Broadhead question

[SpokaneSlayer]

I shoot Magnus Stingers currently.  Love them.  But when Joe's had their big sale going on, I couldn't resist picking up a pack of NAP Hellrazors.  My questions is, assuming all things equal, such as flight, would you use the Stinger or the Hellrazor?  If my logic is correct, I would think that 3 blades is better than 2.  I'm going to the range today to finish broadhead tuning and will be shooting both. 

[halflife65]

Are you shooting a compound bow over 55 pounds?  If so, I would go with a 3 blade, but that's just my opinion.  I'm sure that a two blade would work fine, too.  I shoot the G5 Striker (100 gr.).

[SpokaneSlayer]

Are you shooting a compound bow over 55 pounds?  If so, I would go with a 3 blade, but that's just my opinion.  I'm sure that a two blade would work fine, too.  I shoot the G5 Striker (100 gr.).

56 pounds.  That's why I chose a cut on contact head.

[halflife65]

Doesn't the Magnus come in a 4 blade version?  Just out of curiousity, have you tried that?

Last year, a friend of mine took his sister elk hunting and she shot completely through a 5 point bull with a G5 Montec with a 45 pound Mathews (not that I'm advocating that anybody goes that light if they can help it).  However, you should probably be ok with your new NAPs.  I guess the problem would arise if you hit it in the shoulder or some other marginal shot, anyway.  I think that if you hit it well, it would be fine. 

Shoot the new ones and see how they perform out of your bow.  If they are better, use them.  If not, stick with the old tried and true.

[BULLBLASTER]

you have plenty of energy for any broadhead you want to shoot. if you like how the ones you have shoot, then use them!! the deer wont care what head you use. with how you were stackin em in there the other night you will be slayin critters in a month!!!!!

[Northwest75]

I have been using G5 Montec's for several yrs. with great results. But last week I got the urge to try something new. So I bought a couple packs of Grim Reaper HADES 100 gr. Fixed Broad Heads. They just look deadly. Wainting on my new Victory Arrows to try them out.

[Hoytstaffshooter83]

the shot if far more important then then broadhead, indians were killing game long ago with rocks and sticks....... now with what we have why do these types of posts arise? if they fly/group good then your good to go..... sure some are made better, and if you can shoot well those that are not of quality will soon show in your shooting........ now go kill something!!!

[GoPlayOutside]

I hear guys on TV sometimes say they prefer a two-bladed broadhead for big game like moose, cape buffalo, etc.  Does this make sense?  I assume it is for penetration....why don't we shoot em for Elk?
I've always shot 3 blades, and have had plenty of pass throughs.  Anybody shot 2 blades at animals...what are the results?

[halflife65]

Pretty much with Hoyt on that one, I guess...

[Hoytstaffshooter83]

I have shot a 2 blade as well,  same result..... pass through at 50yrds.... when you take out both lungs practically anything could be on the arrow and do the job..... I prefer 3 or 4 blade myself

[SpokaneSlayer]

Thanks for the responses.  I will be "sticking" with the Magnus'.  They were shooting nice and straight out to 50 yds.  I think next time I shoot, I'm going to start at the further ranges and work back in.  By the time I got out 50, my arms were tired. 

Chris - Thanks for helping me get started tuning the other night.  Probably wouldn't have gone as smooth yesterday.

[STIKNSTRINGBOW]

the shot if far more important then then broadhead, indians were killing game long ago with rocks and sticks....... now with what we have why do these types of posts arise? if they fly/group good then your good to go..... sure some are made better, and if you can shoot well those that are not of quality will soon show in your shooting........ now go kill something!!!

Stone Arrowheads are SHARP, the real ones anyhow. obsidian is still used for some surgeries today due to its increadable degree of sharpness. The main reason for 2 blades is the tip providing immediate cut on contact to reduce resistance for the rest of the head. Most 3 blade heads have a punch type tip. with the amount of energy from modern bows the difference is minimal and on thin skinned game there really is no difference, a pass through is deep enough! A SHARP broad head is important, . A dull broadhead will not do the job as efficiently as a sharp one no matter what type. That should be a thing of the past with today's replaceable blades etc. Correct shot placement is important. A hit in the wrong place (of course) spells disaster. but a good hit with a dull head will result in a longer blood trail and possible unrecovered game. A bad hit is a bad hit no matter how sharp your BH is. And there is no excuse for not practicing safe and ethical shots and staying within your limits.  and you owe it to the game, the sport, and yourself to use a sharp broadhead, it does not matter what type.

[Ray]

Here's one study on broadheads. There are even remarks regarding 2 blade versus 3 blade. 2 blade seems to be scientifically proven as stronger and better for penetration. I would assume that the construction of the materials is also a factor. At the same time he is open about the idea of more research in this area could be needed to be more conclusive and well rounded

Reports

One of the striking features noted during the testing was that a large number of the broadheads tested were very fragile, often bending or breaking whether bone was hit or not.  Table I and Graph I reflect an evaluation of the different types of broadheads and the percentage damaged during testing.  The rigid 2 blade (or more accurately, single blade with two cutting edges) broadheads proved to be significantly more resistant to damage than either the rigid multiblades or the replaceable blade type of broadheads.

Specific Report on Broadhead Performance

POSTULATES BASED ON ARROW PENETRATION TEST OF GAME ANIMALS

1.   Many broadheads are to fragile, bending or breaking on impact, thus limiting penetration.

2.   Rigid single blade broadheads are the least prone to damage on impact.

3.   The most lethal shot angle is with the animal quartering away from the archer.

4.   The least lethal shot angle is with the animal quartering towards the archer and the shot hitting in the neck-shoulder junction area.

5.   All multiblade broadheads offer insufficient penetration when heavy bone is encountered.

6.     Single blade broadheads penetrate significantly better than multiblade broadheads in both soft and hard animal tissue.

7.   Four and five blade heads penetrate better than three blade heads.

8.   When a rib is hit on entrance, a single blade broadhead is almost twice as likely to be lethal as 4, 5, and 6 blade heads and three times as likely as three blade heads.

9.   When heavy bone is encountered, a total arrow mass of at least 650 grains, as well as a tough single blade broadhead, is required to achieve adequate penetration.

10.  A single blade broadhead is more than twice as likely to produce an exit wound as a multiblade broadhead.

11.  The degree of blood trail is dependent on the location of the hit and the presence/absence of an exit wound, not the number of blades on the broadhead.

12.  When all shots are considered, the degree of wound inflicted (depth of wound channel times the number of blades) by single blade broadheads is equal to or greater than that inflicted by any multiblade broadheads.

13.  No multiblade broadhead can reasonably be expected to penetrate even a deer size animal when the hit is from the forward quartering angle and in the area of the neck-shoulder junction.

14.  The most important factor in achieving adequate penetration is a well constructed single blade broadhead.

15.  The second most important factor in achieving adequate penetration is adequate arrow mass (a minimum mass of 650 grains is recommended).

16.  Game animals have reflexes faster than even the very fastest of arrows.  No archer can guarantee where his arrow will strike an animal.  I concur with Horace Gore.  In bowhunting, shot placement is, for practical purposes, random.

[SpokaneSlayer]

Some good info.  Further solidifies my choice of broadhead.  That very last line is interesting, talking about the relfelxes of the game animal and shot placement is essentially random.  Might be a bit hard to swallow for some bowhunters, but it makes sense to me.

[Ray]

The reports seem a little dated but I think a large portion of the report still stands as relevant even as technology advanced. I wish some more reports like these were done.

[tlbradford]

I had a guy tell me his reasoning behind using a two blade.  If the arrow remains inside the animal, a two blade will move back and forth with the animals movements and continue cutting a wider and wider wound channel.  A three or four blade head would not do that.  He also stated that on a marginal shot with poor penetration, one that hits bone, or is deflected off a branch, whatever, the two blade will gradually work it's way out of the animal rather which would increase its chances of survival.  It makes sense to me, but I don't have any tests to reference.  The only downside to a two blade is that they can plane badly.   

[STIKNSTRINGBOW]

16.  Game animals have reflexes faster than even the very fastest of arrows.  No archer can guarantee where his arrow will strike an animal.  I concur with Horace Gore.  In bowhunting, shot placement is, for practical purposes, random.

That is the reason for the acceptable shot distance controversy, the further an animal is away from you the more time they have to react to the sound of the shot. No matter how fast or quiet your bow is it will still be heard before the arrow gets there. Everything changes when it has hair and a heartbeat....Try holding still when your legs are shaking from "adrenaline Overload"! The day I quit getting excited before the shot is the day I will find a different sport. I pass on more shots than I take and (so far) have a good shot:recovered animal ratio because of self imposed limitations.

[halflife65]

Do you know that date of the report?  Also, what multi-blade broadheads were used?  I find it a little alarming that they were breaking when hitting bone.  I've missed the a foam target with a G5, hit a rock, cracked the arrow and, although there was a notch out of it, could screw it back on to a new arrow and use it (for practice not to hunt with).  I'm surprised that a large percentage of them were breaking when hitting bone.  I want to make sure that I never use a weak one...

[Ray]

The report says what broadheads were used. It also says what kind of bows he was using and things like that. Considering the date on the copyright is 1996 I would assume it is 1996 or older. Apparently he spent 12 years collecting data and doing research to come up with some of the conclusions.

You have to ask yourself is what he says important to me and also if the broadhead design you are using much more technologically advanced between then and now?

[Ray]

Forgot to point out he has made more recent reports on tradgang

[bow4elk]

For the most comprehensive data on the subject of penetration testing, see Dr. Ed Ashby's or Dave Holt's work.  Both have spent years conducting broadhead penetration tests on "real" animals/carcasses.

[Ray]

This is Ashby's work in the links above.