Fishing for Native Steelhead

[wildmanoutdoors]

How many native steelhead go up the stream?

Well that can be a tough one. The problem with the Quilliute system is its managed as a whole. The Solduc, Bogy, Calawah, Dicky and Quilliute. The indianss net in the Quiliute, so if one rivers escapement is way to low, there still netting those fish. Indians also dont report there catches honestly. If they did they might just get shut down by tribal councils. If they care enough for the resource.

I think on a good year a river like the Duc could see 2000 fish in a season.

[wildmanoutdoors]

Quote

The only real way to not send steelhead into extinction is shut it all down.
Even if we stop the tribes wont. They will cry foregone oppertunity. Did you know that the treaty gives them the right to harvest as long as they dont harvest it into extinction?



I'm not taking sides, but this comment seems to contradict the whole paragraph?

Im not sure what you mean? The netting isnt to the point of extinction yet. But someday could be.

[snowpack]

Other than the fact that Steel Head are Sea Run Rainbows, what are the differences between a Rainbow and a Steel Head?

legally it's 20 inches.  Below 20 in a river where they could access the salt they are considered rainbows, over 20 and they are called steelhead.  They can breed with each other, and I've heard 10-15% of steelhead are spawned by resident trout that never went to sea.  When they go to sea they grow faster because they eat better--squid/shrimp/large baitfish vs bugs/minnows.  Some go to sea, some don't.  And when they come back, most go back to where they were spawned from, but some stray into different rivers.  They were originally from Mexico and worked their way up the coast as the ice sheet retreated during the last ice age. 

[deltaops]

Other than the fact that Steel Head are Sea Run Rainbows, what are the differences between a Rainbow and a Steel Head?

legally it's 20 inches.  Below 20 in a river where they could access the salt they are considered rainbows, over 20 and they are called steelhead.  They can breed with each other, and I've heard 10-15% of steelhead are spawned by resident trout that never went to sea.  When they go to sea they grow faster because they eat better--squid/shrimp/large baitfish vs bugs/minnows.  Some go to sea, some don't.  And when they come back, most go back to where they were spawned from, but some stray into different rivers.  They were originally from Mexico and worked their way up the coast as the ice sheet retreated during the last ice age.

Does it say anything in the Regs about this? I couldn't find it, maybe I didn't look hard enough.  I have never targeted Steel Head when I am fishing the Rivers or Lakes.

[7mmfan]

I have nothing against catch and release fishing, I sometimes do it myself, I understand fishermen wanting to conserve the resource. Maybe I missed something, I didn't read the last couple pages because the first 5 pages that I removed from the original topic seemed like nothing more than a bunch of opinioned fishermen complaining because some guy caught and kept his first big native steelhead. Exactly how many of these guys saying nobody should ever keep a native steelhead have never kept a native in their lifetime of fishing?

I wasn't going to say anything but there seems to be some hypocrisy in this topic so I feel compelled to comment. Apparently there are enough natives for the tribes to net them and apparently there are enough natives for WDFW biologists to set a limit of 1 per fisherman. Most likely the guys complaining have kept natives at some point in their fishing career. Apparently there is no biological reason or non-hypocritical excuse to flame anyone for wanting to keep their 1 fish limit. If some of you guys think there are not enough native steelhead and the possession limit is hurting the population I suggest you take your complaints to WDFW biologists and managers. To chew out other fishermen for legally fishing does nothing to unite fishermen.

just sayin... 

The one and only wild steelhead I kept was when I was 11 years old, and Dad put an end to killing wild fish shortly there after. That is part of the reason I'm so passionate about it.

Also, as has already been said, there doesn't have to be enough fish in the system for the Indians to continue netting them. THey do whatever they want. Its publicized on the OP because there is a lot of sportfishing going on there, but the other Puget Sound tribes net the Snohomish, Stilliguamish, and Skagit, despite the fact that those rivers have not been open for wild steelhead retention in YEARS, and have been shut down for C&R for YEARS as well. They're still killin them.

[bearpaw]

Quote

The only real way to not send steelhead into extinction is shut it all down.
Even if we stop the tribes wont. They will cry foregone oppertunity. Did you know that the treaty gives them the right to harvest as long as they dont harvest it into extinction?



I'm not taking sides, but this comment seems to contradict the whole paragraph?

Im not sure what you mean? The netting isnt to the point of extinction yet. But someday could be.

Sorry for confusion...
You said to shut it all down to prevent extinction, but the treaty says they can't harvest to extinction. 

Thanks for all the info.

The one and only wild steelhead I kept was when I was 11 years old, and Dad put an end to killing wild fish shortly there after. That is part of the reason I'm so passionate about it.

Also, as has already been said, there doesn't have to be enough fish in the system for the Indians to continue netting them. THey do whatever they want. Its publicized on the OP because there is a lot of sportfishing going on there, but the other Puget Sound tribes net the Snohomish, Stilliguamish, and Skagit, despite the fact that those rivers have not been open for wild steelhead retention in YEARS, and have been shut down for C&R for YEARS as well. They're still killin them.

My point was that the guy who got bashed only kept one fish.

I definitely agree, too bad they can't stop the netting on the streams with no possession and no C&R.

[wildmanoutdoors]

Quote

The only real way to not send steelhead into extinction is shut it all down.
Even if we stop the tribes wont. They will cry foregone oppertunity. Did you know that the treaty gives them the right to harvest as long as they dont harvest it into extinction?



I'm not taking sides, but this comment seems to contradict the whole paragraph?

Im not sure what you mean? The netting isnt to the point of extinction yet. But someday could be.

Sorry for confusion...
You said to shut it all down to prevent extinction, but the treaty says they can't harvest to extinction. 

Thanks for all the info.

The one and only wild steelhead I kept was when I was 11 years old, and Dad put an end to killing wild fish shortly there after. That is part of the reason I'm so passionate about it.

Also, as has already been said, there doesn't have to be enough fish in the system for the Indians to continue netting them. THey do whatever they want. Its publicized on the OP because there is a lot of sportfishing going on there, but the other Puget Sound tribes net the Snohomish, Stilliguamish, and Skagit, despite the fact that those rivers have not been open for wild steelhead retention in YEARS, and have been shut down for C&R for YEARS as well. They're still killin them.

My point was that the guy who got bashed only kept one fish.

I definitely agree, too bad they can't stop the netting on the streams with no possession and no C&R.

If the manage it as system how will they know if they net the last pair on a given stream? 

Even if its one stream, how do they know?
What if the bulk of the run did not make it back due to bad ocean conditions ect. They have a preseason forecast. But how often is that right? 

[deltaops]

So when two hatchery Steel Heads spawn do the smelt now become native?

[Bullkllr]

So when two hatchery Steel Heads spawn do the smelt now become native?

Smelt= Eulacheon- Candlefish are all native as far as I am aware.

Smolt=immature steelhead/steelhead heading out to sea.
Answer would be "sorta". Progeny of hatchery fish would be classified as "wild" if not native. Most hatchery steelhead are not native to the river they are released in. Hatchery fish are really ineffective spawners- studies show them producing very few viable adult returns in the next generation.

[MtnMuley]

In my book they do.  That's why I say there's no true native "Steel Heads" anymore in certain areas.

[Bullkllr]

In my book they do.  That's why I say there's no true native "Steel Heads" anymore in certain areas.

Just curious... what's funny about that?

[wildmanoutdoors]

In my book they do.  That's why I say there's no true native "Steel Heads" anymore in certain areas.

Just curious... what's funny about that?

He put a quote around "Steel heads". They would be called Steelhead...

[Bullkllr]

In my book they do.  That's why I say there's no true native "Steel Heads" anymore in certain areas.

Just curious... what's funny about that?

He put a quote around "Steel heads". They would be called Steelhead...

Thanks. Missed that.  I thoght the "smelt" was quite a bit funnier.

[fish vacuum]

but the other Puget Sound tribes net the Snohomish, Stilliguamish, and Skagit, despite the fact that those rivers have not been open for wild steelhead retention in YEARS, and have been shut down for C&R for YEARS as well. They're still killin them.

Any nets in the Stillaguamish right now are illegal. The tribe hasn't netted the Stilly for steelhead in years. Their season during the hatchery run last year was their first in a long time but didn't draw any participants. It's not worth their time.
I wouldn't be surprised if the Tulalips have given up on steelhead in the Snohomish too.

[whitey]

This topic was split so the ones who want to discuss the politics of fishing can continue. Do not post your rants on the original topic where the guy was showing us photos of his fish.

Maybe best in the "off topics" area. Then I can really flame the Na Sayers.
Nice fish. 
Whitey..OUT!!~!