what do you consider your max range?

[usmc74]

I'm shooting the Barnes 290 TMZ over 110 gr T7 3F.

I have 2 dead elk, 1 shot kills in the same bedding area (4 years apart).  Neither elk moved after hit,

My max is 150 yd., these 2 were 68 and 100 yards

[Karl Blanchard]

with muzzy bigger weights are better. When we were a all lead state, I shot 440-460gr bullets. With todays newer bullets I still try to stay around 300 gr. I shoot the 290gr barnes.

  gone are the days of a big pancaked hunk of lead stuck to the off side hide. I get pass throughs almost always on deer.  Elk are a different beast. There is a lot more mass there for a bullet to find it's way through. They may be a bigger target so easier to put a good shot on but they are also significantly harder to kill than a deer.  My max distance is farther on deer than elk for that reason.

[TikkaT3-270Shortmag]

270 grain powerbelt platinum and 100 grains of powder.  Dropped my bull at 80 yards.  150 max for me

[Moe the Sleaze]

75-80 yds max for me.  I shoot a pretty short-barreled carbine.  But more than anything, I'm limited by my eyes and the open sights.

[yorketransport]

with muzzy bigger weights are better. When we were a all lead state, I shot 440-460gr bullets. With todays newer bullets I still try to stay around 300 gr. I shoot the 290gr barnes.

For elk I'm in the 300ish grain group too.  I feel 250 is too light. When I was shooting lead I was closer to 350 grains.

That's always been my opinion on muzzle loader projectiles. I just couldn't get good groups with the 300+ gr bullets I tried; groups were closer to 4" at 100 yards. I really wanted some of the hardcast 454 bullets to work for me but it just hasn't happened. Even the 290gr Barnes bullets were pretty bad.

[Dan-o]

with muzzy bigger weights are better. When we were a all lead state, I shot 440-460gr bullets. With todays newer bullets I still try to stay around 300 gr. I shoot the 290gr barnes.

For elk I'm in the 300ish grain group too.  I feel 250 is too light. When I was shooting lead I was closer to 350 grains.

That's always been my opinion on muzzle loader projectiles. I just couldn't get good groups with the 300+ gr bullets I tried; groups were closer to 4" at 100 yards. I really wanted some of the hardcast 454 bullets to work for me but it just hasn't happened. Even the 290gr Barnes bullets were pretty bad.

I shoot a 400 grain Harvester hardcast lead for elk.

They are 45 cal, and you use a sabot.

Passthrough's are the norm.   Makes the short tracking jobs pretty easy.   :-)

[dilleytech]

with muzzy bigger weights are better. When we were a all lead state, I shot 440-460gr bullets. With todays newer bullets I still try to stay around 300 gr. I shoot the 290gr barnes.

  gone are the days of a big pancaked hunk of lead stuck to the off side hide. I get pass throughs almost always on deer.  Elk are a different beast. There is a lot more mass there for a bullet to find it's way through. They may be a bigger target so easier to put a good shot on but they are also significantly harder to kill than a deer.  My max distance is farther on deer than elk for that reason.

What’s your preferred place to hit an animal with these new bullets? I always aimed for lung but have heard guys say to aim for shoulder with muzzys?

[slowhand]

with muzzy bigger weights are better. When we were a all lead state, I shot 440-460gr bullets. With todays newer bullets I still try to stay around 300 gr. I shoot the 290gr barnes.

  gone are the days of a big pancaked hunk of lead stuck to the off side hide. I get pass throughs almost always on deer.  Elk are a different beast. There is a lot more mass there for a bullet to find it's way through. They may be a bigger target so easier to put a good shot on but they are also significantly harder to kill than a deer.  My max distance is farther on deer than elk for that reason.

This would be a new one on Me. I have always been taught to shoot for the vitals with every weapon. Heart, lungs, liver?
What’s your preferred place to hit an animal with these new bullets? I always aimed for lung but have heard guys say to aim for shoulder with muzzys?

[Karl Blanchard]

with muzzy bigger weights are better. When we were a all lead state, I shot 440-460gr bullets. With todays newer bullets I still try to stay around 300 gr. I shoot the 290gr barnes.

  gone are the days of a big pancaked hunk of lead stuck to the off side hide. I get pass throughs almost always on deer.  Elk are a different beast. There is a lot more mass there for a bullet to find it's way through. They may be a bigger target so easier to put a good shot on but they are also significantly harder to kill than a deer.  My max distance is farther on deer than elk for that reason.

What’s your preferred place to hit an animal with these new bullets? I always aimed for lung but have heard guys say to aim for shoulder with muzzys?

I stay away from shoulders. Not that the weapon won't perform but for the simple reason that a braised shoulder roast in the Dutch oven is one of the best cuts on an animal. It's right up there with neck and shanks😍

[M_ray]

You're over thinking it. A 250gr+ anything has plenty of pop at 150 yards. Never shot the Barnes, but shot 30 or so critters with a muzzy with probably close to a dozen projectiles. What powder charge?

What Karl said ...


250 grn shockwave, 100grn loose tripple 7 fffg, #11 cap ... 200yard pass through double lung 

[dilleytech]

with muzzy bigger weights are better. When we were a all lead state, I shot 440-460gr bullets. With todays newer bullets I still try to stay around 300 gr. I shoot the 290gr barnes.

  gone are the days of a big pancaked hunk of lead stuck to the off side hide. I get pass throughs almost always on deer.  Elk are a different beast. There is a lot more mass there for a bullet to find it's way through. They may be a bigger target so easier to put a good shot on but they are also significantly harder to kill than a deer.  My max distance is farther on deer than elk for that reason.

What’s your preferred place to hit an animal with these new bullets? I always aimed for lung but have heard guys say to aim for shoulder with muzzys?

I stay away from shoulders. Not that the weapon won't perform but for the simple reason that a braised shoulder roast in the Dutch oven is one of the best cuts on an animal. It's right up there with neck and shanks😍

I do love me some shanks and would have a hard time ever aiming at meat.

[Sabotloader]

First off, this is my first year seriously hunting with a muzzy, so I'm still very new to these things. I'm just curious what everyone considers a good max range with their equipment. I'm confident that I can make solid hits to about 150 yards off of my shooting sticks with the peep sights on the gun. I've been plinking at my 10" gong at that range all summer, so I'm feeling pretty good about it. In reality I've put 100 yards as my max on a critter just because I'm not familiar enough with terminal performance of muzzleloader bullets.

Under the right conditions and with the sight setup that I am using I have no problem shooting deer at 150 yards and elk out to 200.  But! everything has got to be right for me to extend that far with open sights - especially with what 'mother nature' might be offering.  Because of that I have placed sights on my rifle that gives me the illusions that I shooting through a scope - even though it is like 1X scope.  I use a Williams FP Peep sight with 1/4 min clicks just like a scope and hood covered front sight that provides the look that I am shooting through a scope.





This setup will not work for everyone but it sure is nice for me.

I've done some testing with both the 250gr Barnes T-EZ and the 275gr Traditions Smackdown, which both shoot equally well for me, and I'm not convinced that I really like how they perform. The Traditions bullet expanded well at 100 yards when shot into my wet leather bullet trap but didn't penetrate that well. The Barnes bullets actually penetrated less, which surprised me. All the guys I know who're using a muzzy for elk swear by the Barnes bullet and they've got animals on the ground to back up their support. I just haven't been impressed with their penetration though. I trust the opinions of the guys who recommended the Barnes to me though, so that's what I'm going with. Honestly, I would have preferred if my gun would have shot a heavy, hardcast bullet well but that just didn't happen.

My thinking is that muzzle loaders are comparable to a big revolver. I'm very comfortable with a 454, 480, 475 or 500 caliber handgun shooting hardcast bullets at animals up to the size of an elk out to 100 yards. I'm not a big fan of shooting critters that far with expanding bullets like the Barnes, which has worked well in the past out of handguns on smaller critters like deer and bear. When I'd deer hunting I have the 480 loaded with the 275gr XPB, when I'm elk hunting I use a 410gr hard cast bullet.

Now I'm questioning my bullet choices for elk hunting with a muzzy. I actually passed on a shot at a bear yesterday because I didn't feel like the gun was up to it. It was a small-medium sized bear probably around 150#. I spotted it about 150 yards away while deer hunting with the muzzy. If I had any of my other rifles it would have been a dead bear! I worked my way up to about 80 yards away before I ran out of cover and would have been left just out in the open. The problem was that the bear was feeding his way up to the tree line and was at a hard quartering away angle on the other side of a deep creek bed. There was no way for me to get a better angle for the shot and I sat there with this bear in my sights for almost 2 minutes before he hit the timber and disappeared. I would have taken that shot with my iron sighted 480 revolver and never hesitated but I just wasn't confident that I could get a good hit to the vitals at that range with the muzzle loader. It's a different story when I can get a quick follow up shot, but it was a no go for me know that I only had one chance to get a good hit.

After that I just kept thinking that if I'm hesitant to stick a bear with one of these bullets at 80 yards, how deep can I count on it reliably penetrate on an elk if I get a shot at 75-100 yards?

I would suggest you look at the Lehigh Defense site. Look for the muzzle loading bullet labeled .452x265CF.  This is the bullet I use during regular rifle season in a muzzleloader.  The bullet shoots with extremely good accuracy and has a top notch 'Terminal Velocity'.  While it looks like a normal solid copper expanding hollow point it really works on a completely different theory (it is German Technology utilizing 'controlled fracturing' and bullet pass through).  I really like the bullet to make two holes.  The way this bullet works is when the bullet contacts liquid mass the 6 petals open to 40* then break off and move out puncturing organs in the chest cavity.  The rest of the bullet (and the bulk of the bullet weight) continues its path through the animal cutting and creating a big shock of 'Hydrostatic Pressure' in the chest cavity. Then finally passes through and out of the opposite side of the animal (blood letting opening).



Here is a calculated ballistic sheet that shows what the bullet can do.



From the sheet you can see the bullet has enough velocity and energy to work on elk beyond 200 yards.

[RobinHoodlum]

I've been hunting with a muzzleloader for four seasons. I shoot the Barnes 250 grain TMZ 100 grain of T7 and practice qute a bit. I have killed three mule deer bucks and one cow elk at ranges up to 170 yds.
A couple years ago I drew a quality buck and decided I wanted to be more confident at longer ranges. I kept getting loose and inconsistent groups between 150 and 200 yds. A co-worker advised that I use a ballistics calculator to better understand my trajectory. While I knew what my bullet drop was, I learned wind at those longer ranges was a much bigger issue than I fathomed.
I urge those considering shooting beyond 100 yds to check into this. My max range is now 150 yds, but only under ideal conditions and with a super solid rest.

[ctwiggs1]

+1 for the LeHigh. Those things really do work as advertised.

[JimmyHoffa]

Yeah, they had an offshoot with the knight bloodline series.  The bloodlines I had were 275 grain, the new CF are 265.  Because the bloodlines were discontinued I now use the CF.
Anyways, with the bloodlines:  I lined up eight gallon jugs full of water in a row and shot them.  The first two jugs basically exploded and I could tell the petals had ripped off and kept going into the third jug.  The main core of the bullet finally came to rest in the seventh jug.