Beaver, Mountain Beaver and furbearer populations

[Humptulips]

I thought I would start a discussion to find out if what I am seeing is widespread.

Beaver, I swear they seem to be just about extinct here. I have trapped the same line for 40 years and prior to I-713 I took around a 120 beaver a year every year. Trapped the same places year after year and never really hurt the population. I should add I wasn't the only trapper at that time in the area. In 2000 I started trapping Oregon and didn't trap for the most part in WA. To my knowledge no one else trapped the line either during this time. When I came back to it I was shocked to see how few beaver were around. It has continued to decline to the point this year there are practically no beaver. I feel ashamed if I even catch one in an otter set. I have seen a lot of cougar sign around anyplace there have been beaver the last few years and believe this is all a result of the huge cougar population we have. I'm not exaggerating when I say beaver have become a rarity on the Humptulips River drainage.
I have heard similar stories from along the coast. Seems to be beaver where there are settled areas but out in the boon docks zilch.
Anyone else seeing this?

Along with the beaver the otter seems to have had a marked drop off in numbers. Part of this I think is habitat. The beaver ponds are for the most part all gone and with that a lot of good forage areas for otter. Another part is the lack of Salmon making it to spawn. I see very few fish spawning compared to years past and it seems to go down every year.
Less food= less otter. I was out the other day in a place that used to be a killer spot for beaver and otter and saw a net in the river. It made me wonder how many otter are killed by Indians. Both accidentally in nets and on purpose from shooting them around the nets.
I used to figure on catching an otter a day. Couldn't catch one a week now even with conventional traps.
Thoughts?

Mountain beaver,
I'm wondering what you are seeing especially some of you that are doing good on cats. I will tell you something has happened along the coast. Mountain beavers have disappeared on both private and public lands. Can't say what it is. Disease? Climate Change? I just know they are gone and I think it has impacted predators such as cats and coyotes. It was what they ate here.
I've heard guys from the Cascades say plenty of them and even from the sound but also heard of the disappearance from guys along the coast.
What are you seeing?

[eburgtrapper]

I live and have trapped in ellensburg for 17 years. I have never seen so many beavers. alot of the swamps I trap rats in had beavers in them this year.  On a five mile drive I can point out 8 different beavers in 6 different creeks.  I wrote a post earlier about the state doing relocation projects away from my area. I don't know if that has to do anything with it, but back when I was using steel traps for rats the population seamed to stay pretty consistent, three years ago I didn't seam to see rats any where. It has made me wonder if us, as trappers, help out the population more than we think by helping with over-population and deceases problems. Just my two cents

Jordan

[Smossy]

I dont know technicals around it but there's so much beaver damage around here land owners have been seeking me out when I drive by with my traps on the roof and a giant HUNTING WA decal on the sides of the truck. Creating lots of problems, lots of dams, and lots of flooding to the local land owners properties.

[Humptulips]

I live and have trapped in ellensburg for 17 years. I have never seen so many beavers. alot of the swamps I trap rats in had beavers in them this year.  On a five mile drive I can point out 8 different beavers in 6 different creeks.  I wrote a post earlier about the state doing relocation projects away from my area. I don't know if that has to do anything with it, but back when I was using steel traps for rats the population seamed to stay pretty consistent, three years ago I didn't seam to see rats any where. It has made me wonder if us, as trappers, help out the population more than we think by helping with over-population and deceases problems. Just my two cents

Jordan

What kind of country? Open?

[JimmyHoffa]

I have actually been seeing a few more beavers in the last couple years.  Makes it kind of interesting walking down the river banks and all the alders have been gnawed to sharp stakes sticking out of the ground.  I don't trap, but I look for beavers for cougar hunting.
As for otters, see a few around; but not nearly like the days when there were more fish.

[eburgtrapper]

Mostly agricultural areas. Mostly around hay fields and cow pastors. Right where that guy is standing is the start of a hay field. Not to get off topic but this was an interesting beaver. One picture the beaver climbed about 5 feet and chewed on this tree and the other (about five feet away) he would cut a foot off the tree, it dropped then he would cut another foot off. He did it 5 or 6 times but the tree never fell over for him.

[Hannibal]

bruce, I have taken the same amount of beaver out off the drainage that i trap for money for 13 years because it is feed from the river or an area that is not in a drainage distinct.

what i can say is by removing otter by incidental catch, I have seen the return of cut throat trout in area that I thought they were non existent. And I do not meen one of to but  large numbers of returning spooning fish
 

[Trapper John]

Bruce,
As you know when I had my business it was mostly in king county.  I sold my business two years ago and even than the beaver population was high and still is.  I use to take anywhere between 250-300 beaver every year in king county and I did that for 30 years.  The population of these guys I believe is high and always has been.  Just look at who use to trap in King county years ago.  Paul Hatch, Chuck Bailey, Carl Jensen, Tom Mitchel, Fred Lawrence, myself, and quite a few other guys too.  We took large numbers back in the 80's and into the 90's.  I use to have several large contracts in Snohomish county also when I was in business that I did for beaver, here again the population is high in the county too.

I have notice one thing and that is the muskrat population dropped over the years in king county once the nutria started coming back.  Mountain beaver in king county is another problem I dealt with on a regular bases too.  Large pockets of mountain beaver around Seattle.  I know a company that took 234 nutria off of Lake Washington in 30 days.  The nutria has moved from the sound to lake Washington to lake Sammamish and surrounding creeks and ponds.

Otter...........everywhere around King & Snohomish counties.  I was down in King county today and took the back roads home.  Drove up north on route 203 and there are beaver sign everyplace you look.    No shortage here.

Bobcats, coyotes, raccoons, opossums, beaver, river otter, nutria, mountain beaver and even gray squirrels we don't have a shortage up here.    Muskrats................another story.

Maybe in your area it could be several items why you are lacking critters.  One might be logging over the years.  It takes years for wildlife to come back once habitat is lost.  Flooding I think is another one.  You folks get a lot of rain over there compared to other counties.  Mountain lion, could be a problem if there is a large population but I don't think it is all of your problem.
JC   

[nacheshunter]

Over here in most drainages that have been center for restoration projects, I have seen major increases in beavers, muskrats, and a few otters as well.  Since the yakama nation and wdfw started restoring salmon habitat to these areas, there have been quite a few beaver dams erected and creeks dont look the same. I sure wish I trapped for beaver as I could make money, but beavers are essential for restoring the salmon and riparian habitat along rivers and streams.

[Humptulips]

I have actually been seeing a few more beavers in the last couple years.  Makes it kind of interesting walking down the river banks and all the alders have been gnawed to sharp stakes sticking out of the ground.  I don't trap, but I look for beavers for cougar hunting.
As for otters, see a few around; but not nearly like the days when there were more fish.

What part of the OP?
Seems like I'm hearing from agricultural and more populated areas and the beaver are doing fine there.
What I first saw here was no beaver survived in the small creeks where they were accessible to predators and I'm talking far from any people. Be interesting to hear from someone who traps similar area with heavy growth and not many people.

John,
I can't buy the flooding idea. I have seen it pour down rain through the years and it never phased the beavers before. I don't buy disease either. If that was the case it would have been sudden. It has taken 15 years for beaver to collapse here. Over harvest but not by trappers is my guess, Meow!
Funny the deal with Mountain Beaver. I spoke with Trey and he said lots of work killing them near Seattle. I spoke to a guy that does Forestry for a timber company based in GH. He said they have zero problems anymore. I saw a similar thing when I trapped in OR. Old tunnels but nothing fresh. Could be disease or ? We'll never have many cats without them.

Dave, I used to catch a bunch of otter, 73 one year. Spawners just keep going down. Of course the river wasn't filled with gillnets 24/7 back then.

[bearpaw]

We find beaver kills by cougar pretty regular when we are cougar hunting in Idaho and back when I could cougar hunt in Washington we found beaver kills pretty regular too. But I cannot ever remember seeing a colony of beaver wiped out by cougar. I think your big decrease in beaver must involve other factors. Maybe ask a few of those tribal fishermen if they ever catch beaver in their nets? 

[Carp Commander]

Bruce,

I don't have a historic reference but the Columbia Basin seems to be crawling with beavers. The amount of damage complaints I get is crazy. I even find high populations have moved into the canal ditches.

Everywhere I go from farm ponds, canal ditches, golf courses and the main river systems holds beaver and usually a mad farmer because of them.

Beavers have been the reason for some very good land access. Every time I stop and talk to a land owner for permission to trap the first question I get is "Can you trap those damn beavers".

Doug

[onetrapper]

Anecdotally the cougar thing stands out...unpopulated high cat areas with no dog control then shrinking beaver pops... either way WDFW biologists don't care about it.

[Jonathan_S]

Bruce asked about the rural locations, not near farms and towns.

Bruce, I have found a lot of empty beaver ponds and dams that are back in the woods.  I find areas that have sign of beavers 5-10 years ago but nothing now.

[JimmyHoffa]

What part of the OP?
Seems like I'm hearing from agricultural and more populated areas and the beaver are doing fine there.
What I first saw here was no beaver survived in the small creeks where they were accessible to predators and I'm talking far from any people. Be interesting to hear from someone who traps similar area with heavy growth and not many people.

I'm seeing more around the Dickey River, Lake Wentworth, Lake Pleasant, etc. that area.  But since you are looking to connect dots....there is quite a bit of hound hunting out there. 
Also see a few more along the Hoh (not a lot, just more than in the past), but in that area there was an uptick in cougar.  Surprised I hardly find any on the Clearwater, seems like better habitat than all the other areas I mentioned.  I really don't see much for otter at all on the Clearwater these days.  The Hoh used to have a ton.  One fishing hole had thirteen in it one day.  I've watched otters before grab a steelhead or salmon and drag it to the bank and go back in to get another, didn't even eat it--they had about half a dozen and were still going at it.  Do you think fishers, maybe?  The other animal we've seen/heard a lot more are coyotes.