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Author Topic: The Green Scam of “Endangered Species”  (Read 234465 times)

Offline AspenBud

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Re: The Green Scam of “Endangered Species”
« Reply #495 on: September 02, 2014, 02:14:18 PM »
Hey, let's go hunting....

http://tdn.com/lifestyles/rayonier-selling-permits-to-hunt-on-its-land/article_551bcd98-a8fd-11e0-9fc9-001cc4c03286.html

http://property.rayonierhunting.com/Permits/PermitsHome.aspx?gclid=CJ2yg5-2w8ACFURgfgod9L0ANw

https://www.wyrecreationnw.com/Permits/PropertyPage_Longview.aspx

Now say you want to hunt more than one of those areas, the costs go up exponentially. Us "city folk" who don't live a sheltered life in the sticks are rapidly running out of hunting options close to home and you wanna complain about more public land? Good luck with that.

Offline wolfbait

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Re: The Green Scam of “Endangered Species”
« Reply #496 on: September 02, 2014, 02:44:22 PM »
Hey, let's go hunting....

http://tdn.com/lifestyles/rayonier-selling-permits-to-hunt-on-its-land/article_551bcd98-a8fd-11e0-9fc9-001cc4c03286.html

http://property.rayonierhunting.com/Permits/PermitsHome.aspx?gclid=CJ2yg5-2w8ACFURgfgod9L0ANw

https://www.wyrecreationnw.com/Permits/PropertyPage_Longview.aspx

Now say you want to hunt more than one of those areas, the costs go up exponentially. Us "city folk" who don't live a sheltered life in the sticks are rapidly running out of hunting options close to home and you wanna complain about more public land? Good luck with that.

Imagine what it will be like when the USFWS etc. start shutting down all this land that use to be private for wildlife corridors. Now that's really going to suck. Imagine the cost to hunt in the areas you just list will be then?

Offline wolfbait

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Re: The Green Scam of “Endangered Species”
« Reply #497 on: September 02, 2014, 03:04:36 PM »

Offline AspenBud

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Re: The Green Scam of “Endangered Species”
« Reply #498 on: September 02, 2014, 03:14:52 PM »
Hey, let's go hunting....

http://tdn.com/lifestyles/rayonier-selling-permits-to-hunt-on-its-land/article_551bcd98-a8fd-11e0-9fc9-001cc4c03286.html

http://property.rayonierhunting.com/Permits/PermitsHome.aspx?gclid=CJ2yg5-2w8ACFURgfgod9L0ANw

https://www.wyrecreationnw.com/Permits/PropertyPage_Longview.aspx

Now say you want to hunt more than one of those areas, the costs go up exponentially. Us "city folk" who don't live a sheltered life in the sticks are rapidly running out of hunting options close to home and you wanna complain about more public land? Good luck with that.

Imagine what it will be like when the USFWS etc. start shutting down all this land that use to be private for wildlife corridors. Now that's really going to suck. Imagine the cost to hunt in the areas you just list will be then?

Shut down land...oh you mean like how WeyCo and their fellow timber companies gated off their land? Like how ranchers whose land surrounds public land balk at giving public access because they don't want roads "blazing" through their land?

Give me a break. There are a lot of landowners who don't give two toots about hunting access and many who don't want hunters on their land period. Or do you think people buying up land to make ranchets are hunter friendly?

This is not 1950, much of what was open to the public is gone, sold by land owners to be used for anything but hunting or flat out closed off. Win lose or draw public land is the future of hunting and it will live or die on it. Particularly if the population of this state continues to grow.

Offline JimmyHoffa

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Re: The Green Scam of “Endangered Species”
« Reply #499 on: September 02, 2014, 03:23:14 PM »
The Nature Conservancy is not a "radical" environmental group. They do a lot to protect critical wildlife habitat from development.  Much of the land they purchase ends up being transferred to public ownership, and that's a great benefit to hunters. The Nature Conservancy even allows hunting on some of their properties. So they are not the "radical" group you think they are. Do some more research.
They are a real estate group.  They are usually approached by enviros to buy land that gets locked up due to enviro regs and devalued.  Then they sell it to the government, usually for a profit.  They are all about money, and they have a good angle for their dealings.

Offline idahohuntr

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Re: The Green Scam of “Endangered Species”
« Reply #500 on: September 02, 2014, 04:02:19 PM »
50 years of the Wilderness Act: A legacy for Idaho and 'boy wonder'
http://www.idahostatesman.com/2014/08/30/3348721_a-legacy-for-idaho-and-boy-wonder.html?sp=/99/1687/&rh=1

 :tup:

I read this article and thought...thank goodness we had folks like Frank Church willing to fight the good fight oh so many years ago.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..." - TR

Offline wolfbait

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Re: The Green Scam of “Endangered Species”
« Reply #501 on: September 02, 2014, 04:26:24 PM »
I wonder what Frank would think of the wolves that were introduced to slaughter the game herds etc.?

Infiltration of LittleTown, U.S.A., Part 3: the Wildlands Project and Agenda 21 in Idaho
http://www.thedailyherb.com/infiltration-littletown-u-s-a-wildlands-project-agenda-21-idaho/

Offline WAcoyotehunter

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Re: The Green Scam of “Endangered Species”
« Reply #502 on: September 03, 2014, 07:08:04 AM »
50 years of the Wilderness Act: A legacy for Idaho and 'boy wonder'
http://www.idahostatesman.com/2014/08/30/3348721_a-legacy-for-idaho-and-boy-wonder.html?sp=/99/1687/&rh=1

 :tup:

I read this article and thought...thank goodness we had folks like Frank Church willing to fight the good fight oh so many years ago.
I will be in there this fall for 16 days.  I can't wait to see that country! 

Offline idahohuntr

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Re: The Green Scam of “Endangered Species”
« Reply #503 on: September 03, 2014, 11:26:53 AM »
50 years of the Wilderness Act: A legacy for Idaho and 'boy wonder'
http://www.idahostatesman.com/2014/08/30/3348721_a-legacy-for-idaho-and-boy-wonder.html?sp=/99/1687/&rh=1

 :tup:

I read this article and thought...thank goodness we had folks like Frank Church willing to fight the good fight oh so many years ago.
I will be in there this fall for 16 days.  I can't wait to see that country! 
:tup: You will love it in there.  If you are going to be down by any sort of tributary you might want to consider bringing in a fly rod...even if you don't fish much...September can be some AMAZING cutthroat fishing...and over 16 days in that rugged country you might have a day or two where you want to take it easy!
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..." - TR

Offline timberfaller

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Re: The Green Scam of “Endangered Species”
« Reply #504 on: September 03, 2014, 08:54:22 PM »
No- I think the feds and states buying ground is to protect habitat from development.  Hunting and access to public lands are a benefit of that purchase, so is having wildlife to hunt and enjoy.
:yeah:
It is absurd to me that someone on a hunting forum full of a lot of public land hunters would be posting drivel about how fish and wildlife agencies buying land to protect hunting access and wildlife habitat is a bad thing.

I'll meet you at the Big Valley Ranch in the Methow, and I'll show you personally the "absurd" WDFW purchase first hand.

The Public has access to maybe 100 acre's of 950 acre's purchased at the 2000(whole Ranch) acre's price.   The rest of the ranch(WDFW didn't want), which was winter habit for mule deer, was not even up fore consideration and the owner kept it and sold it off to others who POSTED it all.  Almost a 1000 acres of prime habit.  And the owner also was able to keep 300 acres of Wet lands!  go figure!

YEP the land purchases need to continue!

Public land is needed no dought, but be careful how you approach the subject of WDFW purchases!!   Some of us have first hand knowledge of what goes on behind closed doors.

   
The only good tree, is a stump!

Offline wolfbait

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Re: The Green Scam of “Endangered Species”
« Reply #505 on: September 15, 2014, 10:25:43 AM »
Did Obama's Interior hobble the Endangered Species Act?
A new policy sets the law back a half-century, conservationists say.
http://www.hcn.org/articles/has-obamas-interior-hobbled-the-endangered-species-act?utm_source=wcn1&utm_medium=email

Offline wolfbait

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Re: The Green Scam of “Endangered Species”
« Reply #506 on: September 15, 2014, 09:13:13 PM »
Gray Wolves Under the Endangered Species Act (ESA): Distinct Population Segments and Experimental Populations

FWS prepared a recovery plan for the gray wolf in the Northern Rocky Mountains in 1987.47 However, the 1987 recovery goal was later deemed insufficient. It was modified through scientific inquiry and peer review in 1994 and reaffirmed in 2002.48 The Northern Rocky Mountain recovery goal is a connected three-state wolf population that never goes below 30 breeding pairs and 300 wolves. Connectivity is a key part of population recovery, as it ensures adequate genetic exchange for the long-term viability of the species. When wolves are delisted and state management fully replaces federal management, FWS has determined that the recovery goal is being maintained when each state (Montana, Idaho, and Wyoming) maintains at least 15 breeding pairs and 150 wolves.
http://democrats.naturalresources.house.gov/sites/democrats.naturalresources.house.gov/files/Gray%20Wolf%20DPS.pdf

Offline jasnt

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Re: The Green Scam of “Endangered Species”
« Reply #507 on: September 16, 2014, 05:13:19 AM »
So wolves are not endangered in a significant portion of its range than does this mean they will be delisted? 
https://www.howlforwildlife.org/take_action  It takes 10 seconds and it’s free. To easy to make an excuse not to make your voice heard!!!!!!

The commission shall attempt to maximize the public recreational game fishing and hunting opportunities of all citizens, including juvenile, disabled, and senior citizens.
https://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=77.04.012

Offline wolfbait

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Re: The Green Scam of “Endangered Species”
« Reply #508 on: November 08, 2014, 05:35:15 PM »
‘International Commission on Zoological Nomenclature’ behind pocket gopher hoax
Posted on OCTOBER 28, 2014 Written by MELISSA GENSON, WATCHDOGWIRE.COM
http://agenda21news.com/2014/10/part-five-international-commission-zoological-nomenclature-behind-pocket-gopher-hoax/

Secret Gopher Map Reveals Washington Agency’s Power
Posted on OCTOBER 29, 2014 Written by MELISSA GENSON, WATCHDOGWIRE.COM
HTTP://AGENDA21NEWS.COM/2014/10/SECRET-GOPHER-MAP-REVEALS-WASHINGTON-AGENCYS-POWER/

Government claims about pocket gopher protection remain flawed
Posted on NOVEMBER 6, 2014 Written by MELISSA GENSON, HTTP://WATCHDOGWIRE.COM
HTTP://AGENDA21NEWS.COM/2014/11/GOVERNMENT-CLAIMS-POCKET-GOPHER-PROTECTION-REMAIN-FLAWED/

Offline wolfbait

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Re: The Green Scam of “Endangered Species”
« Reply #509 on: November 08, 2014, 05:36:39 PM »
Court smacks fed claim rodents impact 'interstate commerce'

A federal judge has rejected Washington’s claim that prairie dogs have a “substantial” impact on “interstate commerce,” throwing out a special rule protecting their burrows on private land in Utah and thus allowing property owners there to resume use of their own lands.



The decision was praised by officials with the Pacific Legal Foundation, which argued the case against the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, and others, on behalf of the People for the Ethical Treatment of Property Owners.

“This ruling frees the people of Cedar City from unconstitutional regulations that made it impossible for them to build their dream homes, defend their airport, and protect the sanctity of their loved ones’ final resting places,” said PLF staff attorney Jonathan Wood.

“Now, these property owners, and the local governments, needn’t fear the heavy hand of the federal government when they use and maintain their property, and do what most of us take for granted,” he said in a statement released Thursday.

The issue was that federal bureaucrats had designated the Utah prairie dog, a rodent that lives only in Utah but has a population there of tens of thousands of animals, as protected.

That meant that nothing could be done that could “harm” the rodents without special federal permission, such as removing their burrows from cemeteries or airport runways, or building homes where they occupied the land.

Specifically the lawsuit challenged the federal action in applying the Endangered Species Act’s anti-”take” rules to the Utah prairie dog in most areas and circumstances where the species is found. “Take” is defined broadly to include: to harass, harm, pursue, hunt, shoot, wound, kill, trap, capture, or collect a member of a protected species.

Fines and prison time are the penalties.

The result was that landowners were prevented from building homes they planned, groups was prevented from doing maintenance on cemeteries, and local governments were even prevented from doing repairs and making other changes to local airports, because of the potential “harm” that could befall an individual Utah prairie dog.

U.S. District Judge Dee Benson, however, threw out the federal agency’s claims that it could impose its rules and restrictions on private land.

“Although the Commerce Clause authorizes Congress to do many things, it does not authorize Congress to regulate takes of a purely intrastate species that has no substantial effect on interstate commerce. Congress similarly lacks authority through the Necessary and Proper Clause because the regulation of takes of Utah prairie dogs is not essential or necessary to the [Endangered Species Act's] economic scheme,” the judge wrote.

“The federal government may take whatever measures it likes on its own property, in order to protect the prairie dog,” Wood continued. “But it can’t violate the U.S. Constitution by taking away the property rights of private citizens or local governments.”

Pacific Legal explained the Utah prairie dog is one of five prairie dog species in North America. Found only in Utah, it feeds on plants and insects, lives in colonies, and digs burrows and networks of tunnels. The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service estimates its population at more than 40,000. Nevertheless, the agency lists it as “threatened” on the Endangered Species Act list.

The judge warned of the consequences of deciding any other way.

“If Congress could use the Commerce Clause to regulate anything that might affect the ecosystem (to say nothing about its effect on commerce), there would be no logical stopping point to congressional power under the Commerce Clause.”

The federal government argued there is an impact on interstate commerce – the fact that the animal was protected actually prevented economic development. And the government said the Utah prairie dog “has biological and commercial value” since they “contribute to the ecosystem” and, in fact, are food for eagles and bobcats.

And, the federal government asserted, the prairie dog attracts some interstate tourism.

But the judge said the Supreme Court has limited Commerce Clause arguments to only a few scenarios, none of which was present in this case.

“It is clear that the Commerce Clause does not authorize Congress to regulate takes of Utah prairie dogs on non-federal land,” the judge said.

And, the judge said, claims “purporting to establish a link between Utah prairie dog takes and a substantial effect on interstate commerce are attenuated.”

“The fact that scientific research has been conducted and books have been published about the Utah prairie dog is similarly too attenuated to establish a substantial relation between the take of the Utah prairie dog and interstate commerce,” the judge wrote. “After all, scientific research has also been conducted and books have also been published about both guns and women.

“Nevertheless, the Supreme Court ruled that federal regulation of gun possession and violence against women is beyond Congress’ Commerce Clause power.”

And the judge said government arguments that the rule is authorized under the Necessary and Proper Clause also failed.

“Takes of Utah prairie dogs on non-federal land – even to the point of extinction – would not substantially affect the national market for any commodity regulated by the ESA. The only evidence that suggests that the prairie dog’s extinction would substantially affect such a national market is defendants’ assertion that golden eagles, hawks, and bobcats are ‘known to prey on prairie dogs.’

“However, defendants do not claim that the Utah prairie dog is a major food source for those animals, and those animals are known to prey on many other rodents, birds, and fish,” the judge wrote.


Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2014/11/court-smacks-fed-claim-rodents-impact-interstate-commerce/#SpA5RzeMkfMIvFJL.99

In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. section 107, any copyrighted material herein is distributed without profit or payment to those who have expressed a prior interest in receiving this information for non-profit research and educational purposes only. For more information go to: http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/107.shtml

 


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