Master hunter enrollment suspended!

[Dan-o]

Do tell.

[Tbar]

I will reference a damage hunt in the nooksack herd on ag lands. This hunt has went from being moderately successful to a complete failure due to the fact that it has become a MH hunt.
 This area has had damage concerns for 30+ years. The last 10+ it has become increasingly successful by individual hunters putting their time in and building relationships with landowners. The hunters would secure permission and then contact the wdfw for damage tags. This turned into a pretty hardcore group of archers that would put a ton (30+) days hazing and hunting each. (several of these guys are on here)  This worked out well relatively speaking keeping the elk out of the ag lands from september until march, most if not all of these guys would haze elk with little notice. The elk became very weary of human interaction, they would bolt at the sight of a truck (not farm equipment). Thus making the archery hunt very challenging to say the very least. At the conclusion of the archery portion of the hunt the tags were turned over to the landowner to distribute as he saw fit. This system was working very well and resulted in (1) several hundred hours of free hazing (2) opportunity for guys directly linked to the landowners, who earned site specific access and permission, to hunt an extended season (3) achieved herd reduction at levels approved by the bios and directors (4) this core group had zero complaints (to my knowledge) from the surrounding community, most if the hunters are community members.
 This year (2012) it switched to a MH hunt. It went from a archery/mf hunt, with the lions share going to archers, to a short range firearm season. I documented 50+ days where the elk never left the ag fields. They did roam from farm to farm but stayed in the kill zones the entire time. I watched on 4 separate occasions where MHs pulled in, drove the visible portions and left. There are several hidden fields that they never accessed (during my observation). During this time the elk became tame, on several occasions we were within 25 yards of calm (yet alert) elk within the kill zone and with no cover. The elk would seemingly pattern the mhs and come out mid morning and mid day.
Now to the actual harvest by a master hunter (who is a member on here). We were watching the elk as we did every morning and a black truck pulls barely off the state highway, uses his door as a rest and shoots an elk with a scoped pistol. I leave knowing it's a mh (i knew the truck). I then receive 2 different phone calls from the school bus asking who shot the elk. Yes if it was the eagle festival us as hunters would have received another black eye(imo).
Now I don't find fault with the bios or the coordinater(he it's spread way too thin), I think the program has many inherent flaws. I also know several "master hunters", some if which could put me to shame, but most couldn't out hunt my 13 year old daughter. Some have even stated to me their motivation to be in the program is their inability to find successful harvests when hunting with the masses.
I know this is a somewhat isolated case and may or may not be representative of the entire program, it's a scenario that plays out and is not unique to this specific hunt .

[Dan-o]

Wow.

that's a bummer for the archers who lost that opportunity.

It's always tough when something like that gets taken away.

[Tbar]

On the day the elk was harvested there was 40+ elk in the same field feeding less than 2 hours after he gutted the animal around the gut pile. This fact alone tells me that this specific mh hunt was very, very ineffective.

[Kowsrule30]

I'm a MH and I've never drawn a tag but once.... (which most are bs anyways) Then I was never called on a needed basis to try and fill the tag at the land owners discretion.... I was # 2 on the list.. (so I was told) The main benefit I've had is some seasons around where I elk hunt have a second tag option for antlerless.... Dad and I sometimes get 4 elk in a year... Those are good years...

[Bob33]

Wow.

that's a bummer for the archers who lost that opportunity.

It's always tough when something like that gets taken away.

As I recall the archers made international news with images on television of elk running around trying to escape and across highways with arrows sticking out. Talk about a black eye.

[Dan-o]

Wow.

that's a bummer for the archers who lost that opportunity.

It's always tough when something like that gets taken away.

As I recall the archers made international news with images on television of elk running around trying to escape and across highways with arrows sticking out. Talk about a black eye.

I remember those pics.    It was a fiasco.

but I also was personally involved in a similar fiasco in the Wenas probably 15-20 years ago.   Nothing I did on purpose, but about 40 elk ended up trapped and slaughtered by way too many guys.   

[Tbar]

Wow.

that's a bummer for the archers who lost that opportunity.

It's always tough when something like that gets taken away.

As I recall the archers made international news with images on television of elk running around trying to escape and across highways with arrows sticking out. Talk about a black eye.

   Thats is why I said another black eye.

[Bob33]

"...pulls barely off the state highway, uses his door as a rest and shoots an elk with a scoped pistol."

What's the point here?

[jstone]

Don't need it. I would rather make the hunts draws for kids, handicapped, disabled vets. MH program in my opinion doesn't make you any better.

[Tbar]

"...pulls barely off the state highway, uses his door as a rest and shoots an elk with a scoped pistol."

What's the point here?

This exact thing was the #1 complaint when the Skagit river hunt was muzzy hunt. Then the archery fiasco. This would paint hunters in general in a bad light. Shooting on the road side of a fence at a pregnant cow then gutting it in plain view of a state highway not dragging it out of view (which was possible). We as hunters were just lucky it was only witnessed by community members who are educated on the big picture and somewhat understanding of the management side of things. This just appeared to be poor judgement for a pr perspective.

[Bob33]

"...pulls barely off the state highway, uses his door as a rest and shoots an elk with a scoped pistol."

What's the point here?

This exact thing was the #1 complaint when the Skagit river hunt was muzzy hunt. Then the archery fiasco. This would paint hunters in general in a bad light. Shooting on the road side of a fence at a pregnant cow then gutting it in plain view of a state highway not dragging it out of view (which was possible). We as hunters were just lucky it was only witnessed by community members who are educated on the big picture and somewhat understanding of the management side of things. This just appeared to be poor judgement for a pr perspective.

I agree with that.

[Tbar]

Don't need it. I would rather make the hunts draws for kids, handicapped, disabled vets. MH program in my opinion doesn't make you any better.

I would have to disagree here too. These hunts are too complicated to allow youth. I think in that case they are better in the mh program. The hunts get very complex and are not a scene to teach kids how to "hunt" imo.