Identify the killer?

[bearpaw]

100% sure it was a cougar. They go for the organs first and can open animals with precision using their incisors. If it was wolves the area would be torn up and the coyote in pieces. Google wolf kills, then click on  "Images" and it will be crystal clear it wasn't wolves.

My field experience tells me this coyote kill probably wasn't done by a cougar. If a cougar makes a kill yes he chews through the ribs right behind the shoulder and eats the liver. However, when he chews through the ribs he eats the ribs that were in his way. Later, when the cougar returns and eats more flesh he also eats most bones while eating the flesh. I have never seen a cougar kill on deer or elk where the cat left the rib bones, in my experience they always eat the bones too.

We have found cougar killed coyotes and also had numerous hounds killed by cougar. In every instance 1 of 2 things happened.
1. The dog was bitten in the head (skull crushed) and left otherwise untouched. The dog was killed by the cat out of anger or in defense.
2. The dog/coyote was mostly eaten (including the bones) because the cat was hungry.

I have also seen quite a few farm animals killed by cougar. I have never seen a cougar kill any animal and eat all the flesh and leave all the bones. I am reasonably certain if a cougar killed that coyote he would have eaten the rib bones when he ate through the side to eat the organs and when the cat ate the rest of the meat it would have eaten most if not all of the rib bones too.

On the other hand, there re plenty of photos of wolf kills where they meticulously remove the fetus from elk and only eat the fetus and sometimes even leave the fetus.

I'm not sure what killed this coyote, but I would say 99% chance that a cougar did not do it.

Cougars are not bone eaters as their intestinal track is relatively short and inefficiant. That is why they open the stomach cavity just below the rib cage and roll out the organs first in most cases. It's fast and the highest calorie/nutrient food is there. (Important when other predators may be present and time is of the essence.)
 I have walked past numberous cougar kills while trapping bobcats/coyotes on a regular basis. With snow on the ground you get to see what is actually feeding. A chain of evidence so to speak.  Not until the coyotes have shown up have I ever seen the ribcage disappear.

As for wounds around the neck, a cougar can break a coyotes neck in his jaws without puncturing the hide. A tight grip and the momentum/weight  of the cougar is enough.

The canines I have seen killed by cougar were bit in the head and their skull crushed.


Of all the fresh cougar kills of various animals I have seen if the cat ate anything they have almost always eaten through the ribs (including the ribs) and then ate the organs. On older kills where the cougar has fed for several days they often eat most of the bones including all the ribs, much of the spine, much of the leg bones, most of the skull, and even most of the skin, it appears that they spit out the hair. These were my observations at cougar kills.

I think some of the comments in this topic are misleading and based on limited experience. For those who like internet verification, please see this info from WDFW regarding what cougar eat: http://wdfw.wa.gov/living/cougars.html

Droppings
 Cougars generally cover their droppings with loose soil. When visible, their droppings typically resemble those of most species in the dog and cat families. However, cougars have well developed premolars that can slice through bone and hide. Therefore, their droppings often show chunks and fragments of chewed bone and considerable hair from the hide. Members of the dog family gnaw on bones but usually don’t chew them up  into cut fragments.

[supagoose]

Bearpaw this was a little 3x3 that I shot during archery a few years ago. From the time I shot it to when I found it was no more the 1 hour. A cougar got to it before I did and yes I did see the cougar watching me then sneaking away.

[bearpaw]

Thanks for posting the photo showing how a cougar eats through the side of an animal to get to the organs. 

Notice how the rib bones are chewed off the side of the deer! If you look at the coyote kill photo you do not see the ribs chewed off like this, rather they are picked clean, that leads me to believe that a cougar did not make that kill.

[Evil_EdwardO]

I keep thinking bird...not sure why but I keep envisioning a big ass bird eviscerating that dog....something about the entrail removal says birds....now I can see a bear doing the neck snapping and intitial killing.....I used to rid a horse that had been mauled by a bear ...yes the mauling was witnessed and the bear was killed.....but the bear grabbed the mare at the withers/base of neck,  the cougar kills I know of its always been head/neck...and wolves/dogs its usually flanks/hindquarters.  So based on my limited knowledge i would buy the bear kill...but think the majority of organ removal was done by birds

In think the big ass bird and the funny looking bear are in cahoots. Look how they are going for the head and aren't even crushing it. The funny bear probably sucked the guts out with his funny nose and left the ribs intact.

[JJB11B]

Very interesting...Seems someone always jumps on and defends wolves every time one of these threads pops up...

[fishinmike]

BIGFOOT !!

 

[Coastal_native]

I am 100% certain that this thread is hilarious.  If I'm ever in need of an expert, I always know there's a few thousand on this forum ready and willing to answer my questions with a high degree of certainty.

That being said, I'm 100% certain that it was the butler, in the library, with a candle stick...that killed that coyote.

In any other thread where wolves are not mentioned you can find very good knowledge on this forum, but as soon as one person mentions "wolf" it shows up on a forum search and here comes the wolf advocates to misdirect the thread until you end up with something like this thread.

That was just me trying to be funny.  I get a lot of great information from this forum, too.  To be honest, I was about to weigh in with my expert opinion, but then I thought "nah, these guys got it under control.  I'll fill the role of the sarcastic jerk in this thread" 

I initially thought it was a cougar too.  From what I've seen investigating cougar kills on our study out here, they're like surgeons.  I've seen a few elk calves that were peeled like bananas.  The inside of the hide was clean as can be and the cuts were pretty darn straight. 

[Brad Harshman]

Doesn't make since to me a cat chasing a coyote off a carcass for a good ways, then eating a coyote over moose??? 
Cat wouldn't have taken down the moose unless it was a small sickly one? OP doesn't say what the moose is. 
Most likely scenario for a cat to feed on a moose would be someone either someone shot it or it died on it's own - possible but improbable.

What doesn't make sense is a pack of wolves killing a moose, then killing a coyote, partially eating it in a fairly un-messy way and then leave the moose carcass for other coyotes to enjoy.

What makes more sense is the moose died for some reason, possibly a gunshot wound and it drew in scavengers. And a lion took the opportunity to ambush a coyote. If wolves had made the kill on the moose, I seriously doubt they'd have given it up to a bunch of coyotes.

OP never mentioned the size or the sex of the moose or how it appeared to have died and how much had been eaten. That might tell us something.

I agree, it really sounds like a cougar killed the yote.  But I caution drawing conclusions without any evidence.  We never got any information or pictures of the moose so we can't postulate how it died.

Fun thread though.

[nwwanderer]

Read this a few days ago.  The last picture shows some sign of puncture wounds on the yote neck.  I think something big (bear I suppose since the bigfoot would have kept the hide for a head warmer), caught the dog by the neck, stepped on his hind quarters and pulled it apart.  For whatever reason, full belly, spooked or just a goofy bear, it walked away.  Birds did the cleanup.  Checkout treekillers bear at the rubbing post, a good illustration of the technique.