berger bullets!

[kentrek]

I'm shooting a 185 classic hunter @ 2880 from a wsm

I had the same bullet performance on a bull this year at 75 yards that I did on a different bull at 475 yards

Last year I took a buck at 30 yards... he was super dead

Only one time did I follow blood with a berger and that trail was 4 foot wide

I would venture to say your bucks dead or you didn't hit it in the lung/heart area, deer don't have doctors to fix them..if ya saw his leg all jacked up then it still would have been jacked up the next time ya saw him

[kodiak 907]

I'll take bullets like Accubonds and TTSXs that are proven to penetrate through thick tissue and bone over target style "hunting" bullets every time.

[LEN]

Since the 168's used were a hunting bullet I would guess you hit just a bit too high and all you got was skin and hair. I did this on a deer with a bow one year and shot him with a rifle the next. Nice X on each side on the skin well healed.

LEN

[Crunchy]

I shot a buck last year with 168gr vlds at 300 yards.  Dropped him in his tracks. Very impressed with the accuracy and performance of the bullet so far. 

[coachcw]

...accubonds and ssts are great all around bullets too...

Accubonds and SSTs aren't even remotely close. They both fly through the air, but on impact they are worlds apart.

point is both expand and work well , where tsx at high speeds look the same passing through . I hit a buck at hundred yards with one out of a 30-378 and it looked like a pin hole on both sides

[b23]

Which theory you buy into will most likely determine what type of bullet you choose.

Berger Bullets theory on killing game is they are all about creating significant wound channels to create as maximum blood loss as rapidly as possible.  They want their bullet to enter the body cavity and go off like a grenade.  Berger theory isn't very concerned about  bullet weight retention.

Barnes Bullets theory is more about penetration and retaining bullet weight so their bullet can keep driving forward.  I call it the freight train effect.  A train plows into something and just it keeps going because it has all that mass behind it.

I think they both have their place.  North American game animals, I'll choose Berger.  But, if I was hunting game with thick heavy hides in Africa, I'm pretty sure Berger bullets wouldn't be on my list of things to take.

[coachcw]

Which theory you buy into will most likely determine what type of bullet you choose.

Berger Bullets theory on killing game is they are all about creating significant wound channels to create as maximum blood loss as rapidly as possible.  They want their bullet to enter the body cavity and go off like a grenade.  Berger theory isn't very concerned about  bullet weight retention.

Barnes Bullets theory is more about penetration and retaining bullet weight so their bullet can keep driving forward.  I call it the freight train effect.  A train plows into something and just it keeps going because it has all that mass behind it.

I think they both have their place.  North American game animals, I'll choose Berger.  But, if I was hunting game with thick heavy hides in Africa, I'm pretty sure Berger bullets wouldn't be on my list of things to take.

[jasnt]

Shot my deer this year with my 300wm  185 Berger @3085fps  at 29 yards right behind the shoulder it took 4" of lung out the other side

[high country]

...accubonds and ssts are great all around bullets too...

Accubonds and SSTs aren't even remotely close. They both fly through the air, but on impact they are worlds apart.

point is both expand and work well , where tsx at high speeds look the same passing through . I hit a buck at hundred yards with one out of a 30-378 and it looked like a pin hole on both sides

A buddy told me that happened to a coworker of his. I'm wondering if Barnes had a bad lot. I killed an elk at 30 yards tops with a 180tsx launched at 3300 and it was pure magic.


My theory is to match the bullet to the speed of the gun. A 270win drives a 130 at 3000 and has since day one .every bullet made in 277 works well at that speed.....now step into big 7's or 30's.....and one needs to engineer his ammo.

[kbrowne14]

I am intrigued by the Bergers, but I have always used AB's.  I just don't like, for health reasons, a bullet that is designed to shred apart.  I feel like all that lead would get into the meat.  I understand that any leaded bullet carries that risk, but a bonded bullet will lose less lead into the carcass.  I have hear however, if your bullet is traveling slower, IE, Longer range shots, the bergers are devastating.  Having my father in law shot an elk 800 yards away with a 200 gr. AB.  The elk fell in place with great terminal ballistic performance.

I shot a deer this year with a 200 gr. AB at 680 yards, deer fell in place, he was DOA.  Great terminal performance as well.  Both of said shots on these animals hit and broke shoulders.  I just think a bullet like the AB or the like, are a little more forgiving when shot placement or target opportunities are not perfect.   

[coachcw]

heck if you have something that works that well keep it and trim the meat .

[Heredoggydoggy]

The vitals on an animal are a lot lower than people think.  If you hit the deer "high", the bullet might have passed right over the good stuff.  Last year my neighbor shot a deer just barely under his chest, and it blew up the deer's heart!

[Mxracer532]

I have shot 95g Vld's for yrs out of my .243 at 3136fps and i can say after my nephew and sisters taking several mule deer bucks and myself using it on my spring bear and as my coyote gun that VLD's definitely react different at different ranges and velocity. They work excellent at 300-the furthest i have seen at 520. I have shot coyotes at less than 200 yards that had no exits but also had some with MASSIVE holes. I believe they excel at longer ranges and have a limit on how fast you push them.

[elkspert]

A friend of mine just returned from Montana. His daughter shot a cow at 300 yards with a 300 weatherby shooting 168 bergers. I guess she hit it in the shoulder and it went down. As they were walking over to it, the elk got back up and started to run off. They ended up getting the elk but said there was no penetration at all. I am kinda thinking it might be the shot placement or the wrong grain bullet for that caliber. With that I have taken 5 bulls and 3 deer with my 7mm Dakota shooting 168 bergers. Ranges have been from 100- 575 yards. All animals fell dead in there tracks.

[Stein]

A friend of mine just returned from Montana. His daughter shot a cow at 300 yards with a 300 weatherby shooting 168 bergers. I guess she hit it in the shoulder and it went down. As they were walking over to it, the elk got back up and started to run off. They ended up getting the elk but said there was no penetration at all. I am kinda thinking it might be the shot placement or the wrong grain bullet for that caliber. With that I have taken 5 bulls and 3 deer with my 7mm Dakota shooting 168 bergers. Ranges have been from 100- 575 yards. All animals fell dead in there tracks.

I put a 168 TSX nearly completely through an elk from a 30-06 not too much closer.  Hit plenty of bone, took a right and went through the liver and imbedded against the far hide.

I have nothing against Berger, but I'm the kind of guy to wait for 10,000 animals to be killed and a nearly undisputed reputation to build before I chamber one during a hunt.  There are just way to many proven bullets for me to go experimenting when the chips are down.