Barnes TMZ not expanding

[Chukarhead]

Hey Chukarhead, where did you hit the broadside cows? I ask because I have shot 2 cows broadside. One at 70 and one at 100 and both shots passed through. Both were lung hits. I only use 90gr of ff through my bighorn. Was curious why yours stayed in and mine didn't, even with less powder?

The 2011 cow was pretty far back... a little embarrassing, really.  Behind the ribs, but she only went about 50 yards and piled up.  The '13 cow was hit about 2" above the heart, double-lung.  Both bullets were caught in the far side hide.  The bullet from the bull actually passed through, but my buddies found it on the spur two weeks later while hunting.  From their description, it went about 25-50 yards past the bull before coming to rest.  Two other broadside shots inside of 50 yards from other members of our group have been pass-throughs.  One thing we've noticed over the years is that the bullets don't tend to travel very straight once inside of an animal.  They veer or bounce around quite a bit, which makes sense when you look at the final shape of the bullets.  We've had 90 degree broadside, behind-the-shoulder shots perforate the diaphragm.  On the upside, animals don't go far.  On the downside, you're never sure where that bullet is going to stop.

Edit: now that I think some more about it, yours might have passed through because they didn't expand, maintained more energy, and zipped through.  If I recall correctly (this is a stretch), Barnes says that the bullets require about 1300 fps to expand reliably, and you may not be getting that with 90gr of FFP at those ranges.  We pack 120-130 gr. for deer and elk just to make sure that we reliably hit the higher velocities recommended.  Knight's recommended loads with the Barnes bullets (Red Hots) tend to be 150 grains in pellet form, which are pretty zippy.

[carpsniperg2]

I have been around dozens of deer killed with them same bullet and all have preformed very well. I do agree with chukar and have had the same things happen to us. The way they open they really do weird things when they start to open. I have never seen one not open up like that.

[erk444]

Hey Chukarhead, where did you hit the broadside cows? I ask because I have shot 2 cows broadside. One at 70 and one at 100 and both shots passed through. Both were lung hits. I only use 90gr of ff through my bighorn. Was curious why yours stayed in and mine didn't, even with less powder?

The 2011 cow was pretty far back... a little embarrassing, really.  Behind the ribs, but she only went about 50 yards and piled up.  The '13 cow was hit about 2" above the heart, double-lung.  Both bullets were caught in the far side hide.  The bullet from the bull actually passed through, but my buddies found it on the spur two weeks later while hunting.  From their description, it went about 25-50 yards past the bull before coming to rest.  Two other broadside shots inside of 50 yards from other members of our group have been pass-throughs.  One thing we've noticed over the years is that the bullets don't tend to travel very straight once inside of an animal.  They veer or bounce around quite a bit, which makes sense when you look at the final shape of the bullets.  We've had 90 degree broadside, behind-the-shoulder shots perforate the diaphragm.  On the upside, animals don't go far.  On the downside, you're never sure where that bullet is going to stop.

Edit: now that I think some more about it, yours might have passed through because they didn't expand, maintained more energy, and zipped through.  If I recall correctly (this is a stretch), Barnes says that the bullets require about 1300 fps to expand reliably, and you may not be getting that with 90gr of FFP at those ranges.  We pack 120-130 gr. for deer and elk just to make sure that we reliably hit the higher velocities recommended.  Knight's recommended loads with the Barnes bullets (Red Hots) tend to be 150 grains in pellet form, which are pretty zippy.

Dang, I never thought about that. I have recovered 2 from other elk that were perfect though. One was 72 yards quartering to me, and the other was about 90 yards quartering away. I might try to bump up my powder though cause its a good point. I have noticed the bullet exiting in a strange place too. My deer was almost perfect broadside this year. I hit him a little far back, and the bullet came out near his back leg I just shrugged it off as him being more quartered than I thought, but now you got me thinking.

[buckreaper]

.54 cal 325 gr with 110 grains of 777 fff.  Bull was 85 yards slightly quartering away uphill.  Found just under the skin on the opposite side behind front shoulder.

[kerrdog]

Anyone think it makes a difference if the bullet has the polymer tip?  It seems like a hollow point would open more reliably.

[ML_Hunter]

I have shot several deer and a couple of elk with the TMZ's, the bullet worked and expanded perfectly. I would post a photo, but the bullets are back in Lacey and I'm no where near there at the moment. I have done several test with different bullets and the TMZ's had the best and most consistent expansion...IMO.

Maybe your powder was wet?

The Polymer tip is there to assist in the expansion. Which is the reason that Barns, Nosler, and almost every bullet manufacture offers bullets with polymer tips. You can try switching over to a hollow point, but I don't know if you will see that much of a difference.