The High Costs of Wolves

[wolfbait]

9 Feb 2009, 10:38am
Deer, Elk, Bison Wolves
by admin

The High Costs of Wolves
by Allen Schallenberger

A recent final research report by the Montana Dept. of Fish, Wildlife and Parks (FWP) shows that wolves are grabbing 67 percent of the funding compared to all other big game surveys in the state of Montana. That figure has increased from 45 percent in 2005.

MT FWP is getting $823,604 from the US Fish and Wildlife Service for wolves. FWP is spending about $2,000  yearly per admitted wolf.  Those wolf numbers are a little hazy as FWP makes their wolf count at the end of December but will not release the numbers until their annual wolf report in March. Also the public should know that a fiscal note on SB 183 indicates FWP wants to spend about $6,600 per wolf.

What is the true cost per wolf in Montana today? How much money is taken from other FWP programs? How much are the universities, USFWS, USDA Wildlife Services, other agencies and environmental groups spending per wolf in addition to FWP?  What is the cost of the numerous big game animals killed by wolves?  For example wolves kill 23 elk per wolf in the Madison Valley during the 6 month winter period. What they are killing the rest of the year is unknown.

Humans must pay FWP restitution fees for illegally taken big game animals. Trophy animals — bighorn $30,000; elk $8,000; moose and any mountain goat $6,000; deer $8,000; antelope $2,000.  Other restitution fees are bighorn and wolves $2,000; elk and moose $1,000; buffalo and antlered deer $500; deer and antelope not covered by above sections $300.  The wolves are killing thousands of expensive animals.

What are the costs of livestock killed, wounded and harassed as well as animals such as dogs?  What are the stress costs for big game, livestock, ranchers, hunters, outfitters, other citizens and businesses and the costs of wolves spreading diseases? The feds imported wolves with $12,000,000 stolen funds [from hunting and fishing excise taxes].

Note: Allen Schallenberger is an experienced wildlife research and management biologist, wildife consultant, former cattle rancher, 20-year general outfitter, and a 5th generation Montana native. He is a frequent contributor to Wildlife and People and SOS Forests.

email2friend 24 Feb 2009, 3:03pm
by Bob S.


Please note: As an Albertan (Canadian) and grad student in forestry (M.Sc.) from U. of Idaho who was close to the USPS operation (1995) collecting the initial wolves for release, many questions were raised amongst us wondering will these critters stay in the national parks. Many predicted that wolves would become a burden on wildlife managers and livestock producers throughout the western states. This indeed has happened. The federal (US) people must be held accountable!!!!!! Remedial action is needed now.
25 Feb 2009, 5:40am
by Mike L.


The truth is that these folks did not want the wolves to stay in the Park. The “smoke is out of the jug” and these wolves will end up throughout the west eating up big game populations and anything else they can catch. Soon the livestock will be gone along with the big game and now we are back to a real wilderness environment. Isn’t that just a wonderful legacy we leave for our grandchildren that may want to hunt something!!
25 Feb 2009, 9:16am
by wheat


Thank you U of I student!!! Nice to know you are able to see the side of the ranchers, farmers, Out of State, and In-State Sportsmen, and all people that love all wildlife, not just one species that kills everything, including your own dog!

What people don’t know is that wolves are being dumped, still, all over Idaho, by the same people working in the gov, as well as by the Indians that raise wolves. People have seen stock trailers full of wolves dumped in Oregon, by Enterprise, and down by Kendrick, Idaho.

http://westinstenv.org/wildpeop/2009/02/09/the-high-costs-of-wolves/

[sako223]

I fully agree the cost of the wolf program is very high and am not sure if this includes legal fees.

Humans must pay FWP restitution fees for illegally taken big game animals. Trophy animals — bighorn $30,000; elk $8,000; moose and any mountain goat $6,000; deer $8,000; antelope $2,000.  Other restitution fees are bighorn and wolves $2,000; elk and moose $1,000; buffalo and antlered deer $500; deer and antelope not covered by above sections $300.  The wolves are killing thousands of expensive animals.

I always hate these types of comparisons thrown in what is supposed to be a factual cost tally.These numbers are penalties for breaking the law. It cheapens the article.
If we go by this line of thinking then elk and gophers cause tremendous widespread damage to farmers..And lets not forget the beautiful starling, who has added up their damage cost.
Many farmers don't get covered for losses from deer and elk but write it off. Some get extra tags to give to friends. Another unfair system.
Cougars and bears kill a share of pets and farm animals. The true worst is local pets kill a numbers of livestock and feral cats hit small game very hard.
So we humans have had a direct impact on the same willife system by irresponsible acts and pet ownership.

What people don’t know is that wolves are being dumped, still, all over Idaho, by the same people working in the gov, as well as by the Indians that raise wolves. People have seen stock trailers full of wolves dumped in Oregon, by Enterprise, and down by Kendrick, Idaho.

It is no secret that wolves have been planted and have spread. We all believe that more have been placed without confirmation. Most of us distrust officials. But I would sure like to see actual proof of "Stock trailers full of wolves dumped in Oregon". That is a big statement implying herds or more.
I thought wolves are sacred to indians, but have seen them blaming us for releasing them.

the costs of wolves spreading diseases?

I have not heard of them spreading disease yet. I am aware of livestock spreading deadly disease to wildlife. It is also known that coyotes have increased in numbers spreading across the US carrying disease. It is also known that concentration of game animals get diseases dying off in mass numbers.

[wolfbait]

Humans must pay FWP restitution fees for illegally taken big game animals. Trophy animals — bighorn $30,000; elk $8,000; moose and any mountain goat $6,000; deer $8,000; antelope $2,000.  Other restitution fees are bighorn and wolves $2,000; elk and moose $1,000; buffalo and antlered deer $500; deer and antelope not covered by above sections $300.  The wolves are killing thousands of expensive animals.

Tell you what, I will just take the paragraph above out, because in a few more years it won't mean sh$T anyway, and that's cool for the anti's- cuz they know where all of this is going.

(Cougars and bears kill a share of pets and farm animals. The true worst is local pets kill a numbers of livestock and feral cats hit small game very hard.
So we humans have had a direct impact on the same willife system by irresponsible acts and pet ownership.)

Thats a dandy. Here is what will happen with the wolf,, no more stray dogs, no more stray cats, no more anything hows that sound? Think I'm Bs'n you. ask the folks in Idaho n Montana about what happens to their dogs that the wolves ketch at night around the house.


(It is no secret that wolves have been planted and have spread. We all believe that more have been placed without confirmation. Most of us distrust officials. But I would sure like to see actual proof of "Stock trailers full of wolves dumped in Oregon". That is a big statement implying herds or more.)

This spring there were three different trucks at the location where the wolves were being released in lower Alder cr. Quite sure a certain wdfw biologist knew all about it, Pretty cool when defenders of wildlife have their very own wolf biologist working for wdfw, and that isn't all, Defenders of Wildlife get to have a joint web site with the same outfit they are running, you guess it,, wdfw,,,,Are you seeing anything a bit fishy yet?

(I thought wolves are sacred to indians, but have seen them blaming us for releasing them.)

Indians, just like the pale faces have the wolf love. This is not about race, this is about fools who have been brain washed. Have you ever seen the old Charlie Russell paintings,  the Indians standing around wearing wolf pelts?

 Do you really think the Indians want to watch wolves instead of hunt all the time,,

(I have not heard of them spreading disease yet. I am aware of livestock spreading deadly disease to wildlife. It is also known that coyotes have increased in numbers spreading across the US carrying disease. It is also known that concentration of game animals get diseases dying off in mass numbers.)

Wolves have been known to spread rabies quite well. There are other diseases that wolves spread through there poop. You can look it up, its there. Check info in Arizona n New Mexico. Although their wolf isn't really a wolf, its more of a cross-bred mongrel. How would like to hear about the cages that the people of Arizona and New Mexico have to build for their kids to wait in for the school buss, because of the wolves,, 

Documentary

 Undue Burden

 The Real Cost Of Living With Wolves

http://www.prosts.com/Documentary-Undue-Burden.htm
Well worth the money,,,,,,,,,

 

[haus]

(It is no secret that wolves have been planted and have spread. We all believe that more have been placed without confirmation. Most of us distrust officials. But I would sure like to see actual proof of "Stock trailers full of wolves dumped in Oregon". That is a big statement implying herds or more.)

This spring there were three different trucks at the location where the wolves were being released in lower Alder cr. Quite sure a certain wdfw biologist knew all about it, Pretty cool when defenders of wildlife have their very own wolf biologist working for wdfw, and that isn't all, Defenders of Wildlife get to have a joint web site with the same outfit they are running, you guess it,, wdfw,,,,Are you seeing anything a bit fishy yet?

Joint website?

Alright so....some greenies caught a bunch of wolves, put them in trucks, hauled them to Alder Creek, which is in eastern oregon(?), and dumped them. 3 separate times or 3 trucks same time?

less words more information....

[wolfbait]

(It is no secret that wolves have been planted and have spread. We all believe that more have been placed without confirmation. Most of us distrust officials. But I would sure like to see actual proof of "Stock trailers full of wolves dumped in Oregon". That is a big statement implying herds or more.)

This spring there were three different trucks at the location where the wolves were being released in lower Alder cr. Quite sure a certain wdfw biologist knew all about it, Pretty cool when defenders of wildlife have their very own wolf biologist working for wdfw, and that isn't all, Defenders of Wildlife get to have a joint web site with the same outfit they are running, you guess it,, wdfw,,,,Are you seeing anything a bit fishy yet?

Joint website?

Alright so....some greenies caught a bunch of wolves, put them in trucks, hauled them to Alder Creek, which is in eastern oregon(?), and dumped them. 3 separate times or 3 trucks same time?

less words more information....

Three trucks this spring, in the Methow Valley dumping wolves, wasn't the first time and it won't be the last. Cept now most of Washington will be revisited and the parts of Wa. where wolves have already been dumped, will now get stacked. Now of course things are out in the open, so it will all be legal, so to speak.....

[Little Dave]

Maybe just take the wolf trailers to Husky Stadium and open the gate so that people have a better chance to see them up close.  It might be the best way to get the message across.

Like a trained police dog, these animals are strong enough to knock a man down.  A bite to the back of the neck ends any struggle.  Probably won't happen much right away... but it will happen.

My guess is that the first incident will be in the Spokane area.  In a few years, someone there will probably start leaving food out to attract the wolves to get them on a trail cam... or home video.  State responds after someone complains about a dog killed nearby or a child bitten, killed... Parents might sue.

I believe it to be a bit careless of the state to make a statement on their Frequently Asked Questions page that reads:  "Why do we want wolves in Washington?"  This to me opens the possibility that the state assumes responsibility for consequences of increasing wolf population in modern times.  So I'll save that paper on state letterhead for that first kid that will suffer because "we want."

Incidentally the whole statement on the state's website reads this way and here's the link:
http://wdfw.wa.gov/wildlife/management/gray_wolf/faq.html

Why do we want wolves in Washington? Won’t they just eat all our elk and deer?

Wolves are a part of Washington’s wildlife heritage. As a top predator, they naturally help keep wild ungulate (elk, deer, moose) populations in balance with available habitat. Like other predators, such as cougars, bears, and coyotes, it’s in their own best interest to not deplete their own supply of prey. Predator-prey balances are maintained over time, with highs and lows in populations of both.

Elk populations in other states with wolves (ID, MT, WY) have mostly remained stable, although some have declined in a few areas where wolves were just one of several mortality factors. Based on other states’ experiences with wolves, Washington might expect  200 wolves to take up to 2,520 elk and  4,180 deer per year (recreational hunters currently average 7,390 elk and 38,100 deer per year).

[haus]

Three trucks this spring, in the Methow Valley dumping wolves, wasn't the first time and it won't be the last. Cept now most of Washington will be revisited and the parts of Wa. where wolves have already been dumped, will now get stacked. Now of course things are out in the open, so it will all be legal, so to speak.....

Heard several stories over the years of wolves being shot around the St. Helens area, Weyerhauser land. Each story is very unique in time, year, time of year, and location yet they all end the same. The, 'what happens after the animals been shot part'.....if the wdfw is contacted that is.

WDFW is contacted, wdfw response is rapid, wdfw officials arrive, take animal, thank you...have a nice day...bye bye now. No questions no answers, no legal action, NADA damn thing. Odd.

These are not my buddies neighbors cousins best friends girlfriends uncle shot a wolf...type of stories. It's first and second hand from people I've known for many years. Yes I've heard the through the grape vine stories too, some of them I laugh at, big fish stories, but this isn't bigfoot. This isn't hey I saw....its hey I killed this wolf....see.

Sure some of them are likely runaways, wolves that people had as pets.

I've just always asssumed; Weyerhauser tree farm + ESA wild animal on property = bad for business.