Winston Unit January 2013 Cow Hunt

[actionshooter]

Thinning the herd is going to be the only way to get rid of the hoof rot. And yes, its bad right now.
 I'm guessing the herd is going to crash bad over the next 5 years and then make a comeback.
 400 tags is better than letting them die slow.

[actionshooter]

OH-YA
 This thread is halarious, some people just bring it on themselves.......

[sirmissalot]

Anyone here of the elk there having hoof rot. My dad sent a picture of a elk foot from one that was taken there this year. It was really bad and i guess a lot of the elk were barely able to walk

There is at least one thread entirely on hoof rot. Yes it's bad. My bull in the Margaret high country had it but not nearly that bad and only in one hind hoof.

[FullDraw]

Do people still eat those things if they have hoof rot. Has anyone heard if you are supposed too or not

[skywalker253]

I agree. I read a news feed that stated the game department worked a deal with Weyhauser to cut the elk herd in the Winston, Margret, Coweeman, and Toutle GMU's by like 47%. Don't hold me to the percentage, but it was a lot. I know there is a lot of elk down there, but I don't think it justifies such a large cut to the population. Way too many special permits are being given out in deer and elk areas across the state. I fear between, disease, predators (wolves/cougars), weather changes, large amounts of hunters, etc. that Wa state could be heading for dark times in certain deer and elk areas across the state.

[MarvinS1958]

I stopped by a Rangers office to ask about the extra Special Permits.  I asked why so many?  The answer was:  "The elk are starving and they don't even know it.  Their belly are full, but full of the wrong foods and their not putting on (enough) fat to survive the winter. (The spraying of the clear cuts eliminate the broadleaf they need) So they are reducing the herds. 

I am curious Is there a limit as to the percentage of clearcuts the can be sprayed? 

[skywalker253]

Sounds reasonable. The article I read, said Weyhauser has been complaining to the game department, over damages to the forest. Specifically the smaller trees being horned down by bulls, and the elk herds killing off the new growth in the clear cuts. Basically said there is too many elk (surplus) to survive within the area. I'm no expert or biologist, but that seems like a BS excuse. There is plenty of forest, and I am not convinced that every section of timber is loaded with elk trying to find food. There is a lot of elk in those areas, but it's not like hunters have a great success rate of harvesting an elk. Most guys are lucky to even see an elk, let alone try and find 3 points to kill one. Seems like it is more about generating more special permits, to issue more tag, to bring in more money. Perhaps I am worng?

[cem3434]

Sounds reasonable. The article I read, said Weyhauser has been complaining to the game department, over damages to the forest. Specifically the smaller trees being horned down by bulls, and the elk herds killing off the new growth in the clear cuts. Basically said there is too many elk (surplus) to survive within the area. I'm no expert or biologist, but that seems like a BS excuse. There is plenty of forest, and I am not convinced that every section of timber is loaded with elk trying to find food. There is a lot of elk in those areas, but it's not like hunters have a great success rate of harvesting an elk. Most guys are lucky to even see an elk, let alone try and find 3 points to kill one. Seems like it is more about generating more special permits, to issue more tag, to bring in more money. Perhaps I am worng?

Weyco wants the numbers reduced and WDFW wants more revenue.....its that simple!

[actionshooter]

Sounds reasonable. The article I read, said Weyhauser has been complaining to the game department, over damages to the forest. Specifically the smaller trees being horned down by bulls, and the elk herds killing off the new growth in the clear cuts. Basically said there is too many elk (surplus) to survive within the area. I'm no expert or biologist, but that seems like a BS excuse. There is plenty of forest, and I am not convinced that every section of timber is loaded with elk trying to find food. There is a lot of elk in those areas, but it's not like hunters have a great success rate of harvesting an elk. Most guys are lucky to even see an elk, let alone try and find 3 points to kill one. Seems like it is more about generating more special permits, to issue more tag, to bring in more money. Perhaps I am worng?

Weyco wants the numbers reduced and WDFW wants more revenue.....its that simple!

Not really, There are too many elk.

I'll make it simple

Elk eat grass
mountain go boom
timber companies log lots
grass everywhere
elk multiply
trees grow back
timber companies slow logging
not enough food for lots of elk
They starve or we get to hunt them

 Hows that for simple?

[cem3434]

I wish it was that simple, but its not.  Cutting the herd by almost 50% isn't management. 

[sirmissalot]

I'd say it was a pretty good summary

[billythekidrock]

I wish it was that simple, but its not.  Cutting the herd by almost 50% isn't management. 

If the habitat can't support the current amount of elk, then thinning the herd to an appropriate level is the right thing to do.

What do you want them to do, plant elk food on a commercial tree farm? Build fences to keep them out residential areas?

Sometime carring capacity is reached and they need to get thinned. I would rather they let us do it before the wolves get in there.

[SI Eagle]

Sounds reasonable. The article I read, said Weyhauser has been complaining to the game department, over damages to the forest. Specifically the smaller trees being horned down by bulls, and the elk herds killing off the new growth in the clear cuts. Basically said there is too many elk (surplus) to survive within the area. I'm no expert or biologist, but that seems like a BS excuse. There is plenty of forest, and I am not convinced that every section of timber is loaded with elk trying to find food. There is a lot of elk in those areas, but it's not like hunters have a great success rate of harvesting an elk. Most guys are lucky to even see an elk, let alone try and find 3 points to kill one. Seems like it is more about generating more special permits, to issue more tag, to bring in more money. Perhaps I am worng?

Weyco wants the numbers reduced and WDFW wants more revenue.....its that simple!

Not really, There are too many elk.

I'll make it simple

Elk eat grass
mountain go boom
timber companies log lots
grass everywhere
elk multiply
trees grow back
timber companies slow logging
not enough food for lots of elk
They starve or we get to hunt them

 Hows that for simple?

It would be that simple if it was true.  I have hunted the Winston Unit for well over 30 years and I doubt there are 10 people on this site that have spent much more time in the Unit then I have. I have NEVER seen a starving elk in the Winston and I don't know anyone who has. The bottom line is Weyco wants them reduced and the state is complying. It is that simple.

[SI Eagle]

I wish it was that simple, but its not.  Cutting the herd by almost 50% isn't management. 

If the habitat can't support the current amount of elk, then thinning the herd to an appropriate level is the right thing to do.

What do you want them to do, plant elk food on a commercial tree farm? Build fences to keep them out residential areas?

 
Sometime carring capacity is reached and they need to get thinned. I would rather they let us do it before the wolves get in there.

Where is any of this happening in the Winston Unit??  Maybe Weyco and WDFW having been dropping fliers from the sky and you guys are buying the propaganda or maybe you just got done reading about it in the Enquirer?  Now I am going to probably hear that a friend, of a friends, uncles, brother in law knows of hundreds of starving elk that are trampling homes on the way in search of food. Wake up and ealize that all the cow tags are killing the hunting. You should be more worried about hunting 10 years from now and how it will be rather than how you have to fill your tag this year. This is going to set the Unit back years and years.

[billythekidrock]

SI Eagle.

I would think that this would qualify as starving...would you not? This Winston January cow did not have any fat on it and it was losing muscle mass. These photos show where a tender backstrap should have been. Not a mass of sinew and stringy muscle.





The fact is, most of the Winston cannot carry this many elk for much longer. The bubble has burst and it will never be the same again.