Future of Washington Hunting Season's

[boneaddict]

You can expect to have 100 points or never be drawn if you put in for Little Naches as your top pick.  10 permits and 4,000 people applying for it, or similiar.   Washington will need to revamp, single choice only, things like that.  I would like to see that before putting everyone on a draw.

Some people on here might be surprised about how much I pay attention to big deer and their antlers.   :chuckle:I know a big buck when I see it.  You e-mailed them to me several years ago.  I'd like to see your daughter and her deer, I'll keep my eyes open.  Both are nice, but that one ranks up there as I LOVE mass.

[jae]

I too wish the whole draw process was open to the public with statistic's provided, cripe we couldn't even get last year's harvest result's in time to help us make good decisions on selecting hunts this year. Why the heck do we have a Jan 1 deadline to report if they can't count up the notched tags over a six month period???

I agree!

[bowhuntin]

I think they should change the amount of choices you get from four to one, that would stop people from putting in for hunts they will never use even if they are drawn. Second, if you are going to go to a draw only I would say just do it for rifle since that user group kills the majority of animals and this will still allow those people who want to hunt ever year the opportunity to hunt every year. Last I think the state needs to ban exotic animals like fallow deer and crap because these retards brought in these exotic deer which in turn gave lice to the mule deer populations around E-burg and Yakima and has killed half the deer herd in these areas. Something also would have to be done about the indians if the state went to draw only because you no they aren't going to stop killing animals.

[huntnphool]

Antlershed, your buddy is misinformed. Ask him to disclose his sources when he makes a statement like that. The fact is, the mule deer numbers are as high as they have been in the last 20 years. Here is a quote from http://wdfw.wa.gov/huntcorn.htm go there and read the "weekender report" the quote says;

Hunting: The modern firearm deer hunting season opened Oct. 13 throughout the region. Scott Fitkin, WDFW Okanogan district wildlife biologist, headed up the traditional opening weekend Chewuck check station in the Methow Valley to get a sense of participation and harvest rates. Both were up, Fitkin said, with about 40 percent more hunters stopping by this year compared to last, and the numbers of deer harvested up 26 percent.
"It suggests hunting activity has rebounded from the reduced level we experienced in 2006 during the Tripod wildfire," Fitkin said. "The hunter success rate actually fell slightly from last year, but hunters were generally satisfied. The cooler, wetter weather forecasted could improve harvest opportunity significantly for the second weekend of the season, particularly if snow accumulates at higher elevations."

Deer hunting continues through Oct. 21 throughout the region. Columbia Basin deer hunting potential is good because deer numbers appear to be as high as any time in the past 20 years, said Jim Tabor, WDFW district wildlife biologist. Most, however, occupy private property, so hunters are urged to obtain permission for access.

 My question would be, this obviously hasn't happened in the last two years, when the season was shortened from Oct. 28th to Oct. 21st, so if the numbers are where we want them, why have they backed the season up? I talked to several hunters this year, all complained that there have been no deer the last two years. They hunt all day and see few. The fact is that this time of year the weather hasn't pushed the migrators down to where your average hunter hunts, translating into "no deer". I'll tell you this, the permit holders are not going to be doing any complaining. So lets call it what it really is, the animals are a steady revenue stream for the state. They know where the deer are, and know by backing up the season they are effectively reducing the harvest of mature deer, thereby forcing all of us to spend money on permit applications if we ever want a chance at a real trophy. Then to top it all off, they make the season 9 days long forcing everyone to hunt a short window. I would propose starting the season the 15th of Oct. and letting it go through the first week of November, spreading the amount of pressure. On top of that, make it week days only, no weekends. They do it rather effectively for fishing why not hunting. Give the animals a chance to move, and also give us a chance at seeing a real deer, not some local pet. Of course that won't happen because the revenue from the late hunt permits would decline, and they can't have that can they. Anyhow Antlershed, I didn't mean to go off on you or your buddy, just thought you might like to know the truth, and its in their own words, and a little more of mine;^)..........................rf

[huntnphool]

Bone, here is Daddy's Little Girl this last Sunday morning.

[boneaddict]

I honestly think that would be stupid as hell.  Sorry man.  You wouldn't be shooting any of the caliber of deer that I just posted on here for you.  They would be dead the first year, then you would be looking at little threes again.  The population according to Boneaddicts census is WAY down compared to what it normally is, I don't care what they are thinking.  The increased hunting in the Chewuch is probably due to all of those moving or displaced from the Tripod fire out of Beaver Creek etc, and or the decreased oppurtunity on the valley floor do to the non hunters getting together an dnot allowing access.  Double the amount of hunters and harvest will go up.   We are still recovering from when the WDFW screwed up and had the extended late hunt three years ago or whenever it was.  Thats the other main reason there is little to no big deer harvested this year, they were all slaughtered, which if we did what you suggested, would happen again.  Opening the seaon to several weeks would do little to spread out the hunters, or very little.  They would all come over the hill the last week, instead of the first week.

[huntnphool]

"I honestly think that would be stupid as hell.  Sorry man." Hey, no need to apologize, everyones entitled to their own opinion and I have thick skin. I didn't see your survey but doubt very much its as accurate as the biologist counts on the winter ranges. You cant ignore a physical count of deer compared to a survey, unless of course it was a Husky doing the counting (grin) just kidding guys, don't get your panties in a bunch. Also, I don't think you would see that many hunters change the time they go. Most are probably hunting elk in November as well and wouldn't be able to do both. I think you would see us diehards out there and maybe a few more, the weather would keep a lot from hunting then as well. We used to not even head over until Halloween and that was when Washington had the highest amount of hunters, we didn't see a quarter of the hunters I see over there now. I don't pretend to have the "cure all" but its a joke the way it is now and something needs to be done. I also don't appreciate the state telling me that the numbers are as high as they have been in 20 years and at the same time cut the general season off in the middle of October, effectively forcing me to purchase a raffle ticket for the chance to hunt when I want.................rf

[Antlershed]

Antlershed, your buddy is misinformed. Ask him to disclose his sources when he makes a statement like that. The fact is, the mule deer numbers are as high as they have been in the last 20 years. Here is a quote from http://wdfw.wa.gov/huntcorn.htm go there and read the "weekender report" the quote says;

Using the WDFW weekend report as a primary source doesn't seem too compelling. I don't know what sources WSU uses, but that is where his info came from since he just graduated from there last spring. I know the area where I went grouse hunting this year, we used to see 20-30 deer EVERY day, and multiple legal bucks. This year, the most deer we saw in one day was 2, and not even a buck. The problem there is the Fallow Deer spreading disease, and the increased number of Cougars. You said it yourself that WDFW is contradicting themselves by stating the deer herds are at an all time high but having a short season. Which mis-statement is in their best interest? In the far east part of the state, when the deer (Muleys and whitetail) move down to the lowlands, which is easier for a cougar to catch? Mule deer by far.

[huntnphool]

"when the deer (Muleys and whitetail) move down to the lowlands, which is easier for a cougar to catch? Mule deer by far."

Absolutely, there is another discussion that should be brought up.
I have spoken to WDFW officers and area biologists and all have told me the north central herds are in great shape, I didn't discuss the SE herds. I pointed out the article simply because the majority of people don't take things seriously unless its in black and white, not as my single source of information............rf

[bornforhorns]

No Draw Only!!!!  I will fight that tooth and nail.  Go one choice, successful applicants have a waiting period of 5 years after being drawn or whatever but no draw only!!  Why do we have to be like other states?  How many trophy mulies from november rut hunts does one need is my question?  If you're truly a good hunter do it in October when deer are on an even playing field.  I love the way Washington is doing it...maybe back off on the number of permits for all weapon types...that'll leave'm for the general guys the next year.  Just keep tabs on your populations, hunter success rates, and how bad the winter is and adjust accordingly....Active management is good management.  Why does everybody want to shoot a big mulie next to the road chasing a doe...I don't get it?  They could make us choose a species...we have 3 of them...not including the Columbia Whitetails...although that could be a mess.  Fewer doe permits is another answer.  I like the idea of moving the permits around or spreading them out.  Whatever method gives more than we take than our generation will of done our job for the next...I got a couple young boys I want to see hunt someday.

[Slenk]

WDFW
Have done what they want redusing Elk herds . They have the Yakima herd down from nearly 12,000 to somewhere in the 9,000 head area . The system seems to be working for them . I have hunted this state for over 50 years . Have seen a lot of changes in management and heard numbers . We used to not have any drawing at all . On deer you could not shoot spikes had to be 2 point or better on both antlers . When they started the drawing we went for quit a few years ,you put in for one area . Then they changed it to where if you got drawn you could not put in for 3 years . But you could still only put in for one area.
I think if they would go back to the 3 year draw and leave every thing else like it is it would improve a lot . I personally know a family that one or more of them gets drawn every year . That sucks .
Slenk

[jackelope]

IMO and from what i seen...the southeast mule deer are in rough shape. maybe i'm wrong, i have no evidence or scientific surveys, but there are less and less muleys and more and more whitetails every year. 6 or so years ago when i first hunted down there, we would see 20,30 bucks in a couple days...this year i saw 3 bucks in 3 days. maybe weather related too i guess as it has been 60-70degrees during the hunt the last 2 years.
where i hunt in the blues at 3400' or so...the whitetails pretty much stay put for the winter from what i've seen. the mule deer all go to the snake river low country, but the whitetails seem to stay there.

[50CalJim]

 To Huntinphool, Wea300m & I went to the Antler Tavern Saturday night and I recall seeing your girls pic in their 2007 album, Nice deer. 

[Moosehunt]

Hi All,
This is my first post.....great forum for discussions like this.  I only skimmed this post because I wanted to make a few critical points.  

I just want to comment on the point system that is currently being used in WA.  This is NOT a weighted system.  A weighted point system is one that gives preference to point holders from high to low.  This means someone putting in for the DESERT A hunt with 7 accrued points will always get drawn over someone with 6 and below.  This state employs a lottery point system.  Those with higher point values have more balls in the barrel.  It does not mean someone with 7 points or 49 chances will be chosen over someone with 6 or 36 chances.  Statistically, the odds are more favorable for the person with 7 over someone with 6, that's all.  So in a nutshell, it does not matter what permit hunt you apply for, if you have higher than average points, you will have a higher statistical chance of getting drawn, but it's not a guarantee.

Here-in-lies the reasoning by WA WDFW to do this.....money.  They create a sense of fairness to the uninformed by going overboard to explain the lottery system.  What they fail to represent is the fact that it is not a 'preference/weighted' point system.  You could put in for a permit hunt forever and never get drawn.  Hence, my point about money.  The state benefits because everyone will always throw their $5 bill at a chance of a lifetime.  $5 bills add up.

[Antlershed]

No Draw Only!!!!  I will fight that tooth and nail.  Go one choice, successful applicants have a waiting period of 5 years after being drawn or whatever but no draw only!!  Why do we have to be like other states?  How many trophy mulies from november rut hunts does one need is my question?  If you're truly a good hunter do it in October when deer are on an even playing field.  I love the way Washington is doing it...maybe back off on the number of permits for all weapon types...that'll leave'm for the general guys the next year.  Just keep tabs on your populations, hunter success rates, and how bad the winter is and adjust accordingly....Active management is good management. 

I only put in for one permit choice anyway, so that is fine with me.I was just using Oregon as an example, not that we had to be like them. Nobody said all the permit hunts would have to be "November rut hunts". How else can the WDFW manage the population if it is getting too low? It is already 3-point minimum. The only other way I see is going to permit only to reduce the number of hunters in their. This isn't to turn everything into "Trophy Hunting", in my mind anyway...it is to help the population get back to where it used to be. If the populations recovered, they could always return to a general season.