Have corn pond complexes affected your 2018 duck season?

[vandeman17]

[/quote]
My point is without the open water the waterfowl will just continue on the migration and not even stop in the area.And the corn complex should be looked at as additional carrying capacity
[/quote]

And my answer is that is NATURAL and not influenced by man so I would not complain. That is the big difference here. You keep bringing up natural occurrences but what is happening is totally artificial. Before these complexes, we hoped for cold weather up north to push birds here and then hoped it was just cold enough for bigger water to freeze but not so cold everything froze. If it did, tough luck, that's part of the deal. Now, even if everything in the basin freezes up tight, the complexes can stay open and kill birds that would have otherwise left.

[JBG]

Yea it would be pretty simple for them to put a box saying public or private land.  Anyhow this horse seems dead.  I think everyone who is a public land hunter needs to support the groups and politicians who have their best interests at heart.  (Dems are a pain in the ass but I am sure there are very few Republicans that support expansion of government for sportsman benefits in addition to imposing regulations on private entities)

Also as an aside I have access to private land (a west side version of a corn complex)all season long but I am currently boat shopping so I can hunt the big rivers and bays, I guess the grass is always greener 

The state doesn't care where the birds are shot. They want to brag about harvest rates going up even if it is all on private land, that way they get to pat themselves on the back. No politician is good, especially Washington Dems. Just look at the gun laws that get passed every year.

You don't really think hunting fees should be 350 bucks to shoot ducks?

I think most of the new gun laws have been passed via popular vote.  NO fees should not be $350 to shoot ducks but If say the state of WA wanted to buy Rasor Farm and charge $350 a gun for a hunt I would support it. 

[MR5x5]

Can't wait till the feds show up after Oregon claims their Federally managed ducks are being stopped short.

Love me some additional regulations!

Then we'll have something real to bitch about.

[huntnfmly]

My point is without the open water the waterfowl will just continue on the migration and not even stop in the area.And the corn complex should be looked at as additional carrying capacity
[/quote]

And my answer is that is NATURAL and not influenced by man so I would not complain. That is the big difference here. You keep bringing up natural occurrences but what is happening is totally artificial. Before these complexes, we hoped for cold weather up north to push birds here and then hoped it was just cold enough for bigger water to freeze but not so cold everything froze. If it did, tough luck, that's part of the deal. Now, even if everything in the basin freezes up tight, the complexes can stay open and kill birds that would have otherwise left.
[/quote]
I understand what you are saying but do you not agree that the corn complexes could be looked at as more carrying capacity for the area and is good for waterfowl?
  The only reason I brought up naturally occurring things was to point out that the argument against the corn ponds congregating them in 1 area was that it happens anyways and that isn't a valid argument.
 Once again I completely understand everybody's opposition.
The only reason I responded was to express my opinion on taking away other sportsmans way of hunting will hurt us all.
 I have enjoyed the discussion

[EWUeagles]

Yea it would be pretty simple for them to put a box saying public or private land.  Anyhow this horse seems dead.  I think everyone who is a public land hunter needs to support the groups and politicians who have their best interests at heart.  (Dems are a pain in the ass but I am sure there are very few Republicans that support expansion of government for sportsman benefits in addition to imposing regulations on private entities)

Also as an aside I have access to private land (a west side version of a corn complex)all season long but I am currently boat shopping so I can hunt the big rivers and bays, I guess the grass is always greener 

The state doesn't care where the birds are shot. They want to brag about harvest rates going up even if it is all on private land, that way they get to pat themselves on the back. No politician is good, especially Washington Dems. Just look at the gun laws that get passed every year.

You don't really think hunting fees should be 350 bucks to shoot ducks?

I think most of the new gun laws have been passed via popular vote.  NO fees should not be $350 to shoot ducks but If say the state of WA wanted to buy Rasor Farm and charge $350 a gun for a hunt I would support it.

They have been passed by popular vote, it makes me want to move to Idaho. It also doesn't help when Inslee comes out and supports them. Rasor Farm is interesting and I hope the state can actually get it. It's does has a pretty hefty price tag.

[vandeman17]

My point is without the open water the waterfowl will just continue on the migration and not even stop in the area.And the corn complex should be looked at as additional carrying capacity

And my answer is that is NATURAL and not influenced by man so I would not complain. That is the big difference here. You keep bringing up natural occurrences but what is happening is totally artificial. Before these complexes, we hoped for cold weather up north to push birds here and then hoped it was just cold enough for bigger water to freeze but not so cold everything froze. If it did, tough luck, that's part of the deal. Now, even if everything in the basin freezes up tight, the complexes can stay open and kill birds that would have otherwise left.
[/quote]
I understand what you are saying but do you not agree that the corn complexes could be looked at as more carrying capacity for the area and is good for waterfowl?
  The only reason I brought up naturally occurring things was to point out that the argument against the corn ponds congregating them in 1 area was that it happens anyways and that isn't a valid argument.
 Once again I completely understand everybody's opposition.
The only reason I responded was to express my opinion on taking away other sportsmans way of hunting will hurt us all.
 I have enjoyed the discussion
[/quote]

I have enjoyed the discussion as well. If the complexes are good for waterfowl or good for waterfowl hunting are two separate issues and I think the one being discussed here, for the most part, has to do with how it effects hunting. Larger bird numbers overall just means larger bird numbers on the ponds and not in the surrounding areas. Birds that used to migrate here and continue on are now able to stop here and either get killed or get fat on corn and head back north in the spring. If that's good for overall bird health and numbers, I don't know, but for hunting in the area it isn't.

As for taking away from other sportsman, that is not what I am advocating. It is more about closing the loophole of baiting so its an even playing field. Like has been said, add corn to water, illegal, add water to corn, legal. Only in America. 

[JBG]

If a law passed to outlaw flooded corn and I owned Eagle Lakes I would still flood the corn (but not hunt it) and keep the birds on my property.  Then dig out some ponds without corn, plant duck weed and still shoot limits every day aanndd hold thousands of birds.  I guess there is more than one way to skin a cat.  I feel like there is no way to level the playing field other than making the playing field the public land guys are on better.  Private land if managed for ducks will always attract them.

[singleshot12]

I think there should be some sort of a limit to corn patches, say about 1 acre per 100

[full choke]

If a law passed to outlaw flooded corn and I owned Eagle Lakes I would still flood the corn (but not hunt it) and keep the birds on my property.  Then dig out some ponds without corn, plant duck weed and still shoot limits every day aanndd hold thousands of birds.  I guess there is more than one way to skin a cat.  I feel like there is no way to level the playing field other than making the playing field the public land guys are on better.  Private land if managed for ducks will always attract them.

...and you wouldn't shoot many ducks. That is the whole point of why everybody is bitching about the flooded corn ponds. The ducks stay in the corn.
Every corn complex in the state already has habitat like you describe surrounding them- the ducks stay in the corn.
Do you really think any of these big operations would go through the expense/hassle of flooding their corn if it didn't do exactly what everyone says it does?

[92xj]

Ban pumps, gates, hoses, gravity fed water basins, dikes and ditches.

[Timberstalker]

And corn.

[JBG]

If a law passed to outlaw flooded corn and I owned Eagle Lakes I would still flood the corn (but not hunt it) and keep the birds on my property.  Then dig out some ponds without corn, plant duck weed and still shoot limits every day aanndd hold thousands of birds.  I guess there is more than one way to skin a cat.  I feel like there is no way to level the playing field other than making the playing field the public land guys are on better.  Private land if managed for ducks will always attract them.

...and you wouldn't shoot many ducks. That is the whole point of why everybody is bitching about the flooded corn ponds. The ducks stay in the corn.
Every corn complex in the state already has habitat like you describe surrounding them- the ducks stay in the corn.
Do you really think any of these big operations would go through the expense/hassle of flooding their corn if it didn't do exactly what everyone says it does?

You wouldnt shoot ducks?  Ok what i posed was a hypothetical that if you outlawed hunting flooded corn the complexes would still flood it but not hunt it.  They would shoot the ducks staying on the property on other water without corn.  Ducks move around a lot Im sure the clubs would still slay.

[JBG]

And corn.

NO CORN FOR YOU!

[cougforester]

Someone has something you want. You can't or won't work to get it, so let's remove it as an option for everyone else. My word.

Let's apply the same logic to something else. I can't afford /don't want to spend the money on a Nightforce scope. Let's ban them since I can't have it. I want to hunt a bunch of out of state tags but can't afford to do that. No more out of state tags! I can't afford to spend $10k to have someone plant a bunch of corn on my land. So let's ban it for everyone!

Come on you guys. You give somebody an inch, they take a mile. Don't remove opportunities for others to have simply because you're being selfish and want more opportunities for yourself. This is a way bigger issue than simply wanting to shoot another bird or two every time you go out into the marsh.

[Mfowl]

Someone has something you want. You can't or won't work to get it, so let's remove it as an option for everyone else. My word.

Let's apply the same logic to something else. I can't afford /don't want to spend the money on a Nightforce scope. Let's ban them since I can't have it. I want to hunt a bunch of out of state tags but can't afford to do that. No more out of state tags! I can't afford to spend $10k to have someone plant a bunch of corn on my land. So let's ban it for everyone!

Come on you guys. You give somebody an inch, they take a mile. Don't remove opportunities for others to have simply because you're being selfish and want more opportunities for yourself. This is a way bigger issue than simply wanting to shoot another bird or two every time you go out into the marsh.

I wouldn't make the argument to ban Nightforce scopes because I can't or won't afford one and someone els will. Someone could make the argument that long range hunting is not sporting or even unethical and then we could carry on and on about it.
As for corn ponds, I don't see any private owners expressing any remorse over taking opportunity away from the public land guy. Just greedily hogging a public resource for their own profit. I don't have a problem with naturally occuring sheet water in a corn field or flood events creating a great opportunity for someone. I do have a problem with manipulating a public resource for profit while diminishing it for others.