more caribou lawsuits...

[pianoman9701]

They haven't killed many in the caribou recovery area and they I don't think they have killed any in the specific area that holds caribou.  Hunters are not supporting caribou recovery- financially, politically, or by hunting wolves

Hunters? We're not allowed to hunt wolves and you're wrong about us not supporting caribou financially or politically. Do you think it's tree-hugger money being spent on the caribou program? Because, it's not. It's USFWS using PR funds.

[WAcoyotehunter]

You're right about there being some funding from USFWS, but I do not know how much, if any is PR money.  Its likely from the recovery pool of funding. 

BC government, tribes, and state of Idaho are spending quite a bit of money, but advise from some license dollars there is no actual hunter support. 

There are no hunting groups politically supporting it, there are few individual hunters supporting recovery through.  I think that's unfortunate.  Its likely due to the idea that protected land or species are useless to the hunting community. 

[Special T]

Lets also point out that its bunny huggers that were trying to reduce the ability for hunters and trapper to access that area via snow machine when wolves are most vulnerable. And it was the sportmens that fought them on it... at least in ID...

[Elkaholic daWg]

 

[WAcoyotehunter]

Remember that country is also winter habitat for caribou.  We don't allow people to run through mule deer and elk winter range, we shouldn't for caribou either.  I understand your argument, but its not valid in that area.  Wolves can be hunted in most of that area in the winter, just not in the very high areas on snowmobile.

[luvmystang67]

Remember that country is also winter habitat for caribou.  We don't allow people to run through mule deer and elk winter range, we shouldn't for caribou either.  I understand your argument, but its not valid in that area.  Wolves can be hunted in most of that area in the winter, just not in the very high areas on snowmobile.

Don't worry, the wolves will only be in that area until the food is gone anyway.  With 15 left in the herd, the wolves should be out of the area within a few years.

[Special T]

Remember that country is also winter habitat for caribou.  We don't allow people to run through mule deer and elk winter range, we shouldn't for caribou either.  I understand your argument, but its not valid in that area.  Wolves can be hunted in most of that area in the winter, just not in the very high areas on snowmobile.

Your argument is circular in logic. Hunters arent doing anything to help caribou. They cant shoot or trap them in them in Wa. In ID they have shot and trapped them (or attempted to). Hunters have pushed to open hunting in the NE portion of the state. Gov on the other hand has done everything in its power to prevent the taking of wolves. They Keep an area closed despite the fact that the ESA does not apply to the NE. They restrict travel in it (snow mobiles).

How is it that hunters dont help caribou? If its because they are EXTREMELY skeptical of some state or federal program Id say its justified...  You still havent given the solution that Hunters have passed over.

[WAcoyotehunter]

There isn't an easy solution.  Caribou need predators removed (wolves primarily) and hunters generally support the idea, but have not taken any from the area, or given funding for pointed removals. 

If a hunting group wanted to help caribou they could do a few things: 

Strongly support an aggressive wolf collaring effort in the region.  That means support through $, not facebook petitions or other lip service. 

Support the closures in the portion of the caribou habitat that need the protection and make a meaningful argument for re opening the areas that are unlikely to have caribou activity.  This means we need to be willing to "throw the book" at offenders. 

Logging and habitat protections are in place.  We should continue to protect the habitat while maintaining industry. 

Make meaningful noise (not on HuntWa....make noise to legislators and top brass) regarding wolf densities in the caribou recovery portion of NE Washington.  Again, we need to find funding to support some actual work.  Conservation groups are good at putting some money on the ground to get research they need to support their position.  Hunters have not done that at all. (since the 1980's anyway).

Those are some pretty easy starting points for hunters to engage in a more meaningful way. 

[bearpaw]

I will point out that there are hunters/trappers I know of that are hunting wolves in the Priest lake area.

But, I'm sorry, how can hunters help take wolves if access is removed in N Idaho and if we can't even hunt them in WA. Lack of access is the reason wolves are untouched by hunters in the caribou area of N Idaho, they can't get to them. Quit trying to take away all the access if you want help for caribou!

During the wolf plan process I wrote numerous letters regarding the damage wolves would do to caribou and they all fell on deaf ears because all the promoters of wolves really didn't care about caribou. If you want to point fingers at least point them in the right direction.... Olympia and wolf groups!

Those are the people who did nothing to help caribou and did everything to hurt caribou.

[buglebrush]

I will point out that there are hunters/trappers I know of that are hunting wolves in the Priest lake area.

But, I'm sorry, how can hunters help take wolves if access is removed in N Idaho and if we can't even hunt them in WA. Lack of access is the reason wolves are untouched by hunters in the caribou area of N Idaho, they can't get to them. Quit trying to take away all the access if you want help for caribou!

During the wolf plan process I wrote numerous letters regarding the damage wolves would do to caribou and they all fell on deaf ears because all the promoters of wolves really didn't care about caribou. If you want to point fingers at least point them in the right direction.... Olympia and wolf groups!

Those are the people who did nothing to help caribou and did everything to hurt caribou.

Totally agree. 

[Special T]

If a hunting group wanted to help caribou they could do a few things: 

Strongly support an aggressive wolf collaring effort in the region.  That means support through $, not facebook petitions or other lip service. 
 

Make meaningful noise (not on HuntWa....make noise to legislators and top brass) regarding wolf densities in the caribou recovery portion of NE Washington.  Again, we need to find funding to support some actual work.  Conservation groups are good at putting some money on the ground to get research they need to support their position.  Hunters have not done that at all. (since the 1980's anyway).

The only way I would Open My wallet is to give $ to hire an experienced wolf trapper not a WDFW Biologist. The department has already determined that this option isnt PC so its not possible. I do not trust the WDFW's agenda on wolves so I will not give them any extra $ for it if they control it. It is tactical political maneuvering to say that more money is needed yet decline the largest pool of cash available, that cattlemen association willingness to hire at THIER expense an experienced trapper and a WDFW bio could ride along to collar and take samples... (because they dont think they trust or can train a trapper to weigh take pictures and get a hair/blood sample)

[WAcoyotehunter]

I will point out that there are hunters/trappers I know of that are hunting wolves in the Priest lake area.

But, I'm sorry, how can hunters help take wolves if access is removed in N Idaho and if we can't even hunt them in WA. Lack of access is the reason wolves are untouched by hunters in the caribou area of N Idaho, they can't get to them. Quit trying to take away all the access if you want help for caribou!

During the wolf plan process I wrote numerous letters regarding the damage wolves would do to caribou and they all fell on deaf ears because all the promoters of wolves really didn't care about caribou. If you want to point fingers at least point them in the right direction.... Olympia and wolf groups!

Those are the people who did nothing to help caribou and did everything to hurt caribou.

I know there are trappers and hunters working the PL area.  A very good friend of mine has taken six wolves this year, but they are not in the caribou recovery area.  That area is too far up for most people to be interested in trapping.  The issue with access is not having much of an impact on sportsman.  The closure area is designed to minimize snowmobile play areas in the cirques that caribou use.  That plan is being addressed soon and will be more practical south of the border.

You're right about some of the conservation groups not having helped much either.  There are some groups doing very meaningful projects in Canada, but not many here, aside from lip service and activism.  Hunters have not even engaged at that level.  That's why I am frustrated with the lack of hunter support.  As a group, we have not engaged in the plan to support a caribou population.

[bearpaw]

I will point out that there are hunters/trappers I know of that are hunting wolves in the Priest lake area.

But, I'm sorry, how can hunters help take wolves if access is removed in N Idaho and if we can't even hunt them in WA. Lack of access is the reason wolves are untouched by hunters in the caribou area of N Idaho, they can't get to them. Quit trying to take away all the access if you want help for caribou!

During the wolf plan process I wrote numerous letters regarding the damage wolves would do to caribou and they all fell on deaf ears because all the promoters of wolves really didn't care about caribou. If you want to point fingers at least point them in the right direction.... Olympia and wolf groups!

Those are the people who did nothing to help caribou and did everything to hurt caribou.

I know there are trappers and hunters working the PL area.  A very good friend of mine has taken six wolves this year, but they are not in the caribou recovery area.  That area is too far up for most people to be interested in trapping.  The issue with access is not having much of an impact on sportsman.  The closure area is designed to minimize snowmobile play areas in the cirques that caribou use.  That plan is being addressed soon and will be more practical south of the border.

You're right about some of the conservation groups not having helped much either.  There are some groups doing very meaningful projects in Canada, but not many here, aside from lip service and activism.  Hunters have not even engaged at that level.  That's why I am frustrated with the lack of hunter support.  As a group, we have not engaged in the plan to support a caribou population.

Quite frankly the Wildlife Commission turned their nose away from Caribou. The problem lies with WDFW!

Most hunters I know support having caribou, but we are frustrated with WDFW and the Commission regarding their outright avoidance of addressing wolf impacts on caribou. If you want to see some help for caribou I think you need to address WDFW. Their love affair with wolves is the problem, change must happen there first!