WOLVES – Nature’s Sanitizers?

[wolfbait]

WOLVES – Nature’s Sanitizers?

https://oldmanoftheski.com/2013/02/01/1051/

[jackmaster]

I could see letting wolves fix the hoof rot problem as long as they were all killed aftewards, but other than that they have no place in the lower 48s ecosystem!!! Biologist for the most part are just tree hugging, leaf licking , bunny strapping, liberals anyways, 100% one sided !!!

[KFhunter]

I liked this blurb about WW1

https://owlcation.com/humanities/WW1-Russian-Wolves-Business-As-Usual-and-War-Horses

Russian Wolves

In the winter of 1916-1917, the Eastern Front stretched for more than a thousand miles from the Baltic Sea in the north to the Black Sea in the south. During that winter, half-starved Russian wolves converged on both the German and Russian lines in the northern part of the front in the Vilnius-Minsk region. As their desperation increased beyond their fear of humans, the wolves started attacking individuals but were soon attacking groups of soldiers so viciously and often that something had to be done. The soldiers tried poisoning them, shooting them with their rifles and machine guns and even using grenades against them, but the large and powerful Russian wolves were so hungry, fresh wolf packs simply replaced those that were killed.

The situation grew so severe that the Russian and German soldiers convinced their commanders to allow temporary truce negotiations to enable them to deal with the animals more effectively. Once the terms were worked out, the fighting stopped and the two sides discussed how to resolve the situation. Finally, a coordinated effort was made and gradually the packs were rounded up. Hundreds of wolves were killed during the process while the rest scattered, leaving the area once and for all to the humans. The problem was solved, the truce was called off and the soldiers got back to killing each other properly.

[Old Man8383]

I think the notion that wolves will somehow "clean up" the hoof rot problem in elk do not understand the nature of hoof rot.  Once an animal with hoof rot has used an area spores of the bacteria are shed into the soil.  These spores are long lived and can infect uninfected animals.  Infection is not from animal to animal, but from soil to animal.  Though theoretically wolves might be able to kill infected animals before they can travel to new areas spreading the disease; it will not stop the disease in those areas already infected.  I suspect that elk in the early stages of the infection will be able to evade wolves and still shed the spores.  With the already low reproductive rates of Roosevelt in Western Washington, when wolves come to Western Washington; should they thrive; elk numbers will decline dramatically and fairly quickly.  Under these conditions it's very hard to imagine elk numbers ever increasing back to the high numbers of just a few decades  ago.

[jackmaster]

Did not know that old man 8383 thank you !! Do you know how long those spores can live in the dirt without a host?? I don't know much about it and don't want to get off topic but I have heard this is caused by the chemicals they use to spray with? I know it has killed off the grouse population and has now caused serious issues with the elk!! Do any of you know if the deer are affected by hoof rott or affected by those spores I should say?? Where are the liberals protesting the use of spray at !!! That a great story on those Russian wolves, that's just crazy..

[garrett89]

Did not know that old man 8383 thank you !! Do you know how long those spores can live in the dirt without a host?? I don't know much about it and don't want to get off topic but I have heard this is caused by the chemicals they use to spray with? I know it has killed off the grouse population and has now caused serious issues with the elk!! Do any of you know if the deer are affected by hoof rott or affected by those spores I should say?? Where are the liberals protesting the use of spray at !!! That a great story on those Russian wolves, that's just crazy..

From the way they make it sound it should spread to any hoofed animal. Haven't heard any reports on other animals though. So, one can think it is something that may only effect only elk or specific groups. Anyone heard reports on other animals?

[KFhunter]

Did not know that old man 8383 thank you !! Do you know how long those spores can live in the dirt without a host?? I don't know much about it and don't want to get off topic but I have heard this is caused by the chemicals they use to spray with? I know it has killed off the grouse population and has now caused serious issues with the elk!! Do any of you know if the deer are affected by hoof rott or affected by those spores I should say?? Where are the liberals protesting the use of spray at !!! That a great story on those Russian wolves, that's just crazy..

From the way they make it sound it should spread to any hoofed animal. Haven't heard any reports on other animals though. So, one can think it is something that may only effect only elk or specific groups. Anyone heard reports on other animals?

You might find this interesting

http://jongosch.com/local-farriers-research-connects-herbicides-to-hoof-disease-in-elk-horses/

[garrett89]

Did not know that old man 8383 thank you !! Do you know how long those spores can live in the dirt without a host?? I don't know much about it and don't want to get off topic but I have heard this is caused by the chemicals they use to spray with? I know it has killed off the grouse population and has now caused serious issues with the elk!! Do any of you know if the deer are affected by hoof rott or affected by those spores I should say?? Where are the liberals protesting the use of spray at !!! That a great story on those Russian wolves, that's just crazy..

From the way they make it sound it should spread to any hoofed animal. Haven't heard any reports on other animals though. So, one can think it is something that may only effect only elk or specific groups. Anyone heard reports on other animals?

You might find this interesting

http://jongosch.com/local-farriers-research-connects-herbicides-to-hoof-disease-in-elk-horses/

Intriguing indeed. Maybe test trial of burning instead of herbicides for a bit and see any improvement or maybe something else?

[KFhunter]

We definitely need to quit mass spraying, it has it's place but large scale timber spraying needs to stop.   


burn baby burn

[hunter_sean08]

Definitely makes sense considering how much companies like Weyerhaeuser spray the sides of their roads in SW WA. Just so happens the elk love the old roads for easy browse and rubbing their antlers on the young alders. And if WY sprays undesirable trees and bushes out in the middle of a timber stand, well then they might as well be spraying the elk beds and feeding areas. I mean, I've gotta believe these herbicides are getting into their water sources as well, and that has to be a key contributor.. I've seen more herbicide treatment notice signs in the Willapa Hills than anywhere else, and yet somehow, some way, I'm sure Weyerhaeuser will find a way to get out of this much like they've managed to find a way to charge us for access.

[Old Man8383]

Sorry for the delayed reply, I don't check in often. 

Most hooved animals can get hoof rot of one bacteria species or another.   Hoof rot can be a real problem in domestic cattle, sheep and goat populations.  Though I have witnessed some very tragic cases on hoof rot in captive deer I have found very few deformed hooves in wild free roaming deer. 

Extreme environmental conditions can desiccate the spores and lessen their longevity, but these spores can last for many years in the soil.  Spores do best in warmer moist soil conditions.

Some form of hoof rot I think is normal and common in hooved animals in the wild in the Pacific Northwest.  Since I first started tracking elk and deer in the 1960's I've observed some deformed hoof prints, usually older animals having deformed hooves.  Not unlike the older cattle that grazed the fields where I grew up as a kid.  Usually in elk.  I've found spayed footed curled toed old elk from Willipa Bay to above timber line in the Goat Rocks.  During those years despite having viewed 1,000's from afar and 100's in hand it was not until the mid 1990's that I first saw an elk in SW Washington with the debilitating deformities that are plaguing elk today. Unfortunately, it's since spread to much of Western Washington.