to the indian netting 8-2

[seansfire]

If nobody else will come out and say it then i will, i don't like any of the indians i have ever met when out fishing. They have ALL been rude , wastefull , dirty , people. Didnt matter if we were in a river or out in the sound. They ALWAYS go to a place and rape the water and the beach for everything that is there then leave the garbage and fish carcases laying all over the beach. In case you are all wondering i am referring to the purdy sand spit out by gig harbor. A few years ago they even left a boat full of fish on the beach and went to the bar and got drunk. All the fish were ruined and fish and game did nothing.

The treaties are a joke and were probably valid 100 years ago but like with the blacks , how long are we supposed to keep paying some a -holes for something our great great grandfathers did? I am a firm beliver the tribes should be out on thier ass and working for a living like everyone else. You can't sell me the idea that the tribes are poor when they own every casino and fireworks stand in the state. Sorry if i come off as an ass or something but i get real tired of people getting something for doing nothing. None of the people getting the benefits suffered one bit. Honor your relatives by being men , not mooching off of the legacy they left behind.

[boonerboy]

Honor your relatives by being men , not mooching off of the legacy they left behind.

 

[birdmanwa]

If nobody else will come out and say it then i will, i don't like any of the indians i have ever met when out fishing. They have ALL been rude , wastefull , dirty , people. Didnt matter if we were in a river or out in the sound. They ALWAYS go to a place and rape the water and the beach for everything that is there then leave the garbage and fish carcases laying all over the beach. In case you are all wondering i am referring to the purdy sand spit out by gig harbor. A few years ago they even left a boat full of fish on the beach and went to the bar and got drunk. All the fish were ruined and fish and game did nothing.

The treaties are a joke and were probably valid 100 years ago but like with the blacks , how long are we supposed to keep paying some a -holes for something our great great grandfathers did? I am a firm beliver the tribes should be out on thier ass and working for a living like everyone else. You can't sell me the idea that the tribes are poor when they own every casino and fireworks stand in the state. Sorry if i come off as an ass or something but i get real tired of people getting something for doing nothing. None of the people getting the benefits suffered one bit. Honor your relatives by being men , not mooching off of the legacy they left behind.

Bingo Well said. Something needs to change

[Coastal_native]

If nobody else will come out and say it then i will, i don't like any of the indians i have ever met when out fishing. They have ALL been rude , wastefull , dirty , people. Didnt matter if we were in a river or out in the sound. They ALWAYS go to a place and rape the water and the beach for everything that is there then leave the garbage and fish carcases laying all over the beach. In case you are all wondering i am referring to the purdy sand spit out by gig harbor. A few years ago they even left a boat full of fish on the beach and went to the bar and got drunk. All the fish were ruined and fish and game did nothing.

The treaties are a joke and were probably valid 100 years ago but like with the blacks , how long are we supposed to keep paying some a -holes for something our great great grandfathers did? I am a firm beliver the tribes should be out on thier ass and working for a living like everyone else. You can't sell me the idea that the tribes are poor when they own every casino and fireworks stand in the state. Sorry if i come off as an ass or something but i get real tired of people getting something for doing nothing. None of the people getting the benefits suffered one bit. Honor your relatives by being men , not mooching off of the legacy they left behind.

Really??? This post actually got a 

Oh well...Thank you for your contributions to my pro-treaty argument. I can't imagine how much courage it must have taken to openly express such innovative thinking. We need more people like you stepping up and making these comments in public places.  We need people to realize that it's only "dirty Indians" and "blacks" that are "drunk a-holes" that mooch off the government. 

Please, whatever you guys do, spare me the routine justification about this "being a frustrating topic" or "why are we accused of being racist everytime we talk out against treaties?" or my new personal favorite "why do we have to be so PC all the time?".  I personally don't care either way, these kinda posts make me look damn good.

I had no idea you were paying a-holes like me (and blacks) for something your great, great grandfathers did.  I have no further comments on this thread, but I will sit back and watch (in enjoyment) as Hunt WA members try to justify or condone this type of post.

[shedcrazy]

To each their own!

[runamuk]

He said his peace cant say I don't agree with some of what he said but insert any person in who is being a mooch and not at least trying....and I find it refreshing when things aren't stated in a PC fashion.  Seriously I dont mean drop f-bombs and name call...but really if you think something sucks then say it sucks don't dance around the issue sideways .... I have enough problems expressing myself in this world trying to say things so no one gets offended just further complicates the issue.

Is it ok to say something the manner in which he did about say illegal aliens?  Is it not possible that he truly has only met the dregs of a group?   If I say Rainier Valley or south Seattle how many here cringe?  I know some fine people who live there, upstanding hard working and even white, kids attend catholic school.

[JimmyHoffa]

  If I say Rainier Valley or south Seattle how many here cringe? 

Cringe?  When I hear those words I check my magazines full, chamber loaded, and doors locked.

[seansfire]

just to be clear i didnt mean to single out indians or blacks i just figured the indian problem was the topic being discussed here. I belive there are dirty , drunken , scuzzy , people in every race group all over the world as well. I do however stick to the statements i made. I am sure it offended the natives that frequent this site and for those of you that are decent , hard working folks , i apologize for that but like i said , there are just too many natives out there crying about what they dont get and all they want to do is break rules and hide behind the heritage the relatives left for them thru blood and sweat not being mooches.

i rarely see a native that makes his sole living from netting fish on a weekend. in fact one of the so called natives is a guy who works at the port and takes way more than his fair share of the salmon every chance he gets. this is not a race issue , this is a issue of being fair and doing what is right and ethical.

[Special T]

This thread has gone off the tracks!  So i'll see if i can add a little fuel to the fire. Does anyone one listen to "The Mens Room" on KISW 99.9? They play a game for concert tickets called "Black, White, Mexi, or Jew" Where the caller has to guess the ethnicity of  the criminal from a newspaper article. Now one of the Hosts is Black and Responded to a cry of racism in the game because it furthered stereotypes.  Steve, The "black" guy responded That stereotypes are somewhat true because different groups act differently.

Are all Indians Drunk Slobs? Obviously not. I would however say that i think there is 2 distinct groups of Indians that are not mutually exclusive...   I was talking to an Indian friend of mine and we were discussing some of the topics from this board. He told me a story about how he was taking a trip with is girl friend to pick up some native Indian art while up in BC. The directions his girl friend were vague to incomplete. When his girlfriend asked if they were close he said why yes we are the the reservation. Her reply was "How do you know? I didn't see a sign. Did i Miss It? He laughed and said no. So from my limited understanding i would say there are 2 groups people who live on the Reservation, and those who don't... Does that mean that there aren't "Good" people on the Rez? No. Does that mean that there are not slobs that live off the rez? No  This same friend  also talked about how his brother took such immaculate care of his lawn that you thought his yard was part of a golf course. He put so much effort into it to fight back the perception of "Living on a Indian Reservation".

I would urge people to judge individuals as such. Different and unique in their own way. IF Tribes care about their image they will police themselves. If not i will judge them one by one...

[seansfire]

that is exactly my point special t. it is obvious we are on the same page. thank you

[runamuk]

Special T sounds like a friend well was a boss and he cringed whenever his family called said they were always looking for money and why they didnt get a job was beyond him it was easier to just borrow from him  he said some were happy living that way he however wanted more from life...he didnt really get into fishing and hunting was more into gaming and technology...

[Special T]

SeansFire IF my post was what you were thinking it didn't come across to me that we were on the same page. The "off the tracks" comment was in response to your post and a couple of others. I think it is VERY important to think out what your are going to type out and what message your trying to convey. I actually had to think about what i was going to write today on this topic after i censored myself from my last post yesterday. I have written posts about other subjects (much less controversial) that my point was totally missed be the majority of readers... I did one on "How much are you willing to pay the WDFW for what?" That does not convey my message. I seem to be the only one to understand my question.   

I am not Indian but have a couple of friends that are, and my wife has some family friends that i have had the opportunity to have some interesting discussions with. People are individuals and Generalizations are just that.

I think that if a person lives a life of complete ignorance (regardless of race) they are ultimately the ones to suffer for it.

[FC]

If nobody else will come out and say it then i will, i don't like any of the indians i have ever met when out fishing. They have ALL been rude , wastefull , dirty , people. Didnt matter if we were in a river or out in the sound. They ALWAYS go to a place and rape the water and the beach for everything that is there then leave the garbage and fish carcases laying all over the beach. In case you are all wondering i am referring to the purdy sand spit out by gig harbor. A few years ago they even left a boat full of fish on the beach and went to the bar and got drunk. All the fish were ruined and fish and game did nothing.

@ Coastal Native and PlateauNDN, This bit I've quoted out may not be what you want to hear but truthfully I wonder sometimes if you guys have ever actually seen a reservation or an area where indians fish. What do you guys see when you either walk onto your rez or past an area where your people have fished? Do you guys see the junk cars all over or the houses that are built so far below code that they should have been condemned prior to completion? Do you not see the piles of carcasses all over the place with the hens bellies ripped open for their roe and then thrown into a pile? I've watched as the fish were pulled from the nets and the females had their bellies sliced open to rip out the eggs and then drop their still thrashing carcass over the side. Do you see the piles of dead bucks on the other side of the net that were cast aside as being worthless and so as not to be counted toward the indian"s quota? I've personally seen beaches and tidelands raped of shellfish and crab in Hood Canal, I watched indians held at rifle-point at the neighbors until cops could get there and tell them that they really couldn't rape the beach owners cultured oyster bed. I could go on at quite some length on the disrespect and waste of fish and animals that I have seen as could many others on this site.

These are all things that the rest of us see every year that we fish and every time we drive through or past a rez. Is it really so surprising that so many of you get lumped in with the majority? When you gloss right over all of this and then start talking about mutual understanding blah blah and how your people deserve everything they've got and more it becomes incredibly insulting. The obvious sense of overbearing entitlement is reprehensible. Insisting that these behaviors I am describing are inaccurate or rare is ridiculous, we all know that no prosecution takes place from the tribe either as we get to watch them all do the same crap every time! The only "native pride" that I've ever seen is your people's ability to rape every resource they can get a crack at and get away with it, I find it particularly special when I get to see them taking a break from raping a salmon run so they can have a bite to eat and smoke weed on the beach in full view of everyone.What's to be proud of in all of this? Not pissing in your pants when you pass out afterwards?

If you want the sterotypes to stop I'm afraid it's on you to clean up your people's image!

I am not saying that you Coastal Native or you PlateauNDN are anything like this but this IS the public image of your peoples. Acting offended when someone points it out is just silly, if I were in either of your shoes I would be all over my people to shape the hell up!

[Coastal_native]

FC, you deserve a respone,

To be clear, "my people" are the Quinaults.  I see the reservation and the places where we fish almost everyday.  Most of the commercial fishery issues you're talking about are not applicable to us, as we do not target roe.  Everything else you described...I can get a good look at by driving through places all over Grays Harbor Co. (or the US for that matter). 

Based on the words you're putting into my mouth and/or your interpretation of what I think is acceptable or what offends me, I'd say you've paid little attention to any of my posts.  Which is fine, as I give no merit to anything you've posted on this topic either.  Unfortunately resource exploitation is a real thing.  Historically it was not something that existed in Indian country, and it certainly isn't something that is Indian specific today.  What is "silly" to me is how exaggerated and one-sided your posts always are. 

[singleshot12]

Coastal Native can't you admit that you are a little ashamed of what has happened to todays American Indian as a result of the Bolte decision and treaties?  Wouldn't you think your people would be better off in the long run if they lived and played by the same rules as all other Americans?