Rethinking Berger bullets for hunting

[Bob33]

Could be the ticket! More weight less detonate? Dang I could be a rapper lol

180 accubonds do 90% of the whacking in the 30s for me.

Whacking in the 30s? 

[carpsniperg2]

Most my whacking comes from .30-.45 now days. Well late in the year when the snow hits I even whack with a .50

[jasnt]

I have never had a problem with bergers performance on game. Have take mule deer as low as 1900fps
Full pass through with quarter size exit.  This was with my 243

That is very true and not where the problems happen. Low velocity longer range they do great. Put them in a animal at 3000-3300fps and they tend to vaporize before getting into the vitals to do damage.

ive also taken many deer in bow range with bergers over 3000 fps. Drt they may not exit but who cares if you don’t have to track them.
For the record I ain’t no shoulder puncher.  I like shoulder meat and go for the double lung

[yorketransport]

Could be the ticket! More weight less detonate? Dang I could be a rapper lol

180 accubonds do 90% of the whacking in the 30s for me.

That's a great idea for a t-shirt!

[Bob33]

Most my whacking comes from .30-.45 now days. Well late in the year when the snow hits I even whack with a .50

Doesn't that hurt?

[carpsniperg2]

Could be the ticket! More weight less detonate? Dang I could be a rapper lol

180 accubonds do 90% of the whacking in the 30s for me.

That's a great idea for a t-shirt!

HECK YEAH!!!!! I think you just cornered a market!!!! Do I get a royalty?I hope I get Karl in the gift exchange this year! I know what he is getting 

[Jellymon]

Entrance hole from a 168g berger VLD from a 300WSM at 30yds. Yes, entrance hole. And look at that, it didnt make it very far.

[gadwall]

How to the bergers do on big bone? If you hit a big bull on the point of the shoulder will they make it through the bone to the vitals?

A buddy of mine shot a big mule deer buck at 762 on the rangefinder with a 190 Berger out of a 300 Ultramag and the shoulders were a mess, a big mess!!! .  Not my choice for a big game bullet, though they shoot very well.

[BULLBLASTER]

If you connect with large bone using any bulllet you will make a mess. 

[birddogdad]

never really established with this berger thread if these were VLD hunting or VLD target loads? ballistic i think same numbers but impact characteristics are different. I think the hunters are softer... have not experienced the woes discussed nor lost any game with bergers over many seasons and like the accuracies i get. lots of choices available for sure...

[Stein]

If you connect with large bone using any bulllet you will make a mess. 

True, but it's all about whether you will trim that mess off and take the rest of the meat home or watch it limp off into the sunset.

[Taco280AI]

I'll personally never use them. Too many people are focused on only what the bullet does in the air and not what it does on game. No thanks. The LRX is well under MOA for me and fantastic on game.

[b23]

I think it kind of comes down to which philosophy of hunting bullet design you buy into.  Bergers are all about the bullet penetrating the hide then fragmenting like a grenade to create more wound channels so the animal bleeds out as quickly as possible.  Most other bullet companies are all about the bullet mushrooming and retaining maximum weight retention. 

If someone is of the mind set that a bullet needs to mushroom and retain a large percentage of its original weight and if it doesn't it's a bullet fail, then they will never be happy shooting a bullet like the Berger's.

There are countless posts by hunters on many different forums where they claim complete bullet failure because they used a Berger and the bullet fragmented and had little weight retention for any of the pieces.  But, they're standing next to the dead animal that didn't go more than a few feet before it piled up.  Yep, complete bullet failure. LOL

I'm a believer in shot placement, nearly always, trumps bullet construction.  IMO, more often than not, animals that require tracking, is generally due to poor shot placement, and less about bullet failure.

[BULLBLASTER]

 

[Stein]

From my rather amateur opinion, it appears that Berger went out to make a great flying bullet which they did.  From there, they tried to make it a hunting bullet but made considerable compromises on construction and materials to keep it flying as well as it does.

The other bullets mentioned were mostly designed as hunting bullets from the get go and then some were slightly optimized to fly as good as possible given the material and design choices and shape.

In my opinion, if one was to start from zero I can't see how the first choice they would make for a big game bullet is to pick one that fragments.  I think the vast majority of people, keeping everything else equal, would choose the bullet that can pound through an elk leg or hip and keep going.

If Berger came out with a bullet like that tomorrow with a great BC, I think their current hunting bullet sales would drop off a cliff.

In my mind that's the choice, whether you place more importance on the BC or bullet construction.  I don't buy the argument that fragmenting bullets are the way to go, nor do I buy the argument that it's a great idea to be flinging a TSX 1200 yards at an animal.

Of course shot placement is paramount, but bullets don't always go where we want which is the reality of hunting.  I am going to have off shots , it's a fact of life and I firmly believe that for elk in particular, I want something that can pound through as much of the animal as possible.