Seeking advice from experienced winter campers

[MLHSN]

A bag like this would be a nice catch when it goes on clearance.

http://www.golite.com/Mens-Z10-Three-Season-Regular-P46945.aspx

The pertex shell really helps repel water.  There are a lot of good bags out there with synthetic insulation also.  The difference is only going to be 1/2-1 pound from a synthetic bag.  If you are going to be camping near a truck and not 10 mi. back in I would say go with a cheap and heavy bag that will be comfy and warm.  I have my car camping sleeping bags and I have my backpacking bags.  It's really important to check user reviews.  I've used high-end bags that were supposedly 20 deg. bags and I froze my arse off at 30 deg.  User reviews are usually a pretty good indicator of whether the bag is true to it's advertised temp rating.

edit:  One other trick I do:  I have a 40 deg.ultralight bag and a 20 deg. ultralight bag.  The 20 deg. bag is my usual go to.  During the winter time I just take both and flop the the 40 deg bag over the top of my 20 deg bag.  It's a lot cheaper combo them having a summer and winter bag.  It's also not that much of a weight difference in the end.

[Wild Bill]

edit:  One other trick I do:  I have a 40 deg.ultralight bag and a 20 deg. ultralight bag.  The 20 deg. bag is my usual go to.  During the winter time I just take both and flop the the 40 deg bag over the top of my 20 deg bag.  It's a lot cheaper combo them having a summer and winter bag.  It's also not that much of a weight difference in the end.

See, We agree on things!
Lol... Great tip. I do the same. If it ends up not being cold enough for the combo, its now a real comfy add on to the mattresses.

A big thing, when you are cold camping your most likely running heavy anyhow. Whats another pound. Especially the one time on your trip when you could be comfortable! Sleeping.

MLHSN,
Do you not run into bad condensation with your down bags? I am beginning to wonder if its more of person using the bag issue. I always have a wet down bag buy the end of a 3 nighter.  Even if its not in a bivy, i usually end up with a very noticeable amount of condensation.
Truth be told I only use down in mid summer months or in a camper/wall ten situation now!

Keep the tips coming.
This is a good one.

WB

[kisfish]

tag

[Expedition Scout]

You can also pick up a fleece liner for cheap to extend the life of any bag. your sweet and grim then ends up on the liner that can be easily washed at the end, and it will provide extra warmth at night. I will pull out the liner in the morning and setup to dry during the day so the next night i'm dry sleeping. Try to have enough surface area covered from the wet weather so you don't have to pack a wet bag away. Let it air out during the day as well, just make sure it will stay dry and not get wet with weather moving in.

[MLHSN]

WB, are you getting condensation on the outside or inside?  I've had decent condensation on the outside of the bag, but like I said earlier, the pertex causes water to just bead on the outside of the bag.  My biggest enemy is sweating, I often have to leave the bag a little unzipped or leave my hat off until I wake up cold and then zip up and put my wool cap on.  Otherwise,  I sweat between 10-12 pm.  Then freeze from then on because I'm soaked,  I would rather wake up slightly discomforted with a quick fix then be soaked in sweat and not be able to do anything about it.

[Wild Bill]

Its outside.
Never have a problem with synthetic. Just down.

WB

[ICEMAN]

Remember guys, your body expells about a quart of water out your skin pores each night while you sleep. This is to retain the skins proper moisture level (Rh). As stated earlier, this is compounded when you are in an cold (arid) environment. Moisture meant to keep your skin moist, is lost into the bag and begins to travel through the material of your sleeping bag. The moisture will slow down and stop at the point in the bag where the material is no longer warm from your body, the moisture vapor stops moving here and condenses. In mild temperatures, you see this every morning in the tent as water droplets all over the inside of your tent. This is the coldest area, the surface of your tent wall... Breath and moisture lost through your pores...  In colder winter camping, this moisture will often stop and refreeze on the surface of your bag, or inside the material at some point.


Moisture condensating and staying in a sleeping bag is a big problem for those camping over snow. The insulative value of a sleeping bag degrades each night that it is used unless it gets the chance to dry out some how. (This is why manmade fiber bags are a favorite for really cold weather, since they dry out better daily, and goose down bags take more time to dry.) Iditarod racers commonly end the race with sleeping bags that weighs much more than when they started. Trapped frozen water vapor...  Mountain climbers fight this phenomena by sleeping inside a vapor proof liner inside their sleeping bag. This reduces the amount of water they need to consume since the skin gets moist and stops pumping water to the skins surface, plus it keeps their bag insulative value high, as no moisture becomes trapped in the fibers.

My family and I have winter camped in temperatures as low as 5 degrees with some relatively cheap sleeping bags, synthetic, rated -20 etc...

I prefer to sleep on elcheapo foam sleeping pads. We sleep on two layers of these. In our tent, we criss cross the pads so no cold spots show up in the middle of the night...

We also incorporate an unusual addition to our sleeping gear. I add something commercially sold as a beach blanket type "thingy".  The item is called a "Neat Sheet". It is basically a water proof, but moisture venting type sheet to picnic on at the beach. Lightweight and soft, each sleeper has one of these thrown over their sleeping bags. The extra layer seems to trap heat loss through your sleeping bag, and creates an extra layer of warmth IMHO.... We use these alot during snow camp, as you can toss one over your shoulders if you begin to chill, sit on one to keep your rear dry, etc....

Can't wait to return to snow camping!

[wafisherman]

Yes, tossing a light weight fleece or other type of blanket over the top helps.  I also like the inside liner idea too.

I have an RIE down bag I got on clearance years ago and love it for cold weather camping.  Thouht I rarely camp more than 2-3 nights in a row with it, so don't know know if it would lose efficiency with more days.  I just keep it off the ground, keep it away from the tent walls as much as I can, and often find myself venting it to cool down a bit - even if it is 20 degrees out.

As for what to wear, I believe it would be best to use a fleece liner, and sleep in as little clothing as possible, but in practice, I find that hard to do.  First of all, I often have to get up and pee at least once.  I figure i climb in around 6-7pm, and wake around 12 hours later.  Even if you stay up to play cards or something, you still want to be in your bag.  So when you need to get up and pee, I like to just slip on my boots or camp shoes and take care of business.  Maybe throw on a jacket layer, but often not.  Fleece pants, long sleeve fleece or other non cotton shirt - dry wool blend socks, and a stocking cap. This is also good because I find I stay warm enough I don't feel the need to zip up to full mummy mode and breath inside the bag resulting in condensation issues.  That linter or tap cover blanket can be pulled up around my head\face if needed.

[Coreym8565]

Heading out tonight. I feel a lot more confident about my trip now, and I thank all of you who have shared your wisdom with, me. It is greatly appreciated

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