Gortex 100% rain proof??????

[HawkenBob]

Usually it's my lower arms, Legs, knees and butt. That are soaking.

Lower arms get wet because it goes down your sleeves, or soaks up into them from your hands.

But what I really can't figure is that I have a pair of Danner Canadian's that are Gortex and I treat them with NikWax plus my feet don't sweat and the bottoms of the feet and toes still get wet. I just don't understand this 100% gortex water proof they claim.

Heres the thing about Gore Tex, It is waterproof as a sheet. The problem lies in seams. Your Danners are well made boots but from wear the seams will eventually leak. A garmit with Gore Tex is only as good as its seams. Any boot that assembles a sole to a leather or synthetic upper has a prone leak point all the way around. And from constant wear, it will leak eventually.

My MT050 jacket leaks worse than my Guidewear jacket by far. In fact, the guidewear dosent leak at all. My Browning Hydro fleece also does not leak. By far the best Gore tex coats I have even owned. I also own a NF 3 layer XCR jacket that does not leak. But for 450 it better not.

Areas like your butt that sits directly into the wet will leak thru if the seams arnt perfect. And perfect seams can leak after time.

On to washing Gore Tex: The problem with using powder, standard detergents is it clogg's the "breathability". It does not interfier with the waterproofness at all. Thats why the special cleaners.

Other membranes like "dry Plus" were created because Gore tex had a petent. Dry plus, Omni tech, "precip", conduit are all attemps at cheaper forms of "Gore tex". None perform as well as most are not nearly as breathable and most break down faster.

Since the patent is up now everyone can use "Gore Tex" without the approval of the Gore Tex development team. It used to be all garmits had to meet there specs if using there product. Not no more. Anyone can produce Gore Tex now and not go thru the companies critical design criteria.

Cabelas Guidewear is better than a rubber rainsuit IMO. Just as waterproff, and breathable too. There MT050 is not. But decent.

One other thing I do is always keep Camp dry on the jackets to wick away most water before the Gore has to stop it.

[foambeetle]

ditto what 'HawkenBob' said, especially re: seams (the reason for changing seam placement  on high-end Gore-tex waders over the last couple of years)

a game of personal preference and balancing benefits/costs . . . I've used numerous Gore-tex products and found them the best for waterproof/breathable clothing . . . however, even striking the best compromise, it is still a compromise . . . as has been said, proper layering and activity/temp regulation are also huge factors in how it performs

Gore-tex waders take a pretty good beating and continue to provide a waterproof barrier even when totally immersed (even sitting or kneeling while submerged) . . . if the material (lamination of membrane(s) and outer fabric) is compromised (pin-holes, etc.) it will leak and these can be tough to find and repair sometimes - especially on jackets or pants with inner liners (but w/ Gore-tex waders, however, an otherwise invisible leak can be found with a little spray of rubbing alcohol on the inside) . . . 

. . . w/non-Gore-tex gear (where the membrane is typically not an independent sheet of material and is rather a 'coating') finding and repairing 'pin-hole' leaks can be virtually impossible . . . flexing/creasing these materials over time often leads to their failure

For hunting, as a packable and somewhat less-expensive option (i.e., non-Gore-tex), I've had decent luck with BassPro's 'micro-lite' rain gear (I've also read good reports from others) . . . FYI, it is currently available on clearance (camo pattern change apparently) at the BassPro website

happy (dry) hunting

[Intruder]

I've used tons of gortex enhanced products and all have failed at some point.  The best waterproof breathable that I've ever used is a H/H flyfishing coat.  Way too noisy for hunting though.  Riverswest stuff is pretty good (and I've heard the Sitka stuff is too) but I don't think it's breathable or not very good at it at least.

I don't know if I truly believe a breathable material will really provide the water proof you need to stay totally dry.  I know that when I fish I wear rubber/vynal gear and I don't get wet.   

[HawkenBob]

Waders are the best scenario if you dont think its waterproof. I can stand all day in water in my guidetech waders with Goretex and they flat dont leak. If they did they would never sell or keep selling as breathable waders.

No one pays 250 plus with the notion of a little leaking is permisable. My last 2 sets of breathables. (Both still going strong) Do not leak at all. One is a bootfoot and one a stocking...

[MagKarl]

I've been wearing Cabelas MT050 raingear for several years and it was pretty good for a few years, but eventually started leaking bad.  The GoreTex layer just plain fell apart.  I took it in to Cabela's in Lacey a few weeks ago and was shocked when they told me to go get another set off the rack.  I told them the raingear was several years old, and they didn't care one bit.  It was so easy I felt guilty about it.  That stuff is expensive, it should work well and last.  If yours doesn't, get it replaced, they stand by their products. 

[Intruder]

Waders are the best scenario if you dont think its waterproof. I can stand all day in water in my guidetech waders with Goretex and they flat dont leak. If they did they would never sell or keep selling as breathable waders.

No one pays 250 plus with the notion of a little leaking is permisable. My last 2 sets of breathables. (Both still going strong) Do not leak at all. One is a bootfoot and one a stocking...

My doubts are more w/ the "breathable" aspect.  I seem to get quite a bit of sweat and condensation when I get moving regardless if its a jacket, pants or waders. 

I'm on my 3rd pair of Gortex waders.  It just seems to me that over time.... all Gortex fails.  But when push comes to shove I don't trust it.  I keep buying it though, so they must have convinced me of something 

[HawkenBob]

I hear ya Intruder. Keep in mind Gore Tex is only 20% breathable. As much as I sweat I notice the humid condition too. But compared to Rubber, it is better in the breathable asspect.

XCR GT is by far more breathable. But by father its more expensive too...and I havent seen a hunting garmet made with XCR yet?

Like Magcarl said, as long as its Cabelas, its 100% replacable no questions asked. I believe the biggest problem is the fabric of the MT050 gear. The brushed fabric holds more water which in turn "tests" the GT even more.
guide wear is 600 denier nylon, already very water resistant. Couple the 2 and youve got a serious wet gear garmet.

Heres a good question for everyone: If its raining hard what difference does the fabrics sound make? The rain falling in the forest should overcome that shouldent it?

[mrgoodwrench]

I'm a Grays Harbor lifer and we know rain around here, but my whole family fell for the Cabelas MT050 Gore Tex, out of 4 sets my sisters is the only one that works around here.  The dry plus leaked also.  Helly Hansen and Grundens is what we use for work, but to hot and bulky when you are chasin elk.  I go with polypropolene tops and bottoms, and Filson double tin pants, get the oil finish the loggers use, don't get the light weight ones, they are a bit noisy like rubber rain gear but they breath and you stay dry.  I wear wool when its super cold but hate taking it off and wringing it out.  Up top its a rubber or goretex coat if its really raining in the open, usually just a poly top and a hickory shirt if I'm in the timber, just change the shirt when you get back to the truck.

[C-Money]

I have a browning gortex coat and coveralls, they have preformed well for me for over 10 years. I hunted the Pennsylvania deer opener last year and it rained all day! it was awful! I stayed in my ladder stand, all day, and was glad to have on my good Browning suit! I did get a little damp, but would have been much worse in a non gortex suit. Only saw 3 deer all day!

[MagKarl]

I also have Filson double tin bibs and logger jacket that I wear for work and noisy play like dirt bike riding.  It's just too heavy and noisy for bow hunting in my opinion. It's tough as all get out when you get into briars and such, but still not waterproof like rubber.  There's just no good do it all raingear in my experience.  I wear rubber for sitting still like fishing, gore tex for quiet and lightweight hunting, and Filson for hard work where durability is top priority.  They all have their flaws.

[swanny]

If the weather is bad enough, I take whatever keeps me dry. I have had really good luck with GoreTex and REI brand Elements. It's a GoreTex knock off but is much cheaper. They sell dark colors, so that works good enough for me.

As long as you are properly layered with non-cotton garments, you should stay dry. You may feel wet inside and your shirt may be soaked, but you yourself will not be wet. Wicking fabrics take the moisture away from your skin and also dry much quicker than cotton. I might also suggest that if you are sweating really bad underneath your GoreTex shell, don't layer as much. Chances are that when you are hiking to your spot in Washington state it's uphill, so your going to start sweating the second you step out of your truck.

[rem/sav300]

I have a full set of marine issued gortex camo that i practically live in. I wear the jacket the most and it has never let me down. But maintaining them is the biggest reason why, you can buy waterproofing products but be careful when washing them, thats when the goretex lining can fall apart. Most moisture comes from the person themselves, it is sweat that is trying to escape but since the goretex is completley saturated the water cant escape