Eastern Elk Management

[Longfield1]

I’ve been seriously hunting elk with a bow for a couple years now in Idaho. I’ve also taken a few online classes that give me a little insight on elk hunting that I’ve never thought about. Specifically, why is the eastern side of the state specifically the Yakima herd managed for age class? Spike only or true spike only means a lot of old bulls die of natural causes and go to waste. The big bull permits might as well be 0 it’s so low. And me as a late hunter would be better off putting points into a lottery ticket instead of trying to catch up.

How long has eastern been spike only? I feel like some hunters and the commission at the time wanted to manage the herds for big antlers instead of opportunities for regular folk.

I’ve read parts of the North American elk book put out by Wyoming years ago and they have quite a few interesting studies. One of them was a 3 year study of changing the management plan to open up any bull in a certain area. Their objective was to see the effect it would have on the herd. They found out at the end that yes there were less big  old bulls but that the herd health did not have a noticeable impact on the population. That younger bulls were still doing the job and that opportunities for regular hunters was much higher.
One of the long term questions was if mostly younger bulls were doing the breeding how would the herd social structure change as well as younger bulls would usually breed cows later than big bulls so calves would be a little younger going into the following winter. I may have gotten some minor details mixed up but that was the gist of it.
So was there a time in Washington when the eastern side wasn’t spike only?

[steeleywhopper]

I remember when 3point minimum on deer and spike only went into effect in the Blues. I believe it was only supposed to be a 3 year deal and here we are now. Pretty sure that was in 1994 or 1995. The "true spike" rule is one that just baffles me and really cannot for the life of me see the good it's doing or has done other than put a bunch of 1x2 elk on the ground to waste.

[RC]

Spikes are for us and the branch bulls are for the tribes.  I don't think a lot of the old bulls are dying of natural causes...

[Longfield1]

Spikes are for us and the branch bulls are for the tribes.  I don't think a lot of the old bulls are dying of natural causes...

After I posted this I thought why else would it be managed and immediately thought about the tribes. Why wouldn’t they want the biggest bulls for only them and not normal hunters. Must of been a behind the scenes deal. Just really unfortunate but in reality, that makes the most sense. If it was hunters wanted bigger elk then they got screwed with point creep and lack of tags. If they gave out 100 or so big bull tags a year that would be better but I think observatory had 1 big bull tag lol.

[Kingofthemountain83]

It really doesn't make sense to me either... I read the Yakima herd is healthy and at management goals... Muzzy in Cowichie got 2 quality any bull tags this year... I seen 12 branch bulls within 400 yards on opening day...

[time2hunt]

It’s to manage people also we have way more hunter than ever also trying to kill a bull. If you turn it to a open to all season you would decimate your herd.


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[nwhunter]

Central Wa elk herds could handle more permits given out but tribal harvest is an unknown number every year so I think that’s a big reason they don’t …YTC has loads of elk and it wasn’t even an option to hunt .. Definitely can’t go back to general over the counter it would be wrecked in one season…

[addicted1]

Because people want to hunt every year, even if it means low success and lots of hunters. Versus a draw system that would allow you to hunt every couple years at best.

[str8meat]

There’s 1.3 elk hunters for every 1 elk in the state of Washington, we have to set hunters up for failure. That came right from the commissioners mouth. So would it be easy to state they being the department of screw everything up is over selling their elk herds and deer herds? Perhaps since the wildlife is an assets like a herd of black angus cattle are to a rancher, then a loan can be taken out on the asset. So did the state take out loans using the wildlife as collateral? Hence the same regulations for 30 plus years with no change. I know this is far fetched and the regular public will never get the truth out of a government official or state employee. So since the state owns the wildlife, our hunting license and tags are the bill of sale so to speak from the state to possess the wildlife, then how is this not a plausible idea that the state has taken loans out against the wildlife, over selling the herd numbers by not limiting tag sales and we the people get to pay the loans back by non stop license sales and poor regulations setting up failure.  Although many hunters may only get to hunt elk every 5-10 years in other states with draw only regulations, some even longer. So do you want to hunt spikes every year with a otc tag or wait years to hunt an elk? Classic case of what don’t ya want.

[trophyhunt]

There is no real management when the tribes can do what they want, and this state is not about to ruffle the (eagle) feathers of the tribes.  Zero limits on deer and elk, and a few bad apples take real advantage of that.   I've always said, OPEN it up to ANY elk, otc or have 500 permits for it.  Once the elk are so far gone, the tribes will be forced to set some rules on themselves.  I'm not kidding at all on this.

[nwwanderer]

More than 30 years for spike only in the SE, any elk, OTC in the NE and those elk have higher calf survival.  Connected?  Complicated, certainly not directly.

[NOCK NOCK]

There is really no plausible reason why more branched permits could not be given out, plenty of them die every year by old age.

Jerry does have a valid perspective IMHO. It would prolly work, but would take quite a few years to get back to any kind of "normal" hunting.

[Henrydog]

I am pretty sure OTC Spike only started in 93, or 94.  About the time dogs were banned for Cougar and Bear and I676 was the first knock at the wall for our gun rights.  Draw your own conclusions.    Putting my tin foil hat back on.

[Pathfinder101]

I think the "spike only" management plan stems from three things; too many hunters, not enough elk, and WDFW wants to keep selling elk tags OTC to everyone who will buy one (because WA hunters kind of demand it). 
I don't think there is anything nefarious about it.  Like you said; there are more elk hunters than there are elk.  I don't think that is going to change.  The only way to sell that many tags, but limit the bull harvest so that it doesn't dip into the carrying capacity is to say "You can have a tag, but you can only shoot a spike". Spike elk are generally easy to identify (even for novice hunters), so it's not a hard policy to enforce (for the most part). 
The only other option would be to change all elk hunting to a draw system.  That would probably manage the elk herds better, but would ruin all those Elk Camp traditions that people have been partaking in for 100 years in WA. 
As for gobs of big bulls dying of old age... probably not.  Like was said earlier; I think the tribes take care of that "problem" for the most part.   

[ShedHead20]

As someone going into the 2026 WA draw with 17 quality elk points and 18 bull points, I would %100 percent loose them all just to go to a draw system that has no points, liberal tag allocations, longer seasons, and the chance to hunt big bulls with any weapon every 2-4 years. I would not hesitate to do the same for mule deer.
Ive always thought to appease all the high point holders (because we all know the guys to complain about “Oh I have all these points cant draw a tag, this state sucks, blah, blah, blah, even though I only apply for the most sought after units in the state with a rifle with almost zero draw odds) that a points cut off would be established in the first couple years of the new draw only system. Meaning, guys with, for example, 15 points and above would get to keep their points in the draw and then guys with less automatically go to zero points and stay that way. After a few years, the guys who kept their points will have much higher chances to draw and will get phased out. Kinda like grandfathering in high point holders. Once a guy drew a tag with points, the next year he would be at zero and stay at zero forever just like everyone else.
This way, the people who have been applying for decades can actually get their tags and keep some hunters happy. Then, after 5-10 years with the new system, everyone would be at a true level playing field with ZERO points. One name – One Chance.