I heard it again... Margaret/Toutle going general

[Elkrunner]

I definitely see both sides of the issue. I do appreciate the fact that I can hunt every single year in this state, for both deer and elk. But I also think I'd be willing to hunt just one of those each year, if the hunting was that much better. I just see this state's so called "management" of our deer and elk as a complete joke. What sort of control do they have on the number of animals taken each year? They don't. Unlimited numbers of tags and people can hunt anywhere they want.

I am right there with you.  I would trade deer hunting and elk hunting each year for a great longer season better animals and chance for success.  I already hunt so many things that I cant find enough time to get out there anyways..between, turkeys, geese, ducks, deer, elk, bear and fishing it becomes hard to find time for all species as it is.

[trophyhunt]

I would rather hunt every year than do a statewide permit!

:yeah:I think there are a lot of lazy hunters in this state and that is a good thing. If everyone hunted as hard as some of us I think their might be an impact on the numbers of animals.  I don't think the blacktail have any problems hiding from lazy hunters, and to not be able to hunt them everyear would be a travesty. Also the elk on the west side are just harder to hunt with all the cover so I would expect a low harvest report.

[STIKNSTRINGBOW]

I definitely see both sides of the issue. I do appreciate the fact that I can hunt every single year in this state, for both deer and elk. But I also think I'd be willing to hunt just one of those each year, if the hunting was that much better. I just see this state's so called "management" of our deer and elk as a complete joke. What sort of control do they have on the number of animals taken each year? They don't. Unlimited numbers of tags and people can hunt anywhere they want.

They control harvest by limiting length of season, and timing. That is why success rates are low.
In order to get better success rates, you apply for permits (extended season, better timing, etc..)
What some seem to be missing, WE ARE A "PERMIT ONLY" !!, and OTC at the same time

[GoldTip]

If they make this state permit only for deer and or elk, poaching will increase big time.   At least for a short time.

Ya think so?  I don't think the 19 out of 20 guys who don't kill elk every year are going to suddenly start poaching just because they don't get a tag this year. 

I agree whole heartedly with Bobcat, the state should go to every other year on elk tags.  50% less hunters in the woods and 50% less pressure on the animals.  Better escapement means higher numbers of animals and over time more and more encounters each of those years you do get a tag.  Numbers of special permits for each unit would go up to do higher animal numbers.  50% less competition each year in those premium units for the tags.  I just don't see the down side, other than not having an elk tag each year, and I would gladly give up elk hunting in it's current state in this state every other year for all those perks I just listed.

[Elkaholic daWg]

 On the bright side, it would give our youth more time to lazy up around their techno-gadgets!

 That and it would be another step toward phasing out hunting in this state RUN by wolf huggers

[Elkrunner]

If they make this state permit only for deer and or elk, poaching will increase big time.   At least for a short time.

Ya think so?  I don't think the 19 out of 20 guys who don't kill elk every year are going to suddenly start poaching just because they don't get a tag this year. 

I agree whole heartedly with Bobcat, the state should go to every other year on elk tags.  50% less hunters in the woods and 50% less pressure on the animals.  Better escapement means higher numbers of animals and over time more and more encounters each of those years you do get a tag.  Numbers of special permits for each unit would go up to do higher animal numbers.  50% less competition each year in those premium units for the tags.  I just don't see the down side, other than not having an elk tag each year, and I would gladly give up elk hunting in it's current state in this state every other year for all those perks I just listed.

[CavemantheHunter]

I would hate for this state to become permit only. Elk and deer hunting seasons are the focal point of my year. When I'm not out hunting, I am drooling to be able to get back out there. If I do not have that right every year, I would be seriously depressed. I agree that there are way too many people out there hunting and way too many out there who don't move more than 100 yards from their vehicles, but whatever, I try to get as far back into the woods as physically possible. The success rates may not be that high, but I have been doing just fine. Plus, it's not always about the kill, but about the time and enjoyment spent enjoying one of the oldest pasttimes. I am strongly against making it a permit only state.  I do believe the state mismanages our money and game, but turning it into a permit only state is not the correct answer.

[Houndhunter]

i would hate to see those units open for a general season, if the herds are to big give out more permits . i like to be able to drive places and see some critters without getting out of the truck all the time, its a great place to take kids. thats where my old man took me and showed me how to call in bulls when i was a lil guy and i see people still doing that with their kids today. i havent been there a few years, but i'll be there with the fam this year. my dad and sis drew cow tags, cant wait to help them fill their tags

[trophyhunt]

If they make this state permit only for deer and or elk, poaching will increase big time.   At least for a short time.

Ya think so?  I don't think the 19 out of 20 guys who don't kill elk every year are going to suddenly start poaching just because they don't get a tag this year. 

I agree whole heartedly with Bobcat, the state should go to every other year on elk tags.  50% less hunters in the woods and 50% less pressure on the animals.  Better escapement means higher numbers of animals and over time more and more encounters each of those years you do get a tag.  Numbers of special permits for each unit would go up to do higher animal numbers.  50% less competition each year in those premium units for the tags.  I just don't see the down side, other than not having an elk tag each year, and I would gladly give up elk hunting in it's current state in this state every other year for all those perks I just listed.

Hell the tribes would be with you guys on this, they would be tickled pink to have 50% less non natives in the woods!!! heck yea more for them!!

[grundy53]

If they make this state permit only for deer and or elk, poaching will increase big time.   At least for a short time.

Ya think so?  I don't think the 19 out of 20 guys who don't kill elk every year are going to suddenly start poaching just because they don't get a tag this year. 

I agree whole heartedly with Bobcat, the state should go to every other year on elk tags.  50% less hunters in the woods and 50% less pressure on the animals.  Better escapement means higher numbers of animals and over time more and more encounters each of those years you do get a tag.  Numbers of special permits for each unit would go up to do higher animal numbers.  50% less competition each year in those premium units for the tags.  I just don't see the down side, other than not having an elk tag each year, and I would gladly give up elk hunting in it's current state in this state every other year for all those perks I just listed.

That would be too big of a pill to swallow for me. I just couldn't fathom not being able to hunt elk every year. There are plenty of Elk. half of the reason for such a low success rate is that people don't take elk hunting seriously. I couldn't stand not being able to hunt Elk when I know some guy has a tag in his pocket and isn't willing to do what it takes to get an Elk. I might not kill one every year but I get to HUNT them every year. After all it is about the hunt not the kill.

[JPhelps]

That would be too big of a pill to swallow for me. I just couldn't fathom not being able to hunt elk every year. There are plenty of Elk. half of the reason for such a low success rate is that people don't take elk hunting seriously. I couldn't stand not being able to hunt Elk when I know some guy has a tag in his pocket and isn't willing to do what it takes to get an Elk. I might not kill one every year but I get to HUNT them every year. After all it is about the hunt not the kill.

I, as well, like the ability to hunt each and every year.  If I do my part I can find and set my sights on a big mature Roosevelt each year.  Not to mention my freezer is full year in and year out not every other year. 

The thick coastal range makes escapement easy and many branched bulls make it through.  I can remember when it was spike only around here and you had to work hard just to find a branched bull.  I think I like seeing 2 to 3 branched bulls per herd and a couple spikes.

It becomes and argument of quality vs opportunity.  I feel that I can have both, but I have to WORK for it.

[AKBowman]

Man i wish people would quit talking about making this state permit only, the game dept. I'm sure has thought about this.  We have enough animals to have over the counter hunting, it's working the way it is.

You think so? Look at the success rates. It averages about 5%. So only 1 out of 20 hunters kills an elk each year, in the general seasons. Pretty poor if you ask me.

May be only an average of 5% success rate statewide but that number is extremely skewed.

Let's break it down a little...

based off of a hypothetical number of 100 random OTC elk hunters statewide. Out of the 100 hunters 5 are successfull in harvesting an elk for our 5% statewide success rate. Probably 50% of those hunters hunt less than 2 days in the field (regardless of what they report) so we already doubled the success rate of the halfway serious hunters to 10% success rate. Probably another 25% of those 100 elk hunters either 1: never left the roads or 2: hunted less than 4 days in the field so now we have a success rate of 5 in 25 hunters or 20% success rate for people who actually "hunt"...seems pretty good to me.

To me it sure seems like the WDFW basically has it right in Permit east side and OTC west side (branch bull). If you put in the time this state gives ample opportunity. I dont really understand the argument of going to permit only when the timber co's are already bitching b/c the elk are destroying their properties.

[AKBowman]

If they make this state permit only for deer and or elk, poaching will increase big time.   At least for a short time.

Ya think so?  I don't think the 19 out of 20 guys who don't kill elk every year are going to suddenly start poaching just because they don't get a tag this year. 

I agree whole heartedly with Bobcat, the state should go to every other year on elk tags.  50% less hunters in the woods and 50% less pressure on the animals.  Better escapement means higher numbers of animals and over time more and more encounters each of those years you do get a tag.  Numbers of special permits for each unit would go up to do higher animal numbers.  50% less competition each year in those premium units for the tags.  I just don't see the down side, other than not having an elk tag each year, and I would gladly give up elk hunting in it's current state in this state every other year for all those perks I just listed.

That is b/c you hunt the east side.

FACT= Washington state has two very different geographies (east and west of the cascades) causing two completely unique landscapes (one with escape cover and one without). They needed to be managed as such which is what WDFW did.

I think a great example that backs my argument is the Winston Creek unit. One (if not the) heaviest hunted units in the state with one of the highest harvest numbers in the state. Also one of the healthiest elk herds in the state. I dont understand the point of west side going permit.

[Ingwe]

I would hate to only hunt every other year. I like to get away from most other hunters. Where I hunt, I see very few other elk hunters. It is thick brush and timber and I get to hunt every year. Getting one most years is just a bonus but the main thing is getting to hunt elk every year.

[grundy53]

I absolutely agree with both of AKBowman's posts!