meat there for 3 months and is now giving a one sided story. We don't (and probably never will) have the butchers side of the story. If the situation came up 2-4 weeks after dropping off the elk, maybe there would be more credibility to the OP's story....but lets face it, who leave meat at the butcher for 3 months and expects a good outcome. As a sportsman this should have been dealt with months ago.
Now for the butcher.....he has a responsibility to the customer. If the elk showed up spoiled or a mess, he should have not taken it in. Being that he took it, I will make the assumption that it was viable, decently cleaned meat / carcass. The OP should have received his meat in a timely fashion and in the cuts he requested. Being that he didn't it should be made right. I don't respect business that play "pass the buck" (pun intended :chuckle:) to avoid the situation. With that said, it would be a lot harder to "pass the buck" if it was dealt with in a more timely fashion.
Hope it all works out...but lets face the facts. It is probably not going to be resolved (again because this is three months after the fact) and the OP has learned a very hard but valuable lesson. Butcher your own meat. :tup:
Now wait a minute, I didn't just drop of my elk and forget about it for 2 months (it was 2 months not 3). I was told it would be ready in 3 weeks because they were busy. So...
1) I contracted them at 3 weeks and asked if my order was ready (they never attempted to contact me). At that time they took my information so they could check on my order but never called me back. (week 3)
2) I contacted them at the start of the following week and received their message machine during normal business hours, I don't leave a message. I figure they still aren't done. My friends tell me not to worry. (beginning of week 4)
3) I contacted them again at the end of the week and received their message machine again, I leave a message stating, "it's now been a month and I haven't received my meat" or something to that extent. (end of week 4)
4) I call the following week and get someone on the phone. I give them my name and they say they don't see my ticket up and that I had a bunch of orders ahead of me but they will be working all weekend to get caught up on orders, blah, blah, blah - It should be ready in 1-2 weeks. (week 5)
4) The following week I call and my call does not go through - I get one of those phone company error messages. Later I find out their card machine shares a line with their main line so maybe that is why.
5) I call again later that day and get the same error message. I start to worry they went out of business or something. (Week 6, it's now been a 1.5 months)
6) I call again the following week and get a their message machine again, It's mid morning and I figure maybe they aren't in yet, or not answering their phone as usual. (beginning of week 7)
7) I call back mid week and get a hold of the manager, tell him how long I have been waiting, and he tells me my Elk is up and being worked on and they will call me as soon as it is ready. (week 7)
8 ) A week goes by and they call and leave a message on my voice mail that my elk is ready. (week 8 )
I made massive attempts to try to contract them by phone. This butcher is 2 hours from where I live, so it's not like I can just swing by his shop on a whim and find out what's going on. This is my third year hunting, so maybe I was ignorant and should have flipped out after a month went by without getting my meat back. After all it only took 2 weeks to get my deer back from my local butcher and that included smoked sausage and summer sausage....
One thing is for sure though, no matter what the outcome this will be the last time I take my animal to a butcher. I'm going to take the advice of people on here and invest in my own processing equipment.
In the end I could have forgave how long it took if my order hadn't been messed up in every way possible.
Post by: Band on January 21, 2015, 09:01:38 PM
Post by: jackelope on January 21, 2015, 09:02:05 PM
Who was this so called butcher, and what town? You got hosed on your elk. No way in hell would I let some twit keep my elk longer than 3 weeks. A lot of things went way too wrong with this elk. There is not a thing you can do about it. Your elk rotted. Unfortunately this is one bad ending to an otherwise great hunt, and a great elk. I hope you took care looking for a taxi for your mount. Make sure you check out their business practice. Just like the butcher you used, they make more excuses than honor.I took it to Cedar River Taxidermy in Enumclaw. I saw that several people had recommended him in the taxi thread, I was also able to physically see several of his pieces and they were all extremely well done.
Hunterman(Tony)
Huh?
Post by: JimmyHoffa on January 21, 2015, 09:05:58 PM
This is what my Butcher had to say on the subject.I don't freeze twice. I cut into meal size and freeze, don't even mess with the fine processing until thawed out for cooking. Had a freezer off for a bit during a storm and the meat thawed and then refroze. The meat didn't 'rot' per se (not fully thawed, but enough to get blood to run), but it did get a sour-gamey taste. A few knowledgeable people said the protein was still good, but it would definitely taste off. The more it freeze/thaws the worse it gets. It was too bad to even cover up with sauces.....coyote bait it became.
ME: Hey, question for you.
My Butcher: Hi Michelle
ME: Is it a common thing for Butchers to freeze animals if they are behind and need more time to work on them? Specifically Game meat?
My Butcher: Nooooo
My Butcher: Should never happen
ME: The reason I ask is because a fellow hunter took an Elk to a Butcher over in Packwood area and it took him 2 months to get it back, he said he didn't get anything special just the common cuts.
My Butcher: Omg, that's horrible and should never happen
Me: The butcher apparently told him they freeze meat when behind and are able to get to it.
He said his steaks are rancid smelling
My Butcher: I have a 8 day turnaround. No more ever
ME: His Elk burger looks like Beef it has a ton of fat.
My Butcher: Probably not his elk. They let his spoil
My Butcher: Nobody ever does that
My Butcher: Wild game can't hang long cause there's no fat cover to protect it from rotting
Post by: jnutzalot on January 21, 2015, 09:06:32 PM
The taxidermy thread - I saw people recommend him in there.Who was this so called butcher, and what town? You got hosed on your elk. No way in hell would I let some twit keep my elk longer than 3 weeks. A lot of things went way too wrong with this elk. There is not a thing you can do about it. Your elk rotted. Unfortunately this is one bad ending to an otherwise great hunt, and a great elk. I hope you took care looking for a taxi for your mount. Make sure you check out their business practice. Just like the butcher you used, they make more excuses than honor.I took it to Cedar River Taxidermy in Enumclaw. I saw that several people had recommended him in the taxi thread, I was also able to physically see several of his pieces and they were all extremely well done.
Hunterman(Tony)
Huh?
Post by: jackelope on January 21, 2015, 09:07:55 PM
Post by: Becky on January 21, 2015, 09:08:22 PM
Who was this so called butcher, and what town? You got hosed on your elk. No way in hell would I let some twit keep my elk longer than 3 weeks. A lot of things went way too wrong with this elk. There is not a thing you can do about it. Your elk rotted. Unfortunately this is one bad ending to an otherwise great hunt, and a great elk. I hope you took care looking for a taxi for your mount. Make sure you check out their business practice. Just like the butcher you used, they make more excuses than honor.I took it to Cedar River Taxidermy in Enumclaw. I saw that several people had recommended him in the taxi thread, I was also able to physically see several of his pieces and they were all extremely well done.
Hunterman(Tony)
Huh?
Hunterman asked him if he took care on choosing a taxi, this is him answering that part of the question.
Post by: kenzmad on January 21, 2015, 09:10:22 PM
Post by: elk247 on January 21, 2015, 09:11:17 PM
Quote from: jnutzalot link=topic=168940.msg2233401#msg2233401 date=1421901667
look at how many people have viewed this thread. (About 5,900) All you said was this butcher was near Packwood. It would suck to see an honest guy loose business by association. I don't know any meat cutters in the town of Packwood (are there any?) but I can assure you there are many guys that hunt lewis county on this forum. In fact, only one butcher shop comes to mind, and it isn't in Packwood. I am not suggesting a witch hunt (I mostly respect the way you handled it) but this is a bad situation for more than just you if you scare business away from innocent folks in these small towns. Sorry about your bull, its a real good looking animal.jnutzalot, you have my sympathy, and sincere hope for some satisfaction to "make things right" on your terms.I have not disclosed the name of the business nor will I if they make a reasonable attempt to remedy the situation. However, if they do not make it right, I'm not going to keep quiet - I'll make every attempt to share my experience and the name of the business.
It is not productive , nor does it right a wrong to publicly tear down a business, that possibly already has some serious problems.
That being said, I have been in a very similar position and it really burns to have your patience and understanding taken for granted, it seems that you have been very patient and persistent with reasonable expectations from the beginning.
Most of my life, I've been in some kind of "customer service" business, retail, wholesale, courier, shipping, and more.
When the customer is habitually ignored and the responsible party -management or owner- avoids accepting the responsibility for his business and employees, the natural and correct conclusion is trouble.
I hope you can, and do pursue satisfaction, your story is heart braking, and I am sure going forward you will at least be wiser for the experience.
Post by: KFhunter on January 21, 2015, 09:11:31 PM
jnutzalot, you have my sympathy, and sincere hope for some satisfaction to "make things right" on your terms.
It is not productive , nor does it right a wrong to publicly tear down a business, that possibly already has some serious problems.
That being said, I have been in a very similar position and it really burns to have your patience and understanding taken for granted, it seems that you have been very patient and persistent with reasonable expectations from the beginning.
Most of my life, I've been in some kind of "customer service" business, retail, wholesale, courier, shipping, and more.
When the customer is habitually ignored and the responsible party -management or owner- avoids accepting the responsibility for his business and employees, the natural and correct conclusion is trouble.
I hope you can, and do pursue satisfaction, your story is heart breaking, and I am sure going forward you will at least be wiser for the experience.
Can't disagree more, I think it's the OP's duty to oust this butcher and make it known to save other hunters coming along afterwards.
If not for online reviews there'd be no real way to weed out business owners like this.
Post by: jnutzalot on January 21, 2015, 09:32:56 PM
Well maybe that wasn't fair but I was trying to be nondescript. What I meant to say is that I was hunting in the packwood area, and the butcher is somewhere between there and home. The butcher could be in one of the many towns along hwy 12, 508, Hwy 7, maybe even as far as I5, or clear to Yakima. There are lot's of good butchers in any number of the several towns on the way as well (I know because they have since been recommended). I just managed to find one that I had a bad experience at...Quote from: jnutzalot link=topic=168940.msg2233401#msg2233401 date=1421901667look at how many people have viewed this thread. All you said was this butcher was near Packwood. It would suck to see an honest guy loose business by association. I don't know any meat cutters in the town of Packwood (are there any?) but I can assure you there are many guys that hunt lewis county on this forum. In fact, only one butcher shop comes to mind, and it isn't in Packwood. I am not suggesting a witch hunt (I mostly respect the way you handled it) but this is a bad situation for more than just you if you scare business away from innocent folks in these small towns. Sorry about your bull, its a real good looking animal.jnutzalot, you have my sympathy, and sincere hope for some satisfaction to "make things right" on your terms.I have not disclosed the name of the business nor will I if they make a reasonable attempt to remedy the situation. However, if they do not make it right, I'm not going to keep quiet - I'll make every attempt to share my experience and the name of the business.
It is not productive , nor does it right a wrong to publicly tear down a business, that possibly already has some serious problems.
That being said, I have been in a very similar position and it really burns to have your patience and understanding taken for granted, it seems that you have been very patient and persistent with reasonable expectations from the beginning.
Most of my life, I've been in some kind of "customer service" business, retail, wholesale, courier, shipping, and more.
When the customer is habitually ignored and the responsible party -management or owner- avoids accepting the responsibility for his business and employees, the natural and correct conclusion is trouble.
I hope you can, and do pursue satisfaction, your story is heart braking, and I am sure going forward you will at least be wiser for the experience.
Post by: huntnnw on January 21, 2015, 09:36:01 PM
The other question is why didnt the OP call sooner? thats the bigger question...3 weeks had gone by Id be on the phone
Post by: Curly on January 21, 2015, 09:37:31 PM
I sure can't think of any solution to make it right. I do hope you find some satisfaction though. Good luck.
Post by: jnutzalot on January 21, 2015, 09:38:06 PM
Lol - I had trouble if deciding if I wanted the tenderloins pointed forward or back.I took it to Cedar River Taxidermy in Enumclaw. I saw that several people had recommended him in the taxi thread, I was also able to physically see several of his pieces and they were all extremely well done.A taxi? Maybe he thought you wanted your meat shoulder mounted. That can take up to a year. ;)
Post by: KFhunter on January 21, 2015, 09:40:56 PM
Lol - I had trouble if deciding if I wanted the tenderloins pointed forward or back.I took it to Cedar River Taxidermy in Enumclaw. I saw that several people had recommended him in the taxi thread, I was also able to physically see several of his pieces and they were all extremely well done.A taxi? Maybe he thought you wanted your meat shoulder mounted. That can take up to a year. ;)
What tenderloins? They were disappeared......
Post by: jnutzalot on January 21, 2015, 09:43:01 PM
Getting ahold of said employee who cut up the elk means nothing...like this guy is going to remember that elk! when there was probably multiple being done at that time and who knows how many he cut up!If you read back, I called at 3 weeks and several times after.
The other question is why didnt the OP call sooner? thats the bigger question...3 weeks had gone by Id be on the phone
Post by: Fullabull on January 21, 2015, 09:44:34 PM
Post by: Jarhead Chase on January 21, 2015, 09:48:22 PM
Getting ahold of said employee who cut up the elk means nothing...like this guy is going to remember that elk! when there was probably multiple being done at that time and who knows how many he cut up!
The other question is why didnt the OP call sooner? thats the bigger question...3 weeks had gone by Id be on the phone
Just to clarify, he said he did try to call 1-2 times per week from week 3 on.
Post by: huntnnw on January 21, 2015, 09:49:43 PM
Post by: Becky on January 21, 2015, 09:51:28 PM
Getting ahold of said employee who cut up the elk means nothing...like this guy is going to remember that elk! when there was probably multiple being done at that time and who knows how many he cut up!
The other question is why didnt the OP call sooner? thats the bigger question...3 weeks had gone by Id be on the phone
Just to clarify, he said he did try to call 1-2 times per week from week 3 on.
:yeah: To get a better understanding people need to read the comments from the OP specifically, not necessarily all the commentary in between... a lot of questions are asked multiple times that he already answered.
Post by: elk247 on January 21, 2015, 10:02:38 PM
Thanks for the clarifacition. Again, I'm sorry this happens to your bull. Nobody deserves that, the Bull defiantly didn't deserve to be wasted like that! You worked hard to provide the best food for your family and it was taken from you. Can I request the name of the butcher via p.m. so I can be sure to not let my family get ripped off. Not interested in gossip or drama, Thanks.Well maybe that wasn't fair but I was trying to be nondescript. What I meant to say is that I was hunting in the packwood area, and the butcher is somewhere between there and home. The butcher could be in one of the many towns along hwy 12, 508, Hwy 7, maybe even as far as I5, or clear to Yakima. There are lot's of good butchers in any number of the several towns on the way as well (I know because they have since been recommended). I just managed to find one that I had a bad experience at...Quote from: jnutzalot link=topic=168940.msg2233401#msg2233401 date=1421901667look at how many people have viewed this thread. All you said was this butcher was near Packwood. It would suck to see an honest guy loose business by association. I don't know any meat cutters in the town of Packwood (are there any?) but I can assure you there are many guys that hunt lewis county on this forum. In fact, only one butcher shop comes to mind, and it isn't in Packwood. I am not suggesting a witch hunt (I mostly respect the way you handled it) but this is a bad situation for more than just you if you scare business away from innocent folks in these small towns. Sorry about your bull, its a real good looking animal.jnutzalot, you have my sympathy, and sincere hope for some satisfaction to "make things right" on your terms.I have not disclosed the name of the business nor will I if they make a reasonable attempt to remedy the situation. However, if they do not make it right, I'm not going to keep quiet - I'll make every attempt to share my experience and the name of the business.
It is not productive , nor does it right a wrong to publicly tear down a business, that possibly already has some serious problems.
That being said, I have been in a very similar position and it really burns to have your patience and understanding taken for granted, it seems that you have been very patient and persistent with reasonable expectations from the beginning.
Most of my life, I've been in some kind of "customer service" business, retail, wholesale, courier, shipping, and more.
When the customer is habitually ignored and the responsible party -management or owner- avoids accepting the responsibility for his business and employees, the natural and correct conclusion is trouble.
I hope you can, and do pursue satisfaction, your story is heart braking, and I am sure going forward you will at least be wiser for the experience.
Post by: huntnnw on January 21, 2015, 10:03:30 PM
The drive alone would for me...not to include the cost of gas could bought something to start processing
Post by: csaaphill on January 21, 2015, 10:19:02 PM
it was a bit on taxidermy so i guess i would, but dont matter as they state this is about a butcher issue. wasn't trying to jack the thread.not to keep arguing but I highly dobt it. I was watching a show hunting show on the outdoor chanel and they were stating that taxidermy is a dying art.Where? none around me taxidermists I mean. Only Taxidermist I know of other than heading to Seattle or that sides is like 170 miles away. That doesn't mean their taxidermists it just means they take the time to utilise the internet. Heck there are a few on here that advertise, and heck theres enough information on here that one can get if they search this site hard enough they can do their own too, that's not the point. thepoint is other than youtube and other such sites there are not a lot of Taxidermists around any more. Maybe in your neck of the woods but not near me. there used to be one close by but he closed. So now If I want taxidermist done and not wanting to troll youtube for hours i'd have to drive 170 miles at least.Didn't say there aren't good ones, but I have been reading on different forumns how they got screwed on Elk, and other game meats. They do kind of corner it nowdays for it is a dying business. Theres only one or two near us, and only one that will take game meat, the other wont even touch it. The on I liked he died and went out of business his son klled himself so ya aint no one to take his business anymore. he actually only did it for us because he knew us, but he'd quit doing game meat years before. So yes they do! Seems like I see at least one, or two on here every year. The other forum I've been going to just had one where he was missing meat, and just like this was more likely not his elk he'd braught in. Meaning he the butcher mixed his meat with others etc...Been reading about bad butcher care a lot these days. Do these people know they corner the market so they don't care anymore or what? Hope if asked your Pming people who this guy is so they don't have that same mistake in the future. hate that since htis is a dying breed and art cutting and and wrapping, and butchering game meat people think they can just mess with people like this. This sucks. >:(
I don't see how Butchers have a corner on the market?
There are several good butchers out there. The one I use I have never had issue with. I have not heard any bad reviews from the people I have sent to him.
So yes it's a dying bread much like Taxidermists not a lot of call for them as it used to be, or ferriers (people that show horses) Not a huge demand for them either only in selective markets. Obviously on the Wet side and over there there may be a few more than here, but most here will only do cow and pig and rarlely sheep, htey don't even touch game meat anymore. If I dont use the guy down the street from me I'd have to drive well over 50-60 miles out of my way to get one that actually does game meat.
There are quite a few Butchers around me. Just off the top of my head I can think of Stewarts, Heritage, Western, Beef Shop, Littlerock, and a few I can't think of the names of but are fairly local. That the slaughter trucks will deliver to from my location. Not as many people raising and slaughtering beef for themselves since you can buy it in the store.
There are actually more Licensed Taxidermists today then there was 20 years ago. Now a days anyone with a computer and access to YouTube can watch a few videos, thrown a set of eyes and a skin on a manikin and call themselves a Taxidermist.
Your area may not support a Full time Taxidermist. But I guarantee you there are more taxidermists today by far then there was 20 years ago. I have a lot of friends in the business in many states some have been doing this 4x longer than I have and they will say the same thing. We get into this discussion a couple times a year.
Please don't tell me you believe everything you hear on TV.
The reason they say Taxidermy is a dying art is because the market has become so advanced that pretty much anyone that gets ahold of a few taxidermy videos or you-tube videos can put a pair of eyes on a form with a cape and they call themselves a Taxidermist. Taxidermy Suppliers have come up with detailed inner noses, jawsets, pre made earliners, preset eyes already installed in forms, etc. It makes it easy for people to get started.
It's when you get into doing Life Size, African, and Specialty poses where there are no forms you find out who the real taxidermists are.
Taxidermy is a dying art because it wasn't to long ago they were still making there own forms out of the real skull and paper mache with lead earliners. Take a guess as to how many taxidermists can or could do that today? Back then if you wanted an open mouth anything they used the real jaws and teeth. Some lifesize were actually the entire cleaned skeleton wrapped and the skin mounted over.
Yes I would agree that "Real Taxidermy" is a dying art. As far as the number of Taxidermists today? No, there are more Taxidermists today then there was 20 years ago.
Post by: csaaphill on January 21, 2015, 10:20:46 PM
hopefully this will spur him to process his own meat in the future:yeah: if possible
The drive alone would for me...not to include the cost of gas could bought something to start processing
Post by: jnutzalot on January 22, 2015, 10:51:51 AM
Now comes the part to see if he follows through.
Post by: h20hunter on January 22, 2015, 10:55:37 AM
Post by: Band on January 22, 2015, 10:55:57 AM
The butcher called me back today. He agreed that they were at fault. He also agreed to replace my meat with Farm Elk. We agreed on 92 pounds of rounds and burger, and 40 lbs of tenderloins and backstrap. He stated he would be docking the pay from the employee that mishandled the meat and apologized.Wow, good for you! And good for him for admitting his mistake and working to correct a grievous error. :tup:
Now comes the part to see if he follows through.
Hopefully he uses this experience to make a correction to his business practice so it doesn't happen again.
Post by: jnutzalot on January 22, 2015, 10:59:26 AM
Post by: jnutzalot on January 22, 2015, 11:03:17 AM
Yea, he said the employee didnt follow procedures for removing the meat from the game bags and examining the meat with the customer, and improperly storing the meat in the game bags. He also stated it should have never taken that long to receive the meat.The butcher called me back today. He agreed that they were at fault. He also agreed to replace my meat with Farm Elk. We agreed on 92 pounds of rounds and burger, and 40 lbs of tenderloins and backstrap. He stated he would be docking the pay from the employee that mishandled the meat and apologized.Wow, good for you! And good for him for admitting his mistake and working to correct a grievous error. :tup:
Now comes the part to see if he follows through.
Hopefully he uses this experience to make a correction to his business practice so it doesn't happen again.
Post by: bobcat on January 22, 2015, 11:16:37 AM
Post by: Kuduman on January 22, 2015, 11:18:46 AM
Post by: grundy53 on January 22, 2015, 11:27:57 AM
Post by: KFhunter on January 22, 2015, 11:29:05 AM
The butcher called me back today. He agreed that they were at fault. He also agreed to replace my meat with Farm Elk. We agreed on 92 pounds of rounds and burger, and 40 lbs of tenderloins and backstrap. He stated he would be docking the pay from the employee that mishandled the meat and apologized.
Now comes the part to see if he follows through.
If this butcher follows through and makes amends I wouldn't release his name/business. Good on you for the way you've handled this.
Post by: jnutzalot on January 22, 2015, 11:33:48 AM
I definitely will NOT release the business name IF they follow through. Despite not calling me back promptly the first couple days, the manager has been polite and ultimately honest throughout the ordeal. The follow through phase is critical though...The butcher called me back today. He agreed that they were at fault. He also agreed to replace my meat with Farm Elk. We agreed on 92 pounds of rounds and burger, and 40 lbs of tenderloins and backstrap. He stated he would be docking the pay from the employee that mishandled the meat and apologized.
Now comes the part to see if he follows through.
If this butcher follows through and makes amends I wouldn't release his name/business. Good on you for the way you've handled this.
Post by: jackelope on January 22, 2015, 11:34:15 AM
The butcher called me back today. He agreed that they were at fault. He also agreed to replace my meat with Farm Elk. We agreed on 92 pounds of rounds and burger, and 40 lbs of tenderloins and backstrap. He stated he would be docking the pay from the employee that mishandled the meat and apologized.
Now comes the part to see if he follows through.
If this butcher follows through and makes amends I wouldn't release his name/business. Good on you for the way you've handled this.
Agreed. Stuff happens....that's a fact. It's part of being human and dealing with customers.
It's how it is handled after the fact that makes the difference between good and bad business.
Glad to hear you're getting this addressed.
Post by: Tbob on January 22, 2015, 12:12:49 PM
Post by: jrebel on January 22, 2015, 12:16:56 PM
Post by: BULLBLASTER on January 22, 2015, 12:18:21 PM
Post by: bobcat on January 22, 2015, 12:27:42 PM
In this case i wouldnt feel it to be inappropriate to ask to see the invoice from where he buys the farm elk meat from. Just to prove to you it is what he claims it is. Glad he is stepping up!
:yeah: Otherwise, how do you know you're not getting a poached elk? If he's buying 132 pounds of game farm elk meat, that will be very expensive. I'm a little suspicious that he agreed to that.
Post by: whacker1 on January 22, 2015, 12:32:41 PM
If anyone could name some of the local farms (I can't imagine there are that many) that would be helpful so I can verify I'm getting legitimate Farm Elk meat.
I don't believe there are any local game farms in WA......Not legal if i recall.
Idaho is the nearest I am familiar with.
Post by: Kuduman on January 22, 2015, 12:55:52 PM
I would call one and place an order and have the invoice sent to the butcher for payment. Of course I would clear this with the butcher before hand.
curious to see what happens.
I had a friend go to Minnesota and kill a farm raised elk... be prepared for some of the best tasting elk you have ever had :EAT:
Post by: Michelle_Nelson on January 22, 2015, 01:09:08 PM
Post by: KFhunter on January 22, 2015, 01:18:56 PM
The Butcher may know the owner of a farm that sells Elk Meat. He is probably getting it for a wholesale price.
Possibly, but that's the butchers' business the consumer doesn't need to know that. (not really addressing you Michelle as you know this, I'm talking to the guys who posted just before you did)
Don't order meat on your own, let the butcher have the opportunity to make things right himself no need in jacking up the success the OP's getting thus far.
give the processor every opportunity make amends.
Post by: KFhunter on January 22, 2015, 01:21:29 PM
In this case i wouldnt feel it to be inappropriate to ask to see the invoice from where he buys the farm elk meat from. Just to prove to you it is what he claims it is. Glad he is stepping up!
:yeah: Otherwise, how do you know you're not getting a poached elk? If he's buying 132 pounds of game farm elk meat, that will be very expensive. I'm a little suspicious that he agreed to that.
OP already stated he was demanding to know the source of the replacement meat.
If anyone could name some of the local farms (I can't imagine there are that many) that would be helpful so I can verify I'm getting legitimate Farm Elk meat.
Post by: Curly on January 22, 2015, 01:26:23 PM
:o
:peep:
Post by: bobcat on January 22, 2015, 01:29:27 PM
Post by: h20hunter on January 22, 2015, 01:33:07 PM
Post by: BULLBLASTER on January 22, 2015, 01:44:18 PM
As long as it isn't someone elses elk!!!!!!:yeah: although this time of year that may be more difficult than in fall.
Post by: h20hunter on January 22, 2015, 02:00:20 PM
Sounds like he is on the road to getting taken care of.
Post by: Curly on January 22, 2015, 02:07:36 PM
Hopefully this experience and telling of it on here will encourage more people to just learn how to butcher their own game. :twocents:
Post by: jnutzalot on January 22, 2015, 02:10:12 PM
I do business with various suppliers & vendors in my line of work and I've never withheld the names of those suppliers or vendors when asked by my customer. That information is not privy it just part of doing business.
Post by: KFhunter on January 22, 2015, 06:50:35 PM
If I were someone that used the services of a butcher, I'd want to know the name of the shop so as not to patronize them. Luckily I don't use butchers so it won't affect me. Sure it sounds like he is getting things taken care of, but I do think it would be nice for fellow Hunt-Wa members to know who not to take their game to. If it were me, I'd be telling people the name of the butcher after I got the agreed upon elk meat. The butcher is doing the right thing now, but not one part of the story would make me recommend that butcher shop to anyone.
Hopefully this experience and telling of it on here will encourage more people to just learn how to butcher their own game. :twocents:
That removes all leverage from HW threads like these that pop up from time to time, if folks are going to dime out business owner anyways what use is it to make things right? All business have issues pop up, how they handle them is the key.
Post by: BNAElkhntr on January 22, 2015, 07:08:30 PM
In this case i wouldnt feel it to be inappropriate to ask to see the invoice from where he buys the farm elk meat from. Just to prove to you it is what he claims it is. Glad he is stepping up!
[/quote :yeah: Absolutely
Post by: dscubame on January 23, 2015, 06:44:22 PM
The butcher called me back today. He agreed that they were at fault. He also agreed to replace my meat with Farm Elk. We agreed on 92 pounds of rounds and burger, and 40 lbs of tenderloins and backstrap. He stated he would be docking the pay from the employee that mishandled the meat and apologized.
Now comes the part to see if he follows through.
If this butcher follows through and makes amends I wouldn't release his name/business. Good on you for the way you've handled this.
Agreed. Stuff happens....that's a fact. It's part of being human and dealing with customers.
It's how it is handled after the fact that makes the difference between good and bad business.
Glad to hear you're getting this addressed.
100% :tup:
Post by: dscubame on January 23, 2015, 06:45:30 PM
The Butcher may know the owner of a farm that sells Elk Meat. He is probably getting it for a wholesale price.
Or not.
Post by: Bean Counter on January 23, 2015, 06:52:00 PM
Maybe the butcher knows a tribal member that can get him a line on some elk meat. ;)
:lol4:
Post by: Bob33 on January 23, 2015, 07:04:51 PM
I don't think it's unfair to ask where the Farm Meat is coming from. Things have not been on the up & up thus far.If he says "I've told you everything I know".... ;)
Post by: JimmyHoffa on January 23, 2015, 07:15:26 PM
Straight from theMaybe the butcher knows a tribal member that can get him a line on some elk meat. ;)
:lol4:
Post by: family hunter on January 24, 2015, 07:42:52 PM
my question to u is how do you only get 190 lbs with the bone in that was a good bull you should have had a bit more than that and a min go 200 in yer freezer
Post by: kevinlisa06 on January 25, 2015, 12:22:19 PM
Post by: syoungs on February 15, 2015, 09:26:52 PM