One hunter, two cougars down.....

[257 Wby Mag]

To keep it interesting, the dogs getting theirs'............

[257 Wby Mag]

And another......... I guess one could call me Cougeyes.....grin....

[deerslyr]

your telling me that if you saw a cougar without spots on the side of a logging road that was about to run you would know how big it was and wouldnt shoot it? If I was this guys I would have shot it. and if afterwards i walked up to it and saw it was 40lbs i would still be happy with it knowing that I saved a bunch of deers lives. Now I dont shoot ANY animal to brag about so I wouldnt be bragging about it at all.

[Cougeyes]

Nice looking cats, kind of skinny though, but you take what you can get i guess.  I just dont see how people think there are more cougars now than there was in say the 60's or 70's.  I think its the fact that there are more people now and more people in the woods, more people living amongst cougar habitat therefore a greater chance of encountering a cougar which in turns leads people to believe that there are more out there. 

The pilot programs started up north were started not due to declining mule deer herds, but more because of human safety, i.e. more complaints in those areas after hound hunting was banned.  Yes, there is a decline in Mule deer numbers up north but that is partially due to apparent competition where you have two prey species mule deer and white-tailed deer and cougars as the predator, but it is the white-tailed deer abundance that draws the cougars into these areas where then the cougars prey on the mule deer.  There was a study done by WSU researchers on this, i can get the article if anyone wants to read it, the study was done in the "WEdge" and around kettle falls colville.  Also, another study was conducted about 5 years ago that shows that infact cougar populations may in fact be declining in parts of the pacific northwest, that too was published in the Journal of Wildlife Management. 

[257 Wby Mag]

How many them critters you got there COUGEYES? Maybe that journal will tell you they all look skinny unless they have a belly full of DEER meat. According to my research hunter #'s are down? If they are over carrying capacity and humans are encroaching, maybe we should up the limit a little? Humans and longtails in the yard don't mix, remember California? Later

[Cougeyes]

Naw you got it all wrong.   Its not a belly full of deer meat its a belly full of those little wiener dogs like you got in your last photo. I never said cougars were anywhere near over carrying capacity, you must have misunderstood me.  Yes, cougars in the yard dont mix, that is why I think we should reinstate hound hunting as a better management tool rather, allowing houdsman to be selective on their take rather than boot hunters shooting whatever is infront of them by chance alone.

[257 Wby Mag]

If they touch Dan the weiner dog... Its ON!!! To answer your other question, I live in a valley on the South siide of the Vail tree farm, my back property borders it. There are no culdesacs or devolpement, pretty much the same houses that have been out here for generations. Talking to the old timers, cougars were pretty much non-existant until recent years. I don't know what year it was but they used to have a bounty on em, and there was probally a reason for that, kinda like the wolf. I can attest, being a lifetime resident of Lewis County, hunting,trapping,hound hunting,logging, pretty much living in the woods, that there are more longtails now than ever before. All the cats I've seen have been in the last 8-10 years. I have freinds that used to hunt em for the game Dept, so they could put tracking collars on them. There are more cougars now than ever before. Another thing, up until about 10 years ago about every gate in this country was wide open, now you can't go anywhere, so more people in the field doesn't cut it with me. It will get real interesting now wolves are documented in Washington, it'll be like Idaho, people won't turn loose on a track for fear of their prized lion hound getting eatin.

Best

[Cougeyes]

Yeah i'm really curious as to see what this wolf business brings about for this state, already one depredation, i've seen the trail camera picks of a few wolves in NE WA this year already documented.  Deffinetly will be interesting that's for sure, everyone's entitled to their own views and opinions on both cougars and wolves and i'll leave it at that.

[ICEMAN]

... I never said cougars were anywhere near over carrying capacity, you must have misunderstood me.  Yes, cougars in the yard dont mix, that is why I think we should reinstate hound hunting as a better management tool rather, allowing houdsman to be selective on their take rather than boot hunters shooting whatever is infront of them by chance alone.

How is letting houndsmen selectively shooting a mature cat, going to help manage the species when you claim that any cat shot will be replaced? How are cat numbers ever going to get reduced? When the deer population shrinks? The cougar will really be "trashcanning" for house pets then...

Basically houndsmen are the only group of hunters who could select what they shoot. The average hunter never sees a cougar, or seldom. When we do see one, we raise the rifle and shoot, plain and simple. Then we see, hmmm, not as big as I thought, or wow, nice cougar...  I can see where houndsmen would want more choice cougar to chase and hunt. I see it. But do you see how us deerhunters want the cougar killed off? Alot!

Secondly, what would be so bad if the cougar population was reduced by half? What species population would have an exponential or similar growth pattern?  Most of us do romanticize the thought of a grand cougar stalking it's prey...., I just don't romanticize the thought of them doing it on every ridge I hunt.

My point would be, cougar eat. Cougar that are not afraid of humans eat anywhere they want. I would like to see hound hunting reinstated. I would also like to see the cougar population reduced. Do hound hunters want the cougar population reduced, I doubt it. This is the dichotomy.

[257 Wby Mag]

+1 iceman

[Cougeyes]

On the flip side in areas where there may be more sightings or areas of concern for safety, houndsman could be used more frequently to harvest younger cats, because it is those cats that seem to be causing the most problems.  Young subordinate cougars that have dispersed from their mother and wonder into people's yards.  By shooting a mature cat away from residential areas that opens a void that can be filled by these younger cats.  If houndsman can determine sex with a treed cougar they should be able to judge a relative age.  Obviously shooting younger cats wouldn't be on the agenda for most but something would have to be worked out. 

I dont think cougar numbers in this state are anywhere near alarming numbers where a reduction on their population is on the chopping block.  I dont think they should be reduced statewide, but more on the lines of "areas" that pose the greatest risk to people, areas that have the most sightings, or probability of a conflict. 

One more point note worthy i think......yes, one cougar may eat 1 deer a week, or one elk every 1.5 weeks, my point is how many deer and elk get ran over on our freeways, and highways every day?  I dont know, and i'm sure you dont, but we all see it.  We dont consider these facts, just blame the obvious culprits and for good reason I guess. 

I've been hunting around the state quite often and am yet to see this drastic decline in deer and elk that everyone is talking about because of cougars.  If people dont harvest a deer or dont see a buck then it must be because there is a cougar around or the cougars ate all the deer so nothing is left.  Why eliminate or drastically reduce the cougar numbers to have a significantly higher mule deer herd? Are we being selfish?  Probably.  Hunting is supposed to be hunting, getting out hiking and searching for what you intend to harvest.  By significantly increasing say the mule deer everyone's chances are high of harvesting an animal, but how much fun is it to just drive up a road see a deer get out and shoot it, rather than getting out and actually hunting for that animal.   

[workstohunt]

Alot of interesting points.
I agree with 257-- Ive seen more cats in last 10 yrs than ever.
I saw one this morning on Hewitt rd. by 2 houses that have been there forever, I have had them in my driveway in the past.
If the 37 pound cat was legal, why is anyone judging what he should have done??
Everyone has an opinion--as far as myself, I passed on over 20 bucks this year and ate my tag because I chose not to take them, I have passed on cats in the past but probably would have taken this one as well. especially in that area.
Just my $.02

[Skyvalhunter]

We wouldn't have a 2 cougar limit if the state thought that cougars were in abundance. With cougars it's not like they kill one deer or one elk a week and be satisfied. They have been studies where they go in and kill multiple animals and then not even eat them. That's truely a waste of our game animals. The blacktail deer pop was declining in the area I grew up when there was much more cougar sightings. Now it's starting to come back some but for a while the numbers were down and deer were skitterish. All falls in the same scenario with the elk around Yellowstone park.   

[Cougeyes]

We wouldn't have a 2 cougar limit if the state thought that cougars were in abundance. 

  I dont think that's the case.  There is a 2 cougar limit because what are the odds of one person killing two cougars in one year....pretty slim.  The state is just giving the boot hunters some le-way.  So, if they are over abundant then why aren't hound hunters getting two tags in the NE WA?  And i dont agree with you, why would a cougar waste its energy and kill something and not eat it? A cougar is successful at making a kill about 1 out of 5 attempts, so you think after 4 failures they would kill an animal on the 5th and just not eat it?  I dont know where you got your info, but i would like to see it. 

[bucklucky]

Plain and simple , reinstate hound hunting and the cougar population will go down in areas that are accessible to trucks and ATVs. We will still have the problem in the areas that we do not have access to. Lets see , less cougars more deer.... that means I may get more taxidermy work too, More cougars killed and more deer live for us to kill. My vote REINSTATE HOUNDHUNTING! Plus I would like to take my hounds out and tree a Lion .