An 'ex-WA elk hunter' speaks

[boneaddict]

I do really miss those days, though, so enjoyed the read.

[boneaddict]

I would take an old international scout, a wool shirt and pants, a pair of tascos, and an ole lever action 30-30 if it would bring back those days.  Just remember folks, we all contributed to this and are still doing it. 

[Sitka_Blacktail]

There's a lot of uproar over here about the Wild Olympics campaign, but I'm all for it. I'd much rather see forest land as public land than as private land opened at the whim of a logging company. Now that I've hunted the National forests of Eastern Washington, I appreciate the access they provide.

Amen! Make it public and protected! Habitat loss is *THE THREAT* to hunting!

Private forests have the best habitat and resource management.

The best habitat for what? Mushrooms?

Monoculture, spraying the equivalent of roundup, crowded forests that don't let in the light, mud filled streams caused by erosion and other problems on "managed" tree farms do not equate to the best habitat for deer and elk and other forest creatures. In western Washington, the habitat was much better back in the 60s and 70s before private tree farms went to "modern management".

[bugs n bones]

Well put dave.....and boneaddict is right, we all contributed to this and still are. If we all got together and quit buying a license change would happen.

[KFhunter]

There's a lot of uproar over here about the Wild Olympics campaign, but I'm all for it. I'd much rather see forest land as public land than as private land opened at the whim of a logging company. Now that I've hunted the National forests of Eastern Washington, I appreciate the access they provide.

Amen! Make it public and protected! Habitat loss is *THE THREAT* to hunting!

Private forests have the best habitat and resource management.

The best habitat for what? Mushrooms?

Monoculture, spraying the equivalent of roundup, crowded forests that don't let in the light, mud filled streams caused by erosion and other problems on "managed" tree farms do not equate to the best habitat for deer and elk and other forest creatures. In western Washington, the habitat was much better back in the 60s and 70s before private tree farms went to "modern management".

You haven't seen the "this area has been sprayed for noxious weeds blah blah" signs on the CNF?

[bugs n bones]

Unfortunately in are very liberal state we can write  and vote till the world comes to an end, it will never change with are dems in charge. Back in the day we didn't have bullchit cougar studies and predator problems, the houndmen were allowed to keep them in check for us. We could bait bears to keep them out of the towns, we could use leghold traps at are own discretion to alleviate nuisance trapping problems and for are own recreation. Most of all there was a reason why all the wolves were killed before, atleast in idaho , montana ....etc there taking action.. it will be too late before we as hunters are allowed to hunt wolves here in this state. I spoke with a warden not to long ago that said....quote.....were not in business to manage the game anymore, it the people were managing.

[mlovely83]

I have mixed emotions about this topic. I truly believe that the state should allow hunters to purchase a tag for each of the 3 seasons. I also believe its a joke that you have to chose eastern or western for elk.

As for the special draw permits; I like the idea of special quality hunt drawings. It allows for greater high success hunts.

Adversely, I archery hunt the Western side no more than 20 miles from my home. The last 3 years I have taken a cow in late season. In the early season of those years I had my chances at a quality bull. This year I was successful and took down a 6x6.

The moral of this story is Elk hunting is typically a very difficult, buts the reason why I love it. Those "hunters" that want the wall hanger and hunt merely for the antlers can pay to go out of state and hunt a high fence. I however hunt to feed my family and with time and effort I have been successful every year.

Hunting is not a passion, Its an obsession!   

[huntnphool]

I agree with a lot of the article, but there's another side too. Part of the reason we are where we are now is because it was so good back then. The success and liberal seasons brought big crowds and reduced bull/cow ratios. Something had to be done to fix that, so management changed. Also, Natives hadn't started asserting their treaty rights, which is another factor modern managers have to deal with now.

On the west side, changing logging practices have affected the herds in areas that were once prime. Not to mention access to forest lands has greatly been reduced. There's a lot of uproar over here about the Wild Olympics campaign, but I'm all for it. I'd much rather see forest land as public land than as private land opened at the whim of a logging company. Now that I've hunted the National forests of Eastern Washington, I appreciate the access they provide.

GPS, hunting forums, dependable 4 wheel drives, rangefinders, optics, weapons that shoot 1000 yards, better calls, trailcameras, satellite, googleearth/maps, and other technologies many welcome...haven't helped.  Throw the wolf agenda and native hunting pressure (ebay and the like).

With the exception of GPS and the internet, our equipement has not changed that dramatically since the 1985 hunting seasons. Certainly not enough to justify the changes in the seasons since then, especially with the decrease of hunters over the same time period.

[boneaddict]

Really?   This forum, internet(I know you mentioned these, but I think these have really impacted things), are your Swaros pre 1985.  How about cellphones? Pretty easy to see a buck and get a pic to a friend in less than 10 seconds, except for those of us who haven't gotten a cell yet.   Got any Sitka gear, Kifaru or whatever they call it.   Don't think compounds have upgraded since 85?  How about Muzzeloaders.  Factory ammo hasn't improved?  When did carbon arrows become the norm?   How about Quads.   I don't recall a lot of Razors running around back in the 80s.   

[boneaddict]

by the way, that's just part of it.  I think forest management (logging practices) as mentioned, habitat loss by both greenies and those of us that want to live on the mountain,  predator management or the lack there of all are putting the nail in the coffin

[Pilot_Hunter]

Yeah the natives have wiped out so much wildlife in the little natches. 

[huntnphool]

Really?   This forum, internet(I know you mentioned these, but I think these have really impacted things), are your Swaros pre 1985.  How about cellphones? Pretty easy to see a buck and get a pic to a friend in less than 10 seconds, except for those of us who haven't gotten a cell yet.   Got any Sitka gear, Kifaru or whatever they call it.   Don't think compounds have upgraded since 85?  How about Muzzeloaders.  Factory ammo hasn't improved?  When did carbon arrows become the norm?   How about Quads.   I don't recall a lot of Razors running around back in the 80s.   

I mentioned the internet and no my Swaro's are not circa '85 but I did have quality optics for the time.

My first cell phone was in about '87, but even today I don't use my cell phone to hunt with (AT&T service is spotty at best), although I do carry it for emergency purposes, no advantage for me since then.

I don't own any Sitka or Kifaru (sp) gear so it too has never given me a advantage.

I have never shot a deer/elk with archery gear past 30 yards, even way back in '85 trads and compounds were capable of performing at this distance.

I have only shot one animal in my life with a muzzy,(this year) it was open sites, exposed nipple, non sabot, not much different than what was available in '85.

I have never shot a deer/elk with a rifle further than 500 yards, factory ammo in '85 was plenty capable of performing at this range way back then.

I have never hunted from a quad or side by side, and yes similar toys were available back in "85, some would even argue they had less restrictions on them than today, again not a big difference from '85.

So, to answer your questions, and to reiterate my point, things have not changed "that dramatically" since 1985, certainly not enough for them to justify the season changes.  

[Sitka_Blacktail]

Really?   This forum, internet(I know you mentioned these, but I think these have really impacted things), are your Swaros pre 1985.  How about cellphones? Pretty easy to see a buck and get a pic to a friend in less than 10 seconds, except for those of us who haven't gotten a cell yet.   Got any Sitka gear, Kifaru or whatever they call it.   Don't think compounds have upgraded since 85?  How about Muzzeloaders.  Factory ammo hasn't improved?  When did carbon arrows become the norm?   How about Quads.   I don't recall a lot of Razors running around back in the 80s.   

I mentioned the internet and no my Swaro's are not circa '85 but I did have quality optics for the time.

My first cell phone was in about '87, but even today I don't use my cell phone to hunt with (AT&T service is spotty at best), although I do carry it for emergency purposes, no advantage for me since then.

I don't own any Sitka or Kifaru (sp) gear so it too has never given me a advantage.

I have never shot a deer/elk with archery gear past 30 yards, even way back in '85 trads and compounds were capable of performing at this distance.

I have only shot one animal in my life with a muzzy,(this year) it was open sites, exposed nipple, non sabot, not much different than what was available in '85.

I have never shot a deer/elk with a rifle further than 500 yards, factory ammo in '85 was plenty capable of performing at this range way back then.

I have never hunted from a quad or side by side, and yes similar toys were available back in "85, some would even argue they had less restrictions on them than today, again not a big difference from '85.

So, to answer your questions, and to reiterate my point, things have not changed "that dramatically" since 1985, certainly not enough for them to justify the season changes.

You haven't, but how about the average hunter?

[combs338]

Really?   This forum, internet(I know you mentioned these, but I think these have really impacted things), are your Swaros pre 1985.  How about cellphones? Pretty easy to see a buck and get a pic to a friend in less than 10 seconds, except for those of us who haven't gotten a cell yet.   Got any Sitka gear, Kifaru or whatever they call it.   Don't think compounds have upgraded since 85?  How about Muzzeloaders.  Factory ammo hasn't improved?  When did carbon arrows become the norm?   How about Quads.   I don't recall a lot of Razors running around back in the 80s.   

I mentioned the internet and no my Swaro's are not circa '85 but I did have quality optics for the time.

My first cell phone was in about '87, but even today I don't use my cell phone to hunt with (AT&T service is spotty at best), although I do carry it for emergency purposes, no advantage for me since then.

I don't own any Sitka or Kifaru (sp) gear so it too has never given me a advantage.

I have never shot a deer/elk with archery gear past 30 yards, even way back in '85 trads and compounds were capable of performing at this distance.

I have only shot one animal in my life with a muzzy,(this year) it was open sites, exposed nipple, non sabot, not much different than what was available in '85.

I have never shot a deer/elk with a rifle further than 500 yards, factory ammo in '85 was plenty capable of performing at this range way back then.

I have never hunted from a quad or side by side, and yes similar toys were available back in "85, some would even argue they had less restrictions on them than today, again not a big difference from '85.

So, to answer your questions, and to reiterate my point, things have not changed "that dramatically" since 1985, certainly not enough for them to justify the season changes.

Well said.

[snowpack]

I'd agree with what huntnphool laid out.  Most of those things haven't really changed enough in my opinion to really significantly impact the harvest.  Someone on here posted that success is basically where skill meets opportunity.  Most of those items (clothes/scents/optics/ammo/carbon arrows/new bow tech) tend to lower the skill required---i.e. a 1985 archer likely needed a little more practice for a 65 yd shot than a 2013 archer with advanced equipment.  I knew plenty of people than and now using core-lokts from an '06 shooting 300+ yds.  But I don't see those items as dramatically increasing the opportunity.  I'd agree that the forums, Google earth, GPS and online magazines are getting the info out there to get the people into areas of more opportunity.  And where those items have REALLY impacted is fishing, but that's a different topic.