G20 Did I get a lemon? **update** Fixed!!

[HuntandFish]

Ok, so I posted awhile back about having an issue with my g20 not cycling heavier rounds ( underwood or buffalo bore). It was my thought and several of yours that a heavier spring would solve this issue. So I order up a lone wolf 22lb spring and steel guide rod and install it. And I finally got out to shoot it this last weekend with some of my new underwood 200 gr ammo and a whole variety of other stuff. The only thing that would cycle was American eagle factory stuff!!! Everything else was FTL nearly every round. In fact the problem only has gotten worse!!!! Most all the failures were pushing the round half way out of the magazine which would require me to rack the slide in order to fire the next round. About 20% of the failures would be stove pipe or loading the round into the chamber but not far enough to lock it up?

At this point I am about to buy another g20 and see if I got a lemon, unles you all have some suggestions? I M really sure it is not me limpwristing or a bad grip, as I played around with every grip configuration in the book!

I am frustrated to say the least! Any help would be appreciated!

Thanks,
H&F

[CoyoteChuck52]

factory barrel or after market?

[HuntandFish]

Factory, everything is stock.

[CoyoteChuck52]

sent you a PM

[Jburke]

Get ahold of Glock directly.  If they have any kind of customer service they should be able to help you out. 

[high country]

Get a col measurement on th ammo....post it up.

[Fl0und3rz]

Where are you located?  I might be able to let you borrow a slide/barrel or meet you at the range to try another G20 (SF) with the ammo you are using.  I have the stock spring as well as a set of springs from a Wolff tuning kit and a stainless guide rod in it right now.

[Huntboy]

Is the ammo your having issues with jacketed or solid lead.

[splitshot]

  just another reason i wont buy a glock.  smith,colt and springfield all the way.  mike w

[NW-GSP]

  just another reason i wont buy a glock.  smith,colt and springfield all the way.  mike w

Cause glock is known for being unreliable huh  .

It could be something very simple.

[JLS]

Is it doing it with all three mags or just one in particular?  You shouldn't be shooting lead ammo from a Glock barrel, hopefully you aren't.

I would call Glock and talk to them.  I am wondering if the feed lips on a magazine are out of spec.

I have watched literally hundreds of Glocks perform through thousands of rounds without any malfunctions.

[HuntandFish]

Thanks for the replies everyone!

I think I have ruled out the ammo as the culprit, as underwood 180 gr. xtp's, 200gr. Xtp's, and buffalo bores 220 hard cast all malfunction the same. But I will work on getting my hands on some micrometers and getting a col number for you guys to verify.

I am going to call glock this week and see what they have to say?

FLOund3rz, I would absolutely love to take you up on your offer if you are in my area? I think this would immediately diagnose the issue. I live in the Bothell area?

I have been doing some research and it looks like magazine springs are the next best bet to fix the issue, I am going to order up some wolf +10% springs.

The malfunction is so bad I have a feeling it is a combination of things, ughhh. 

Thanks for the help everyone, I will keep this updated as I work through this issue. I do hate it when a gun is not reliable, it kinda makes me want to fix it and go buy another one!

Thanks,
H&F

[NW-GSP]

Thanks for the replies everyone!

I think I have ruled out the ammo as the culprit, as underwood 180 gr. xtp's, 200gr. Xtp's, and buffalo bores 220 hard cast all malfunction the same. But I will work on getting my hands on some micrometers and getting a col number for you guys to verify.

I am going to call glock this week and see what they have to say?

FLOund3rz, I would absolutely love to take you up on your offer if you are in my area? I think this would immediately diagnose the issue. I live in the Bothell area?

I have been doing some research and it looks like magazine springs are the next best bet to fix the issue, I am going to order up some wolf +10% springs.

The malfunction is so bad I have a feeling it is a combination of things, ughhh. 

Thanks for the help everyone, I will keep this updated as I work through this issue. I do hate it when a gun is not reliable, it kinda makes me want to fix it and go buy another one!

Thanks,
H&F

Are you shooting the hard cast buffalo bore out if the stock barrel?
If so they are not made to shoot lead, you may be having feed issues do to built up lead in that barrel.

[Smossy]

mmm lemons.

[jackelope]

  just another reason i wont buy a glock.  smith,colt and springfield all the way.  mike w

Cause glock is known for being unreliable huh  .

It could be something very simple.

And because those other ones never have issues?


Right...
Smith with issue:
http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,125926.0/topicseen.html

[Fisherdave10]

I have the feeling your issue is more magazine related.  Increased slide velocity from heavy loads and a sluggish magazine follower/spring combination is going to lead to a failure to load. 

A heavier recoil spring will slow the rearward slide movement, but it might also increase the forward slide return speed, which would only worsen the issue.

I recommend disassembling your magazine and giving your follower a good look-over.  Look for burrs and deformities.  Look for the same thing inside the magazine body too.

[JLS]

I believe the ammo manufacturers recommend a stronger magazine spring for those hot loads, but I could be wrong. 

[HuntandFish]

Ok so I ordered new +10% mag springs, and just cause the stock recoil spring seemed to make a little to much noise when actioned, and to cover my bases I ordered a new stock recoil spring.

I shot today with zero malfunctions!! Which is a steep improvement over every single round an FTF. So I replaced one mag with the new springs and one I kept stock, both fired flawlessly. So that means it was the original spring that came with the gun causing the FTF!!

So for those of you battling a g20 FTF issue as I know there are many out there, this seemed to be the issue, maybe they had a bad batch of springs?

Anyway there is the update!

Thanks,
H&F

[HuntandFish]

Also I have shot lead in my stock glock barrel, it's a non issue as long as you keep the round count low. I shoot one clip to ensure the ammo hits where I expect it , than carry the 220 grain hard cast in the field for bear medicine. And plan on not shooting anymore unless I need it.

Thanks,
H&F

[NW-GSP]

How woul you rate the difference in recoil in the American eagle to the buffalo bore?

[HuntandFish]

How woul you rate the difference in recoil in the American eagle to the buffalo bore?

How woul you rate the difference in recoil in the American eagle to the buffalo bore?

How woul you rate the difference in recoil in the American eagle to the buffalo bore?

American eagle is pathetic stuff! It kicks less than a .40 does with a little less pop to the recoil. Which is do to the weight of the g20, IMHO. Buffalo bore is the real deal for sure and does really have a substantial kick (at least double or more the kick of AE stuff), when comparing to other semi autos. But overall non of the full power stuff is un-manageable. In fact I pretty much only shoot the full power stuff ( and enjoy it ), and why wouldn't I when a box of AE is 38.00 bucks anyway....

Regards,
H&F

[NW-GSP]

I don't blame you. I reload for my g20 but have not tried buffalo bore yet

[KFhunter]

I would replace the stock barrel ASAP - I've got a lone wolf barrel but there are others as well.

Also I *think* I'm running a 24lb recoil spring and it shoots well, it's too stiff for low power loads but the full power stuff it's great.


I think your problem was too weak of a recoil spring, allowing that slide to cycle too violently.

http://www.lonewolfdist.com/Detail.aspx?PROD=943&CAT=238


http://www.lonewolfdist.com/Detail.aspx?PROD=234975&CAT=265

[HuntandFish]

KFhunter,

I have no plans on changing out the barrel. The only reason you need to change out your barrel is if you plan on shooting allot of lead bullets, or you reload and do not want the glock smiles on all your brass. I do neither and only plan on shooting hardcast in the 220 underwood or buffalo bore when out in field if such a scenario arises, but that being said I am leaning towards shooting the underwood 200xtp exclusively from now on, both for practice and carry.

Also I did change out my recoil spring to a wolf 22# spring and steel guide rod, it actually made the problem worse....(I think I needed the +10% mag springs with it?) But when I installed the new factory (17# I believe) recoil spring it solved the issue   at least for now.

I appreciate your comments though, and I am sure I will eventually get a 6" barrel for the gun just for the fun of it.

Regards,
H&F

[KFhunter]

I've had good luck thus far with the underwood ammo.

I've heard the aftermarket barrels will be a bit more accurite but I haven't tested that theory yet, the factory barrel with underwood wasn't too bad.
I'm running a LW stock length barrel now but haven't had the chance to run a few through it.  I intend to reload so it wasn't really an option for me.