Were wolves imported into Washington on the downlow?

[buckfvr]

My cousin took video of 21 in a pack up the Little Wood river in Idaho the winter before it was opened up for hunting. They were working together killing the deer wintering there. pretty brutal.

Total uneducated opinion here

I believe the more food available the bigger the packs get

I also believe the same as I have seen evidence of ALL predators being in abundance where prey was profound.

[Buckhunter24]

Idahohunter, what is your opinion of CNW? What is your opinion of former wdfw employees working for them? Are you familiar with their approach regarding natural resources?

CNW - Not my cup of tea...I'm sure they have some decent staff and I'm sure they have staff and members I'd not be well aligned with. They claim to support hunting but I do not believe its a core concern of theirs.  One of their staff posts here occasionally and he seems reasonable.

My opinion of WDFW employees (former and current) is not real positive - its probably one of the worst run/managed/operated state f&w agencies in the west - so who they go work for once they leave WDFW isn't anything I care about.  I'm not that familiar with CNW's approach regarding natural resources - they probably have more influence on wolf issues than many other E. Wa orgs and citizens and I'm sure they've done projects that are beneficial to fish and wildlife...but I'm sure they have a lot of issues, projects, positions I would vehemently disagree with.

The real question...what's a guy in St. Maries worried about CNW for?  Not many CNW events in your neck of the woods!  Used to buy a lot of motorcycles and chainsaws from Charlies saw shop - I know its got a new name now, not sure if Eddie (Charlie's boy) still owns it or if he sold though?

I move around the inland for work. Have spent a lot of time in a lot of areas from tonasket to kalispell and as far south as cascade the last couple decades.

I am biased on the subject, I dislike the impact of wolves on ungulates because I like hunting. So I am sure I am looking for something to blame it on, but there are some things that dont fully add up to me.

What is the reason for the sudden expansion of the wolves territories and populations? Its established that wolves will travel many miles, so why werent they exploding in population in NE Wa prior to recent years? There is no break in habitat from Canada down and wolves were relatively heavily populated there for the last century right?

[KFhunter]

Oh Oh I know! pick me! pick me!       

[buckfvr]

Also, theres any number of places they could release in Idaho right at a gate to Wa.     A technicality Im sure they are capable of abusing.  They being the folks behind the Idaho releases.

[msg]

KFhunter hit the nail on the head with the word mistrust. I have not talked to anyone out fishing or hunting for years that is happy with WDFW.
1 Unchecked large predators at the top of the list.
2 Hoof rot. Hopefully some movement will come from the independent study out of WSU.
3 Columbia River endorsement to pay for more and expanded opportunities. What a joke that was!
4 Severely cut hatchery plants but remove limits on warm water fish to save steelhead and salmon.
5 The list goes on and on !

[fireweed]

I wanted to vote none of the above.
The question isn't really worded correctly.
Even if they were not dropped into Washington on the sly, No, the wolves did not arrive here "naturally".  That would mean nobody, anywhere, did any translocation and they came in from long-existing packs in Canada completely on their own.  We know that is incorrect because Canadian Wolves were released in Idaho and Yellowstone providing another way for them to get to  Wash..

[ThomMedic]

Back about 2000, while setup at Lake Beth for a veterans' stand-down a couple for whom I had a lot of respect for from Tonasket shared a story that happened a short while before. They had received a phone call from some of the neighbors who seen an odd event happening. So when they went down to the area to see for themselves, they observed state employees (I don't remember which agency) releasing large canine looking animals from wheeled culverts. When they questioned the workers why they were releasing wolves, they were told they were relocating coyotes. 

The couple, especially the wife was highly disgusted with the workers for thinking they were too stupid to know the difference between the species and for being so dishonest.

[Bango skank]

Every single person who has a story, it was alwsys "somebody i knew" or "somebody i knew's relative."  Ive had a couple occasions where multiple people have told me the same story, with them being the ones involved.  Human nature being what it is, people like telling stories and will tend to embellish a bit and fudge a few facts, often making themselves a prominent person in the story.  Pretty much every story about this is 2 or 3 parties removed.  This is how urban legends come to life.  People passing on stories that arent theres, but making it theirs by a ittle tweak here and there.

[buckfvr]

Been too many of these stories over the years for them to all be contrived.  Then on another note, the word "relocated" brings to mind that no, wdfw would not be guilty of importing them if the were initially released just inside the Idaho border only to be trapped just inside the Wa. border for "relocation".

Think sleaze bag politicians and agenda driven groups/agencies, and its easy for me at least to let my mind wonder in the gray area between true and not true, did they and didnt they, and what they said and what we heard.

[idahohuntr]

Well I'm about wrapped up done with this thread,  I got my vote and nearly 70% of Washington hunters think wolves had some help. 

If you think this poll is reflective of anything more than hunt-wa members who actively participate in wolf threads...well, let's just say some democrats running for POTUS would love to hire you! 

[Twispriver]

I voted no. I don't believe there was a secret conspiracy to release wolves in Washington but I also believe the Clinton's don't have people killed, Michelle Obama is a woman and Epstien killed himself.
It's been an interesting read but maybe the thread should be renamed "Tall Tales About Wolves - Add Yours Here" 

[KFhunter]

Well I'm about wrapped up done with this thread,  I got my vote and nearly 70% of Washington hunters think wolves had some help. 

If you think this poll is reflective of anything more than hunt-wa members who actively participate in wolf threads...well, let's just say some democrats running for POTUS would love to hire you! 

I'll tell you what else I got out of this poll..

5 years or so ago you had a lot of credibility. We joined HW at about the same time and started arguing about wolves pretty much right off the bat.  I joined HW to tell everyone what I was seeing with wolves.  I always felt that you joined HW to assuage everyone's fear and misdirect what wolves were doing.  That put us at odds immediately, me sharing my personal observations, and you pitching the narrative of wolf huggers and derailing all the threads you could.

You've never once in all these years had a wolf observation of your own, never once have you ever witnessed anything regarding wolves, never came across a carcass and never surrounded or howled at.  I have, how could you do anything but pitch the narrative?  How could you do anything but minimize those who've actually dealt with wolves?  who'se seen the carnage?     
The closest thing you've ever come to a wolf interaction was this Sarah Palin'sh comment: "I live in the blues so I see things from my front porch"  ouch. That was cringe worthy. 


It was super frustrating because people listened to what you said including most of the mods and more prominent posters.

But now, members that used to listen to you are now some of your biggest detractors.  You've lost most all of your credibility and very few listen to you anymore. 
Your outed as an antagonistic shill and wolf lover who sneers and disdains HWrs while you pretend at being moderate, pretend at being a hunter. 

You derail any threads about wolves, any threads about conservation northwest, and any threads about backcountry hunters & anglers...and you do so with the most contempt possible, pushing the boundaries on personal attacks as far as you think you can get away with. 

Belittling, bashing, personal attacks and derailing threads will only be tolerated so long, and you'll be gone.  I'm amazed you're here now, calling Boneaddict a coward and all. 

[HUNTIN4SIX]

Not sure if it has been said....but ask a Spokane tribal member if wolves were planted.  Many of them have a good story that goes back to about the time they introduced elk and it pissed of the department.....lots more to that story.   

[emac]

Well I'm about wrapped up done with this thread,  I got my vote and nearly 70% of Washington hunters think wolves had some help. 

If you think this poll is reflective of anything more than hunt-wa members who actively participate in wolf threads...well, let's just say some democrats running for POTUS would love to hire you! 

I'll tell you what else I got out of this poll..

5 years or so ago you had a lot of credibility. We joined HW at about the same time and started arguing about wolves pretty much right off the bat.  I joined HW to tell everyone what I was seeing with wolves.  I always felt that you joined HW to assuage everyone's fear and misdirect what wolves were doing.  That put us at odds immediately, me sharing my personal observations, and you pitching the narrative of wolf huggers and derailing all the threads you could.

You've never once in all these years had a wolf observation of your own, never once have you ever witnessed anything regarding wolves, never came across a carcass and never surrounded or howled at.  I have, how could you do anything but pitch the narrative?  How could you do anything but minimize those who've actually dealt with wolves?  who'se seen the carnage?     
The closest thing you've ever come to a wolf interaction was this Sarah Palin'sh comment: "I live in the blues so I see things from my front porch"  ouch. That was cringe worthy. 


It was super frustrating because people listened to what you said including most of the mods and more prominent posters.

But now, members that used to listen to you are now some of your biggest detractors.  You've lost most all of your credibility and very few listen to you anymore. 
Your outed as an antagonistic shill and wolf lover who sneers and disdains HWrs while you pretend at being moderate, pretend at being a hunter. 

You derail any threads about wolves, any threads about conservation northwest, and any threads about backcountry hunters & anglers...and you do so with the most contempt possible, pushing the boundaries on personal attacks as far as you think you can get away with. 

Belittling, bashing, personal attacks and derailing threads will only be tolerated so long, and you'll be gone.  I'm amazed you're here now, calling Boneaddict a coward and all.

Excellent post and from what i have read 100% accurate

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

[idahohuntr]

Idahohunter, what is your opinion of CNW? What is your opinion of former wdfw employees working for them? Are you familiar with their approach regarding natural resources?

CNW - Not my cup of tea...I'm sure they have some decent staff and I'm sure they have staff and members I'd not be well aligned with. They claim to support hunting but I do not believe its a core concern of theirs.  One of their staff posts here occasionally and he seems reasonable.

My opinion of WDFW employees (former and current) is not real positive - its probably one of the worst run/managed/operated state f&w agencies in the west - so who they go work for once they leave WDFW isn't anything I care about.  I'm not that familiar with CNW's approach regarding natural resources - they probably have more influence on wolf issues than many other E. Wa orgs and citizens and I'm sure they've done projects that are beneficial to fish and wildlife...but I'm sure they have a lot of issues, projects, positions I would vehemently disagree with.

The real question...what's a guy in St. Maries worried about CNW for?  Not many CNW events in your neck of the woods!  Used to buy a lot of motorcycles and chainsaws from Charlies saw shop - I know its got a new name now, not sure if Eddie (Charlie's boy) still owns it or if he sold though?

I move around the inland for work. Have spent a lot of time in a lot of areas from tonasket to kalispell and as far south as cascade the last couple decades.

I am biased on the subject, I dislike the impact of wolves on ungulates because I like hunting. So I am sure I am looking for something to blame it on, but there are some things that dont fully add up to me.

What is the reason for the sudden expansion of the wolves territories and populations? Its established that wolves will travel many miles, so why werent they exploding in population in NE Wa prior to recent years? There is no break in habitat from Canada down and wolves were relatively heavily populated there for the last century right?

The timing coincides perfectly with the reintroduction of wolves in Idaho.  Adding a second and maybe larger, more direct source population makes sense to me as to why we've seen a boom in numbers in Wa.  I'm not aware of any credible evidence to support the transplant theory and I dont know of any other theories...sometimes the simple explanation is the right one.