.270 AR Build

[konradcountry]

i wouldn’t say no one is shooting deer that far. Most cant/won’t shoot deer that far.  There are many reasons for wanting that extra performance.

Yes I am sure there is some jerkwad that will pot shot at any range.

But even 600 is too far for those rounds. They suffer from burnout and drop/get pushed around too much.

[Jolten]

i wouldn’t say no one is shooting deer that far. Most cant/won’t shoot deer that far.  There are many reasons for wanting that extra performance.

Yes I am sure there is some jerkwad that will pot shot at any range.

But even 600 is too far for those rounds. They suffer from burnout and drop/get pushed around too much.

Not to pick a fight but based on what data is it too far?

[Jolten]

Yorken loaded his .270AR for an impact test with the following specs. Field and Stream disputed the 1000 ft lb to ethically kill a deer a few years back claiming they had many quick kills with 500 ft lb at impact.

117gr Hammer Hunter .167bc (G7)
- Muzzle velocity 2732 fps
Hits the 500lb mark at roughly 550 yards.


I know a few people on here who could make that shot center shoulder without problems. Is this a personal opinion based on your limits and experience, or am I missing something?

[jpharcher]

Yes, I am the proud owner of the Yorketransport 270AR and I love it, shoots GREAT, love forming the brass to make the cases. I have not stretched it out like yorke's thought.

[jasnt]

Yorken loaded his .270AR for an impact test with the following specs. Field and Stream disputed the 1000 ft lb to ethically kill a deer a few years back claiming they had many quick kills with 500 ft lb at impact.

117gr Hammer Hunter .167bc (G7)
- Muzzle velocity 2732 fps
Hits the 500lb mark at roughly 550 yards.


I know a few people on here who could make that shot center shoulder without problems. Is this a personal opinion based on your limits and experience, or am I missing something?

this is how I perceived his post as well but I get that so often I may have been on auto defense

[konradcountry]

Yorken loaded his .270AR for an impact test with the following specs. Field and Stream disputed the 1000 ft lb to ethically kill a deer a few years back claiming they had many quick kills with 500 ft lb at impact.

117gr Hammer Hunter .167bc (G7)
- Muzzle velocity 2732 fps
Hits the 500lb mark at roughly 550 yards.

I know a few people on here who could make that shot center shoulder without problems. Is this a personal opinion based on your limits and experience, or am I missing something?

The problem is wind drift, not ability. No one here can predict small wind gusts at that range.

I own a 6.8 upper but a wally world $250 308 will kick the crap out of it at that range. These 6.x bullets in the AR run out of gas and get pushed around too easily.

[yorketransport]

For those who aren't familiar with the 270 AR, it's not the same as a 270 win. The only similarities are the bore diameter and the case head size. It's much closer to a 270/6mm Dasher. This is a 270 Win on the left, formed 270 AR in the middle and the 6.5 Creedmoor parent case on the right.


Here's a thread that I had going while I was working on the project.
https://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,205077.0.html

That gun would have been very capable of killing deer out to 450-500 yards with a couple different bullets. It was a decent LR plinker out to about 900 yards which is where it went sub-sonic with the 135gr SMK at 2630 fps. Once it got to 950 yards the bullets settled back down but required a custom drag curve to calculate drops. I still made a fair number of solid hits on a 16" gong at 1200 yards with it though.

It's a great chambering in the AR-15 and offers very quantifiable advantages over something like the 6.5 Grendel or 6.8 SPC at pretty much any range as a hunting cartridge. A 150-200 fps difference is VERY significant in the field. Plus the larger case capacity of the of the 270 AR makes it better suited to use the 130gr hunting bullets. Some folks like using the light weight 110-115gr bullets in the 6.8 SPC, but a 130gr bullet offers very different terminal performance which many (myself included) prefer.

Yes I am sure there is some jerkwad that will pot shot at any range.

But even 600 is too far for those rounds. They suffer from burnout and drop/get pushed around too much.

JDhasty, is that you? This sounds like a comment that's based on more opinion than fact or first hand experience. If I'm wrong, please correct me. There are a lot of folks who consider 5-600 yards medium range and have the skill to back that up. It sounds like those ranges are outside of your comfort/skill zone, so it's good that you're at least willing to acknowledge that.

[yorketransport]

The problem is wind drift, not ability. No one here can predict small wind gusts at that range.

I own a 6.8 upper but a wally world $250 308 will kick the crap out of it at that range. These 6.x bullets in the AR run out of gas and get pushed around too easily.

A little practice and the right loads make a big difference. If you're shooting 115gr factory loads in the 6.8 SPC then yes, the wind is going to beat you up pretty bad. Shoot that same bullet faster or a bullet with a higher BC at the same velocity and you'll start to see where something like the 270 AR has a pretty clear advantage.

[Jolten]

The problem is wind drift, not ability. No one here can predict small wind gusts at that range.

I own a 6.8 upper but a wally world $250 308 will kick the crap out of it at that range. These 6.x bullets in the AR run out of gas and get pushed around too easily.

A little practice and the right loads make a big difference. If you're shooting 115gr factory loads in the 6.8 SPC then yes, the wind is going to beat you up pretty bad. Shoot that same bullet faster or a bullet with a higher BC at the same velocity and you'll start to see where something like the 270 AR has a pretty clear advantage.

I was hoping you'd chime in

[konradcountry]

JDhasty, is that you? This sounds like a comment that's based on more opinion than fact or first hand experience. If I'm wrong, please correct me. There are a lot of folks who consider 5-600 yards medium range and have the skill to back that up. It sounds like those ranges are outside of your comfort/skill zone, so it's good that you're at least willing to acknowledge that.

Like I said it runs out of gas and get pushed around too easily. So you might take it out and hit steel at 600. Right, good job. But that's not the point. The point is that a small gust of wind can push that bullet and knock the teeth out of the deer or gut shot it. It's too vulnerable to wind at that range and skill doesn't change that.

I'm not the first person to point this out. The drift is actually worse than the 223
https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2015/04/04/not-so-special-a-critical-view-of-the-6-8mm-spc/

You can't treat these rounds like they are full rifle rounds. They are in-between and this shows up in wind drift.

Again I have one downstairs. But it's not a 600 yard deer rifle. Would be fine for combat at 600 because at that range any hit is a success.

[yorketransport]

Like I said it runs out of gas and get pushed around too easily. So you might take it out and hit steel at 600. Right, good job. But that's not the point. The point is that a small gust of wind can push that bullet and knock the teeth out of the deer or gut shot it. It's too vulnerable to wind at that range and skill doesn't change that.

I'm not the first person to point this out. The drift is actually worse than the 223
https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2015/04/04/not-so-special-a-critical-view-of-the-6-8mm-spc/

You can't treat these rounds like they are full rifle rounds. They are in-between and this shows up in wind drift.

Again I have one downstairs. But it's not a 600 yard deer rifle. Would be fine for combat at 600 because at that range any hit is a success.

I agree that the 6.8 SPC isn't a 5-600 yard deer cartridge and I don't think anyone is really disagreeing with you, but that's where the advantage goes to the larger 270 AR. Better bullets at higher velocity offer very meaningful advantages at all ranges. Look at the differences between a 110gr Accubond at about 2550 fps (a very realistic performance value) from a 6.8 SPC compared to a 130gr Accubond at 2630 fps (an actual load from my 18" 270 AR barrel) from something like the 270 AR. A bullet with a significantly higher BC combined with a modest increase in velocity makes a big difference in trajectory and energy.

The problem with mid to long range shooting is that there's a lot of misleading information out there on both sides of the discussion. For every person who says that shooting 1000 yards can be done with a 223 and $200 optic, there's somebody else who states that it takes thousands of dollars worth of equipment and years of training to make the same shot. The whole situation just gets compounded when you're dealing with the capabilities of a wildcat or uncommon chambering like the 270 AR here. You're making a judgment based on the experience you have which is based on the ballistically inferior 6.8 SPC. Those of us (a relatively small number) who have considerable experience with the 270 AR can attest to the significant performance differences between the two. First hand experience will always trump theoretical data. I'm not trying put you down, I'm just trying to bring a little bit of reality to the discussion based on actual first hand data and experience based on my time working with both the 6.8 SPC and the 270 AR side by side in comparable guns.

[konradcountry]

You're making a judgment based on the experience you have which is based on the ballistically inferior 6.8 SPC. Those of us (a relatively small number) who have considerable experience with the 270 AR can attest to the significant performance differences between the two. First hand experience will always trump theoretical data.

No I'm making a point based on the limits of this platform.

First hand experience can not trump the physical limits of bullets or the AR-15.

You can't break that AR-15 wall which is why there are trade-offs with all these bullets.

Hunting at 5 or 600 yards is a can of worms in itself because of wind drift. But I would not use an AR-15 in that scenario because there are better tools for the job. Well that goes back to my first point which is that I wouldn't use a wildcat for typical hunting ranges since like I said the deer wouldn't notice the difference. Actually has nothing to do with 270 or 6.8 specifically. Wildcats come with their own trade-offs for better or worse.

[Jolten]

You're making a judgment based on the experience you have which is based on the ballistically inferior 6.8 SPC. Those of us (a relatively small number) who have considerable experience with the 270 AR can attest to the significant performance differences between the two. First hand experience will always trump theoretical data.

No I'm making a point based on the limits of this platform.

First hand experience can not trump the physical limits of bullets or the AR-15.

You can't break that AR-15 wall which is why there are trade-offs with all these bullets.

Hunting at 5 or 600 yards is a can of worms in itself because of wind drift. But I would not use an AR-15 in that scenario because there are better tools for the job. Well that goes back to my first point which is that I wouldn't use a wildcat for typical hunting ranges since like I said the deer wouldn't notice the difference. Actually has nothing to do with 270 or 6.8 specifically. Wildcats come with their own trade-offs for better or worse.

Where are the limits of the ar15 platform set? Any hard evidence? I know a few ar15 platforms and calibers have won 1000yard competitions.

[jasnt]

Just for fun I ran the load yorke posted at 600 yards. 5mph wind from 3 o’clock and my typical atmospherics

[CoryTDF]

Look into the 6.8 SPC. It shoots a .277" bullet and i have friends that love shooting deer with them. the only problem is they are relatively proprietary with uppers, lowers and mags.

HATE this round. Daughter had awful luck with this while deer hunting. She center punched a whitetail doe and we had no blood. Watched the footage about 1000 times and it was a solid hit. We never found the deer. Few days later she shot another doe and same luck with blood trail. Luckily we found that deer by grid searching. I bought her a 6.5 Creedmore the next day and have never looked back.  I would rather use a friggin sling shot than a 6.8SPC!