Trouble with a CVA Wolf.

[atfulldraw]

I'm having a ton of trouble getting the musket caps to go off with any consistency (it takes 2-5 strikes).  I am using the rws caps and I also got a new firing pin assembly from CVA and that didn't seem to make it any better. I also tried pulling the hammer back all the way and thumbed it like Clint Eastwood and it went off every time. It almost seems like where the hammer locks it doesn't have enough energy stored in the hammer spring. Any help would be appreciated.

[MountainDevil54]

how smooth is the firing pin as it exits the assembly? Pull the trigger back all the way and hold it. With your thumb, push the hammer forward and push back and forth on it.

I only had problems when not seating the musket cap hard enough onto the nipple shaft.

[DIYARCHERYJUNKIE]

This is bad news as I have the same rifle and called cva a few days ago about the exact same problem.  I was told the new firing pin assembly was in the mail and if the problem persist that the rifle would need sent in.  Pretty lame as my son only gets a single day for the muzzy elk season.  I hope I have better news when I put the firing pin spring in.  I asked if a hammer spring existed and was told special tools were required and even a gunsmith probably wouldn't have the tools.

[DIYARCHERYJUNKIE]

how smooth is the firing pin as it exits the assembly? Pull the trigger back all the way and hold it. With your thumb, push the hammer forward and push back and forth on it.

I only had problems when not seating the musket cap hard enough onto the nipple shaft.

My firing pin is extra smooth when pushed.  I have Pushed and cleaned it a few times trying to figure it out.  Last night I pulled it out and tried pushing the RWS cap on extra tight.  It went off first try.  Then second try on the next two caps.  I think its a weak hammer spring in the stock guns.  The firing pin spring retract the pin back to its position and shouldn't have anything to do with the pin going forward, only back.  The hammer spring feels weak to me. 

[atfulldraw]

I had my wife call CVA and they are overnight shipping a new muzzleloader! Great customer service! 

[DIYARCHERYJUNKIE]

What What!!!!  not fair!  She had the same problem?  If so let us know if it fixes the problem and we just have faulty guns.  Did you ship the other rifle to them?

[atfulldraw]

What What!!!!  not fair!  She had the same problem?  If so let us know if it fixes the problem and we just have faulty guns.  Did you ship the other rifle to them?

I'll ship it out tomorrow or Saturday.

[DIYARCHERYJUNKIE]

did the new gun fix the rws cap ignition issue?  I installed the new firing pin assembly and no change.  Ill be calling CVA today.

[atfulldraw]

did the new gun fix the rws cap ignition issue?  I installed the new firing pin assembly and no change.  Ill be calling CVA today.

It's supposed to come in the mail today,  I'll let you know how it works.

[Simcoe hunter]

These must be inherently a pile of steaminess.  I ordered one from Cabelas-ship to store.  Drove 140 miles round trip to get it.  Opened the box in the store and found top half of back sight had come off.  No biggie. Was going to make sure it was sighted in anyway so would have adjusted and tightened at the range.  Got it home and started a closer inspection.  Half of the red plastic in the front sight was broken and missing.  These guns bang around in the box a lot it appears and this one was hammered.  Looked like a used gun.  Hmmm...  But the biggest gripe was that the hammer or transfer bar or whatever this has would never make contact with the firing pin to fire a cap.  NEVER.  140 miles round trip to return it today.  New one on the way with $16.95 fee to ship to my house this time.  I am afraid I am going to wish I had just taken my money to Bi-mart and gotten a Vortek.  I like the feel of the Wolf as I wanted a carbine.  But, the jury is still out.

[MountainDevil54]

if you are talking about the hammer hitting the firing pin, it will be pulled away from it until its fully cocked and the trigger is pulled, then the trigger block safety falls out of the way.

[Simcoe hunter]

That's good to know.  But it still wouldn't happen with this unit.

[DIYARCHERYJUNKIE]

I cut a small piece off of the firing pin spring. It isn't bouncing around but it made it require less pressure to move the pin forward.  It struck 8 out of ten.  Is this safe?

Btw I did get new firing pin assembly and installed it prior to cutting one of the springs down.  I only removed a tiny bit of the spring.  Just enough that the pressure the hammer generates is enough to strike the pin hard into every cap.  It hits it hard, leaving a deep impression on the rws cap. The pin took a bit of twisting to get back to shape, so it would slide over the pin smoothly.  I felt I had it fixed but haven't fired the gun, just test caps.

[Katmai Guy]

Hunting partner is having the same problem, CVA Optima.  Sounds like quality control went down the tube.

[HntnFsh]

This sucks for you guys. How could a person ever feel good about hunting with a muzzleloader that doesn't go off dang close to 100 percent of the time.

[Simcoe hunter]

This sucks for you guys. How could a person ever feel good about hunting with a muzzleloader that doesn't go off dang close to 100 percent of the time.

Exactly the reason I took it back.  Cancelled my back order at the big box outdoor store and ordered from a smaller shop ot of LaGrande, Oregon. They are opening the box and ensuring that all sight are un-damaged and that the firing mechanism works prior to shipping.  Couldn't get the big store to do that for me.  They'ld rather have you waste gas and pay for shipping from heck to breakfast rather than make a happy(return) customer the first time.

[Sabotloader]

I'm having a ton of trouble getting the musket caps to go off with any consistency (it takes 2-5 strikes).  I am using the rws caps and I also got a new firing pin assembly from CVA and that didn't seem to make it any better. I also tried pulling the hammer back all the way and thumbed it like Clint Eastwood and it went off every time. It almost seems like where the hammer locks it doesn't have enough energy stored in the hammer spring. Any help would be appreciated.

This seems to be an ongoing problem in many CVA/Traditions using musket caps.  Actually Knight had the same problem with there Western Edition rifles.  Knight solved the problem by creating a musket nipple with an off-set cap post.

I wrote/suggested this in another thread and will bring a copy over here...

Here is a pic.   I tried it one more time and it did not fire.    The one on the left, was the misfire.  The one on the right, new. 

Maybe this will help ??   

This gun was just purchased about 2 months ago - brand new.

OK - I am going to throw this out there for what it might be worth....

1. if you were shooting #11 caps I would bet the farm you would not have any problems with ignition!

2. Why.... a cap is not like a primer - punching the middle of the cap will not cause ignition - all you are doing is pushing the ignition material in the primer stack on the nipple.  Looking at your examples - I think it is obvious that you hitting the caps very hard causing the almost perfect depression in the middle of the cap.  The get a cap to fire you must jamb the ignition material in the cap into a hard object like the rim of the cap.  The compression then starts ignition...  If the DIAMETER of your firing pin were a little larger than the diameter of the cap you would certainly get ignition.

Knight often has/had the same problem and to solve the problem they are making and shipping a Musket nipple with an offset stack so the hammer/firing pin drives the edge of the cap into the leading edge/top of the nipple stack.

Again will a #11 you would not have this problem because the hammer covers the diameter of the cap.

Here is a picture to show the offset stack..




Hope some of this makes some sense...

[Simcoe hunter]

Does anyone know if CVA makes something like this?

[andersonjk4]

I was having the same problems with a CVA Accura I bought.  I tried the new firing pin assembly they sent me and it made a marginal improvement (caps would fire on the 2nd hit instead of 4th or 5th).  I sent my rifle back to CVA two weeks ago and I should get it back today.  I'm really hoping this has fixed the issue for good.  And I also hope they give me some indication on what was fixed/changed/replaced, so I can get a better feel for what the issue with these rifles is.  I think Sabotloader is on to something with the offset nipple.  I feel like the real issue here is the size of the firing pin in relation to the musket cap.  As Sabotloader shows in the pictures above the edge of the cap is not getting hit.  Unfortunately these new CVA breech plugs have integral nipples, so an offset nipple cannot be installed or a smaller #11 nipple cannot be installed.  I sent a long, very descriptive, email to CVA regarding this issue the very things Sabotloader mentioned, but I never did get a reply from them.  I am anxious to test out my repaired rifle tonight and I will give a report of my findings. 

[DIYARCHERYJUNKIE]

Cut the spring.  It fixed it.  The pin is leaving a very deep impression and very few caps don't ignite.  the ones that still wont go bang I would say are the caps being faulty.

[HntnFsh]

Cut the spring.  It fixed it.  The pin is leaving a very deep impression and very few caps don't ignite.  the ones that still wont go bang I would say are the caps being faulty.

Very few faulty caps anymore if you buy quality caps. Maybe 1 in a 1000 wont go off. I think its still gun issues and if you have even very few caps that dont go off. Thats a few too many!

[MountainDevil54]

1 in 1000 is a very very bold statement IMO. I've had 4 caps not go off on my NW Optima out of the 50 shots I've put through it. Those same caps did NOT go off on my Hawken either when I tested them to make sure.  Keep in mind, these were NEW caps, not sitting on the shelf for years at a time.

[Sabotloader]

Cut the spring.  It fixed it.  The pin is leaving a very deep impression and very few caps don't ignite.  the ones that still wont go bang I would say are the caps being faulty.

Very few faulty caps anymore if you buy quality caps. Maybe 1 in a 1000 wont go off. I think its still gun issues and if you have even very few caps that dont go off. Thats a few too many!

I would have to agree with you - I have caps, both Musket and #11's that have got to be 10 years old and I have no problem with at all.  I am not sure the 1-1000 is unrealistic. 

With that said I should throw out there a friend of mine had bought some CCI Musket caps that were defective in that the ignition material was not even in the cap.  We checked the whole tin and found 3 of the hundred in that condition.

mike

[grousefether]

Cut the spring.  It fixed it.  The pin is leaving a very deep impression and very few caps don't ignite.  the ones that still wont go bang I would say are the caps being faulty.

             
       
                         How much did you cut off? Can you post a pic?  Having the same issue. Love this little gun so im willing to try anything

[DIYARCHERYJUNKIE]

Cut the spring.  It fixed it.  The pin is leaving a very deep impression and very few caps don't ignite.  the ones that still wont go bang I would say are the caps being faulty.

             
       
                         How much did you cut off? Can you post a pic?  Having the same issue. Love this little gun so im willing to try anything

Cant post a pic now im at work   Ill throw one up tonight.  It was only the portion of the spring that overlaps itself at the end.  I only took a 16th of an inch off, roughly.  it took a little bending to get it to slide around the pin smoothly.  But it relieved a lot of the pressure holding it, so it slaps forward harder.  leaving a deep impression on the cap.  I have only fired ten caps through it.  8-10 went off first try.  I think the extra slap from the pin helps but isn't enough to correct the issue of the nipple not being long enough to get past the "wings" of the rws caps.  I think that is the real issue.  hopefully CVA makes this right.  I doubt they will.  Customer service was a joke when I called.  They said this hasnt been an issue at all....  They need to send all the faulty gun owners new breech plugs with removable nipples. that are long enough to ignite the caps they recommend. 

[grousefether]

CVA says its not an issue huh? I personally havnt tried contacting them but I think I will. If they ever want my business again. They are already on strike one with those junk power belts

[MountainDevil54]

powerbelts kill plenty of animals. Its slob hunters with poor shooting skills and poor shot placement that causes a lot of the trouble. I tire of hearing bubba stories about how they shot a buck of a life time at 40 yards and didnt even find hair let alone a drop of blood! I had it right on 'er he says!