Official notice that lion changes are on the table for 2020

[Humptulips]

Anybody tell me what the number in parenthesis in Options 3 and 4 of the unit quotas mean?

“Assumed Cougar density per 100 sq km.”


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Thank you, I wonder why some units have such a high number but most have 1.91.

The way  I read it all  of the 4 options have the same exact seasons.
1 counts all cats toward the quota
2 counts only adults
3 counts all cats toward the quota but holds out the possibility of increased quota for units that exceed the quota in the early season
4 counts only adults toward the quota but holds out the possibility of increased quota for units that exceed the quota in the early season.

I have to go with option 4. That being said of the units I know that exceeded the quota in the past I see no evidence of the following through and adding to the quota.
I believe Bango  already pointed this out.

Anybody tell me what the number in parenthesis in Options 3 and 4 of the unit quotas mean?

Do you see any option that has the possibility of an significant increase in harvest? I see some that might have an edge but only the possibility of reducing increases in population, and not by a bunch.  keep in mind only 1/3 of harvest they belive is juvenile.

Significant? I don't think they have any intention to do that.
I think Option 4 has the potential to increase the harvest the most but DFW has to be true to increasing the harvest where  there are proven problems. I'm skeptical.

[hunter399]

Now that I've read the proposal a little more can see these are all new options .

Why are they even changing ,why not just raise quotas where scientifically we have a problem amount of cougar.
One and done.

[bigmacc]

Now that I've read the proposal a little more can see these are all new options .

Why are they even changing ,why not just raise quotas where scientifically we have a problem amount of cougar.
One and done.

I myself don't get it. Cougar numbers have exploded over the last 20 years in this state and even more so in specific areas of the state, like I have mentioned before about the Methow, they are walking down main streets, living under peoples porches, bridges etc. They are killing peoples livestock and pets in increasing numbers over the last 20 years, along with the deer herd being decimated. Sightings are occurring at increasing rates and encounters with humans are increasing. Folks who work, recreate and spend a lot of time in the hills of this valley have seen with their own eyes the growth in numbers of lions. Many I know and myself also, no longer hike, scout or walk in the hills any more without a sidearm, most I know that live in the valley won't even walk their property or walk to their barns without a gun nowadays. Raising quotas would be the absolute right thing and best thing to do in certain areas of this state and it could and should have been done yesterday. Instead they would rather take years and hundreds of thousands of tax payers money to drag out study after study when in reality, in parts of this state, all they need to do is open their eyes to whats happening and open their ears to what people are seeing and experiencing. Decimated deer herds over the last 20 years, livestock and pet attacks on the rise, people killing them under decks and in barns, more and more encounters etc. etc. etc. LIONS HAVE BECOME A PROBLEM! It doesn't take hundreds of thousands of our dollars in drawn out studies to figure this out. All its doing is justifying jobs for folks who really don't seem to care about the hunters and sportsmen/women of this state, and as far as our deer and elk herds, heck, it seems they are just food sources for the predators of this state anymore. The lion issues in this state need to be aggressively addressed, most know this and the ones that don't know it yet, will eventually know it ... .....sorry for the rant.

[Bango skank]

Now that I've read the proposal a little more can see these are all new options .

Why are they even changing ,why not just raise quotas where scientifically we have a problem amount of cougar.
One and done.

I myself don't get it. Cougar numbers have exploded over the last 20 years in this state and even more so in specific areas of the state, like I have mentioned before about the Methow, they are walking down main streets, living under peoples porches, bridges etc. They are killing peoples livestock and pets in increasing numbers over the last 20 years, along with the deer herd being decimated. Sightings are occurring at increasing rates and encounters with humans are increasing. Folks who work, recreate and spend a lot of time in the hills of this valley have seen with their own eyes the growth in numbers of lions. Many I know and myself also, no longer hike, scout or walk in the hills any more without a sidearm, most I know that live in the valley won't even walk their property or walk to their barns without a gun nowadays. Raising quotas would be the absolute right thing and best thing to do in certain areas of this state and it could and should have been done yesterday. Instead they would rather take years and hundreds of thousands of tax payers money to drag out study after study when in reality, in parts of this state, all they need to do is open their eyes to whats happening and open their ears to what people are seeing and experiencing. Decimated deer herds over the last 20 years, livestock and pet attacks on the rise, people killing them under decks and in barns, more and more encounters etc. etc. etc. LIONS HAVE BECOME A PROBLEM! It doesn't take hundreds of thousands of our dollars in drawn out studies to figure this out. All its doing is justifying jobs for folks who really don't seem to care about the hunters and sportsmen/women of this state, and as far as our deer and elk herds, heck, it seems they are just food sources for the predators of this state. The lion issues in this state need to be aggressively addressed, most know this and the ones that don't know it yet, will eventually know it ... .....sorry for the rant.

Theyre still stuck on this "12-16% to maintain the population" nonsense.  What will it take to get it through their heads that that hasnt been working, and the population has been rapidly increasing rather than remaining stable?  What we NEED right now is a significant decrease in the lion population, not a maintenance-level harvest.  Apparently our crashing herds arent enough for them to figure that out.  Apparently the flood of citizen complaints arent enough for them to figure that out.  Apparently the fact that between stevens / p.o. / spokane and lincoln counties, one team of houndsmen killed 69 depredating lions last year.  Thats about one every 5 days, year round!!!  This is indicative of a serious problem!  Either everybody at wdfw has a 65 iq, or they know damn good and well what is going on, and they refuse to address the issue because its "politically volatile" and theyre all a bunch of damn cowards who would rather just keep kicking the can down the road and pretending everything is okay rather than doing what needs to be done and accepting the fact that it will piss certain types off.  The decline of our herds, every attack on pets and livestock, the woman who was killed riding her bike a year or so back, the next person to get killed...  the blame lies on the shoulders of the negligent cowards at wdfw who allow this problem to continue and get worse every day, just so they can avoid any type of political conflict.

[bigmacc]

Now that I've read the proposal a little more can see these are all new options .

Why are they even changing ,why not just raise quotas where scientifically we have a problem amount of cougar.
One and done.

I myself don't get it. Cougar numbers have exploded over the last 20 years in this state and even more so in specific areas of the state, like I have mentioned before about the Methow, they are walking down main streets, living under peoples porches, bridges etc. They are killing peoples livestock and pets in increasing numbers over the last 20 years, along with the deer herd being decimated. Sightings are occurring at increasing rates and encounters with humans are increasing. Folks who work, recreate and spend a lot of time in the hills of this valley have seen with their own eyes the growth in numbers of lions. Many I know and myself also, no longer hike, scout or walk in the hills any more without a sidearm, most I know that live in the valley won't even walk their property or walk to their barns without a gun nowadays. Raising quotas would be the absolute right thing and best thing to do in certain areas of this state and it could and should have been done yesterday. Instead they would rather take years and hundreds of thousands of tax payers money to drag out study after study when in reality, in parts of this state, all they need to do is open their eyes to whats happening and open their ears to what people are seeing and experiencing. Decimated deer herds over the last 20 years, livestock and pet attacks on the rise, people killing them under decks and in barns, more and more encounters etc. etc. etc. LIONS HAVE BECOME A PROBLEM! It doesn't take hundreds of thousands of our dollars in drawn out studies to figure this out. All its doing is justifying jobs for folks who really don't seem to care about the hunters and sportsmen/women of this state, and as far as our deer and elk herds, heck, it seems they are just food sources for the predators of this state. The lion issues in this state need to be aggressively addressed, most know this and the ones that don't know it yet, will eventually know it ... .....sorry for the rant.

Theyre still stuck on this "12-16% to maintain the population" nonsense.  What will it take to get it through their heads that that hasnt been working, and the population has been rapidly increasing rather than remaining stable?  What we NEED right now is a significant decrease in the lion population, not a maintenance-level harvest.  Apparently our crashing herds arent enough for them to figure that out.  Apparently the flood of citizen complaints arent enough for them to figure that out.  Apparently the fact that between stevens / p.o. / spokane and lincoln counties, one team of houndsmen killed 69 depredating lions last year.  Thats about one every 5 days, year round!!!  This is indicative of a serious problem!  Either everybody at wdfw has a 65 iq, or they know damn good and well what is going on, and they refuse to address the issue because its "politically volatile" and theyre all a bunch of damn cowards who would rather just keep kicking the can down the road and pretending everything is okay rather than doing what needs to be done and accepting the fact that it will piss certain types off.  The decline of our herds, every attack on pets and livestock, the woman who was killed riding her bike a year or so back, the next person to get killed...  the blame lies on the shoulders of the negligent cowards at wdfw who allow this problem to continue and get worse every day, just so they can avoid any type of political conflict.

 ......well said Bango........Like I have said many times, this whole cougar explosion and the screwy numbers they keep putting out and expect us to believe is a big ol powder keg and more and more unfortunate encounters involving humans are going to happen and with that more and more tragic encounters like the women on the bike are going to happen. Places like the Methow where more and more people are vacationing, recreating and moving to is where the fuse to the powder keg is becoming very short. I know this whole fiasco is political driven and when unfortunately a little kid is snatched from their back yard or off a trail while hiking with their family I hope someone within the Department stands up and admits something drastic should have been done years ago to drastically thin lion populations........ya right!...

[Humptulips]

You guys make too much sense. You'll never get a job in government that way.