Man gets escorted off of NF trail for open carrying rifle and pistol. UPDATE!!

[pianoman9701]

I'll wait to get the report before i make a judgement on how "overly-armed" this guy was. People who don't like guns, don't like any guns. Not my freakin' problem. It's completely theirs. I'm not even sure if I care whether he was dressed like Rambo, had three holsters and an AR with a suppressor. Those same people would've been bothered with a holstered Colt Peacemaker. They're making noise because they can cause trouble, period. I probably wouldn't have had more than one gun, but that's just me and the fact i don't want to carry that much weight around.

[jackelope]

I'll wait to get the report before i make a judgement on how "overly-armed" this guy was. People who don't like guns, don't like any guns. Not my freakin' problem. It's completely theirs. I'm not even sure if I care whether he was dressed like Rambo, had three holsters and an AR with a suppressor. Those same people would've been bothered with a holstered Colt Peacemaker. They're making noise because they can cause trouble, period. I probably wouldn't have had more than one gun, but that's just me and the fact i don't want to carry that much weight around.

Agreed.

[Bob33]

Seems to me that the guy hiking with multiple open carry firearms on a public trail was a lot more intent on pushing his "values" than someone else on here.

[ghosthunter]

It will be interesting to find out as to why. So far I have not heard anything to suggest he was up there for bad intentions. Just out walking his rifle  I am up that mountain at least twice a year and always have a side arm on (not that I feel threatened there. It is a very high use trail)

I for one don't feel safe if I don't carry.  It doesn't matter where or what I am doing.  Only time I do not is if it is illegal to do so, courthouse, etc.   I honestly feel the people who don't carry are the ones who are crazy.  As the saying goes " I'd rather have it and not need it then to need it and not have it"   I am not afraid or paranoid, just informed and aware.

[ghosthunter]

If any of this is true or not?

A person on public lands legally carrying a firearm or any firearms. Has not broken any law. He may be contacted by LE. But once determined he has violated any laws,should be left alone. (MWG call)

The mere fact that he has one or many legally carried firearms does not proved probable case of any crime in its self.

And you knew this was coming here is the cites:

"Mr. St. John’s lawful possession of a loaded firearm in a crowded place could not, by itself, create a reasonable suspicion sufficient to justify an investigatory detention."
St. John v. McColley


The Third Circuit found that an individual’s lawful possession of a firearm in a crowded place did not justify a search or seizure.
United States v. Ubiles (3rd Cir. 2000)

The Tenth Circuit found that an investigatory detention initiated by an officer after he discovered that the defendant lawfully possessed a loaded firearm lacked sufficient basis because the firearm alone did not create a reasonable suspicion of criminal activity.
United States v. King (10th Cir. 1993)


"The Claim and exercise of a Constitutional Right cannot be converted into a crime."
Miller v. U.S.


"The mere presence of firearms does not create exigent circumstances."
WI v. Kiekhefer

In a nut shell it has already been ruled in several cases that the carrying of a firearm MAY Cause Alarm, but the Alarm is Not Justified. Given there are no other circumstances or events.

On any given day in the woods I could be walking up a trail with a long gun, and two handguns. For no other reason than that's how I roll. I am pleasant to everyone I meet.
When someone comments about my guns in a negative way ,I simply wish them a good Day and move on.

Really unless a LE suspects you of a crime any contact should be nothing but a cordial greeting. Even more so on a trail or in the woods.
Game agents might have more questions.

My point. No one should be singled out or detained in any way simply for carrying a firearm on public forest lands outside of National Parks.

I know I know you hates the cites.  

[bobcat]

Is a National Park really any different than a State Park?

[ghosthunter]

Not in my thinking.

But open carry may not be allowed


We are all open carriers when we hunt.

[bobcat]

You can't hunt or shoot on land managed by Washington State Parks. Same as National Parks.

[timberghost72]

It is lawful to open carry in National and State Parks though some may question when it's a rifle. Shooting/hunting no on State and National Parks.

[SCRUBS]

I'll wait to get the report before i make a judgement on how "overly-armed" this guy was. People who don't like guns, don't like any guns. Not my freakin' problem. It's completely theirs. I'm not even sure if I care whether he was dressed like Rambo, had three holsters and an AR with a suppressor. Those same people would've been bothered with a holstered Colt Peacemaker. They're making noise because they can cause trouble, period. I probably wouldn't have had more than one gun, but that's just me and the fact i don't want to carry that much weight around.

 

[ghosthunter]

You can't hunt or shoot on land managed by Washington State Parks. Same as National Parks.

Yes

But The topic was man carrying a firearm. So I am kinda staying close to that topic.

[JimmyHoffa]

You can't hunt or shoot on land managed by Washington State Parks. Same as National Parks.

there are some National Parks that allow hunting.  One in Wyoming allows elk hunting.

[Bob33]

The mere fact that he has one or many legally carried firearms does not proved probable case of any crime in its self.

The Third Circuit found that an individual’s lawful possession of a firearm in a crowded place did not justify a search or seizure.
United States v. Ubiles (3rd Cir. 2000)

The Tenth Circuit found that an investigatory detention initiated by an officer after he discovered that the defendant lawfully possessed a loaded firearm lacked sufficient basis because the firearm alone did not create a reasonable suspicion of criminal activity.
United States v. King (10th Cir. 1993)


"The Claim and exercise of a Constitutional Right cannot be converted into a crime."
Miller v. U.S.


"The mere presence of firearms does not create exigent circumstances."
WI v. Kiekhefer

In a nut shell it has already been ruled in several cases that the carrying of a firearm MAY Cause Alarm, but the Alarm is Not Justified. Given there are no other circumstances or events.

Perfect arguments for "gun free" zones. A whack job carries an AK47 onto a school ground, and police can do nothing because "The Claim and exercise of a Constitutional Right cannot be converted into a crime."

[washelkhunter]

I'm available 8-24 for a pre-hunt training hike either at Beacon Rock St. Park or Dog Mtn. Bring bows, rifles and sidearms; no arrows or ammo of course except for your concealed carry, it'll be a good exercise of your legs, lungs and rights.

[HUNTINCOUPLE]

I'm available 8-24 for a pre-hunt training hike either at Beacon Rock St. Park or Dog Mtn. Bring bows, rifles and sidearms; no arrows or ammo of course except for your concealed carry, it'll be a good exercise of your legs, lungs and rights.

Me and the wife hiked up a trail archery deer hunting hear in the gorge last fall. Nobody at the trail head at o-dark thirty but boy howdy when coming back down at about 1pm another story. To this day I do believe if my wife a female carying her bow with arrows and me as well, is the only reason a law inforcement individual was not called to the trail head. If only me coming down I know it would have been a different story. There were license plates from several states to include wa, or, ca, nv, and ca. All of them with there eyes wide open in total disgust. I so wish the wife would have had the head and cape of the bucks we were after hanging over her shoulder. Would have been priceless.....